Other floats mocked UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson and Brexit, climate activist Greta Thunberg, and Jesus Christ on the cross. There were also people parading in Nazi SS uniform...
[S]ome caricature Jews posed with a mock-up of the Western Wall - often called Jerusalem's Wailing Wall, a holy site for Jews. It was labelled "the wailing ant", in Dutch "de klaugmier". The Dutch for "wailing wall" is "klaagmuur".
"This doesn't encourage anti-Semitism; the reaction last year was over the top," Mr Van den Bossche said. "Two hundred percent it's not anti-Semitic."
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"It's our humour... just fun... It's our parade, our humour, people can do whatever they want. It's a weekend of freedom of speech."
Said Peter Van den Bossche, the mayor of Aalst, Belgium, quoted in "Belgian city of Aalst says anti-Semitic parade 'just fun'/A Belgian city has defended as 'just fun' a carnival featuring caricatures of Orthodox Jews wearing huge fur hats, long fake noses and ant costumes" (BBC).
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They might be making fun of triggers, in fact from the others it looks like it.
So they'd be making fun of Althouse too.
what's the difference between Muslims and Jews?
Muslims will KILL YOU if you insult them
of course
Muslims might well KILL YOU even if you Don't insult them
I guess the Real difference is: Muslims will KILL YOU
Mocking Greta Thunberg is a righteous activity, so they’ve got that going for them... And speaking of a carnival: Joyeux Mardi Gras! ⚜️
speaking of humor, and speaking of making fun of people...
Jo Biden asks for out help
he is "running for the United States Senate" and that if they don't like him they can "vote for the other Biden."
It seems that there was an offensive float in last year's parade. UNESCO began to investigate, and the town told UNESCO to revoke the town's cultural heritage, which UNESCO did. It seems that this year's parade is the town's response.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-47454415
One question is, how does a town stop being a cultural heritage site?
If only Obama were still President.
We could go to him and he’d tell us what to think about this.
I dunno. Euro Christians have a long history. It looks pretty much like standard built-in Euro anti-Semitism to me. But then, my ancestors had to run out of that place so I could be here now. So my radar is always up.
Nazi SS uniforms
I thought the SS guys wore pants instead of clown wigs.
The back of the no-pants "uniforms" says "UNESTAPO" because they don't like UNESCO.
UNESTAPO, it says on the Nazi-like armbands, so Rory is right about the context: this year's parade is in part reacting to UNESCO deciding to withdraw some cultural heritage status of the annual parade. On the one hand, it is unseemly to see Europeans mocking Jews using classical antisemitic stereotypes. On the other hand, Belgium has a significant community of ultra-Orthodox Jews, many in the diamond business or related industry, who more or less, but more, resemble that caricature. That's a community of Jews that other Jews show a particular bigotry towards, too. Jewish humor is also not known for its sensitivity to stereotypes racial, cultural or otherwise, which it mines for laughs. I'll take the mayor at his word regarding the intent of the event, but yes, Europeans tend towards a resentment towards Jews--tend strongly. Europeans can be antisemitic and this parade can be a humorously intended sendup of all "others" without any particular rancor towards one brand of them, and indicative more of a local pride and provincialism than dangerous bigotry.
If you fly to Flemish Belgium, in particular Antwerp, chances are you will have folks on that plane wearing Streimels and/or black hats, dark suits and other raiments reminiscent of 18th century European garb, whose notions of personal hygiene are of a similar vintage. Noticing and mocking the peculiarities of that community is not allowed? If that's antisemitic in itself, most New Yorkers, Jews included, are guilty of it.
I speak for no other Jews than myself, but I’m far less worried about stupid antisemitism like this than about dangerous antisemitism.
What fun!
I'm also going to assume that Jewish organizations played a role in highlighting the antisemitic aspects of last year's parade, which may be behind UNESCO rescinding the cultural heritage status of the event. So this is a very particular form of resentment. Also I notice the Nazi-like armbands are also on the Jewish characters--the Jew as Nazi, usually in the person of the Israeli Jew--is the predominant 20th and 21st century antisemitic trope in Europe. Except that it's not considered antisemitic to call Israeli behavior Nazi-like, it's actually de rigeur, and only in the presence of their American colleagues do continentals avoid that trope at the Anglo-Dutch conglomerate I work at. The Brits are, as usual, harder to read than the continentals, but pretty sure that's the general impression of Jews predominant in the UK as well. They're also nicer people, in general, so their ethnic resentments are less threatening.
I understand that Orthodox Jews are a peculiar brand to look at in this day and age. They are fundamentalists and like any religious fundamentalist, they look out of step. They've looked out of step for centuries. Still, that's not usually a crime to humanity to look out of step. If it were, Democrats would be mocked and outlawed.
Belgium has a hugely growing Muslim population. Were there any floats depicting that new brand of Fleminism, I wonder? Probably not.
There is a lot of history in this. It's always right up there on the surface. And it only takes a little bit of encouragement or leadership to bring it out, nurture it, and let it do it's thing. Europe cannot help itself. So, yeah, I think it's probably not a good thing that this is still acceptable there. The end product is never 'just a fun, humorous thing'.
and this parade can be a humorously intended sendup of all "others"
except, OF COURSE; Muslims: on account of because of the fact, that they'd KILL YOU
Very true, gilbar. You'll not find much mockery of Muslims, ostensibly because of European sensitivity to their oppressed status globally, by Americans and Jews, but probably because there are at this point a lot of pussies over there.
And a lot of Muslims.
Belgian PM Sophie Wilmès said the pretend Jews in the Aalst parade "harm our values and our country's reputation".
"The use of stereotypes stigmatising communities and groups based on their origins leads to divisions and endangers our togetherness," she said.
Joël Rubinfeld, head of the Belgian League against anti-Semitism, said: "It is sad, deplorable, shameful that 50 persons are tainting an entire carnival, a popular celebration. It gives a catastrophic image of the city of Aalst and also of our country abroad."
No "civility bullshit" or "Era of That's Not Funny" tags?
except, OF COURSE; Muslims: on account of because of the fact, that they'd KILL YOU
Yes, we know what happens when Muslims are mocked. And it's not just Muslims who forbid it. I've told this before but years ago I was listening to Christopher Hitchens speaking in Canada. His derisive remarks on religion, especially Christianity, were met with much laughter and applause. When he started in on Muslims, you could have heard a pin drop. More recently, laws have been passed against anti-Islamic speech in previously free countries. Terrorism works.
Don’t they speak Flemish in Belgium, which is basically Dutch with a sing song accent? Yes, they do. I guess Flemish got bigfooted here.
I am of two minds on the parade, which I guess means that it’s a good thing. But my mother lived through the occupation of Holland, and what they did to her little Jewish friends was no joke.
“A language is a dialect with an army” some cunning linguist once said.
Randomly, GESTAPO is obviously german, but is also basically the same in Duch/Flemmish - Geheime Staatspolitie ~ Secret State Police
Anyway, the thing I see here is that the other people they're making fun of are public figures. Generalized Jewish stereotypes are pretty much the opposite of that.
Flemish is like Dutch spoken by Gomer Pyle.
We Dutch like a good Flemish joke.
Undoubtedly there were climate alarmists involved in the mocking of Greta Thunberg and there were probably Christians involved in the mocking of Christ on the cross. Were there Jews involved in the mocking of Jews? It matters to the meaning whether it is an inside job.
What fun!
That's what I was just thinking: it doesn't sound "fun" at all, unlike making fun of the Phlegmish people in their Phlegmland.
Tim Maguire, how many Jews have to be involved for it to be an inside job? Is one token Jew sufficient?
Note: this town is run by a Flemish Nationalist Party member, and is hostile to the European Project and greater Belgium altogether. The BBC is not going to give a fair hearing to these nationalist types, and not because of mockery of UK leadership.
The town's leadership is explicitly hostile to the togetherness the Belgian PM assumes to be everyone's objective.
I don't know about the Flemish Dutch, but the Netherlands Dutch were among the most non-antisemitic people in Europe (along with the Danes) during World War II, when it took real courage to be non-antisemitic and to act on one's non-antisemitic beliefs.
Did they have floats depicting cattle cars or gas chambers? Hilarious!
THEOLDMAN
The BBC left out a not insignificant detail: the ‘Wailing Wall’ was built out of ‘gold bars.’ That’s unequivocal antisemitism in my book.
Randomly, GESTAPO is obviously german, but is also basically the same in Duch/Flemmish - Geheime Staatspolitie ~ Secret State Police
Except the Dutch word for state police or national police always was “Rijkspolitie”.
Meh every group gets made fun of. Picking on a group's dress, practices or even appearances isn't that bad. It only gets bad when strongly negative social characteristics are implied, like unstrustworthiness, violence, or unintelligence. You can trust this is what I firmly believe. I would never Welsh on something like that. If I did you could feel free to beat me like a drunk Irishman on a Whiskey bender. I mean if I didn't believe it would I be as dumb as some redneck hillbilly to record it on the internet for other people to see?
For some older Jewish people, I imagine it can feel kinda good to see stories like this. Obviously not because Jews are being made fun of. And also not because it shows that society as a whole now takes a strong stance against possible Antisemitism. But rather that Jewish people have now become a Sacred Cow. But since Sacred Cows are not eaten, I hope they brought their dairy dishes for all the take-home baggies.
Were they having "fun"?
It looked like a grim rote in bad weather.
I'm not going to do that lib thing where "I'm offended on behalf of other people over that thing. That thing that has no effect on me whatsoever".
I have come to understand Jews seem to be hated world-wide. For the life of me I'll never understand it. It's the world we live in, not the world I want it to be.
Maybe it is Biblical. I'm at a loss to explain it.
Where’s the charicature of Islam?
Blogger Browndog said...
I have come to understand Jews seem to be hated world-wide. For the life of me I'll never understand it. It's the world we live in, not the world I want it to be.
Thomas Sowell has an essay on this subject comparing Jews in the West, to Han Chinese in Far East, in his book White Liberal Black Redneck. Basically both groups face similar types of negative stereotypes in their respective geographic areas, and he linked it to those groups being willing to go out and live as minorities in foreign lands and also tending to be successful in their respective fields in those lands.
Places not to visit
I was in Brussels in 2015 and the streets near the central square looked like Beirut with the Muslim street paddlers and women in burkas.
Two weeks after we left was the terrorist attack. Our hotel was right in the middle of it and was sealed off for days.
"I have come to understand Jews seem to be hated world-wide. For the life of me I'll never understand it."
The Antidefamation League does a periodic survey on anti-Jewish opinions around the world. In 2014, 30% of Bolivians, 53% of South Koreans, and 38% of South Africans expressed anti-Jewish opinions. How many of these people know any Jews?
https://global100.adl.org/map
Vault-Dweller: "Jewish people have now become a Sacred Cow."
Too ridiculous for words. It's some sacred cow when you're attacked on the streets of Paris, Malmo, Antwerp, and Brooklyn. Not years ago. Today, now. They are literally being chased out of Europe again, only this time to be replaced by Muslims. (and good luck with that, as Christian Euros are not even having babies at replacement rate).
We're not sacred cows. We've always been the favorite target when certain people are feeling their oats. After centuries of trying to be eliminated, you'll forgive some of us for pointing out that those same things said over the course of centuries, right before they warmed up the ovens or got their Pogrom shoes on, are being said again. And many people just scoff and say, "What? Jews are some sacred cow?". No, we're not. It's just that you learn to smell the crap when it shows itself again. To you, it's 'Meh'. To me/us...it's back. And when it's pointed out, most of us today just clean our guns. I don't expect outside help.
Here is Thomas Sowell's essay if anyone is curious.
Thomas Sowell: Is Anti-Semitism Generic?
It's hard to make fun of the Belgians. It's hard to make fun of a lot of European nations. They just don't provide any material.
They should have made fun of Trump and his supporters. You can never get in trouble if you make fun of them, and you can be as crude as you want. You're a good person if you hate Trump, and a better person if you encourage others to hate him......It used to be that way with Jews. Anti-semitism was a hallowed and respected European tradition, but Hitler made it into something evil and ugly. Maybe Corbyn and these guys can revive this ancient tradition, but it looks played out. Doesn't attract the brightest and most creative spirits the way it used to. They've moved on to Trump and his supporters. That's the future of irrational hatred.
The Vault Dweller said...
Meh every group gets made fun of.
EXCEPT Muslims
TRY to pay attention
Basically both groups face similar types of negative stereotypes in their respective geographic areas, and he linked it to those groups being willing to go out and live as minorities in foreign lands and also tending to be successful in their respective fields in those lands.
I’m certainly no Thomas Sowell, but I always assumed that Jew-hatred largely reflected the tribalism inherent in human nature, with Jews simply being an unusually common minority.
It just might be a "phlegm hole" country.
Meh. Let me know when they also mock Muslims. Until then “Dutch courage”‘ will continue to mean the sort of bravado that comes from the bottom of a glass of genever.
"It's hard to make fun of the Belgians."
The biggest obstacle is that there are no derogatory terms for the Belgians.
Too ridiculous for words. It's some sacred cow when you're attacked on the streets of Paris, Malmo, Antwerp, and Brooklyn. Not years ago. Today, now. They are literally being chased out of Europe again, only this time to be replaced by Muslims.
When I said Sacred Cows, I meant how acceptable, mainstream society treats people. It is entirely possible that one group of people can be viewed as a sacred cow by the acceptable, mainstream part of society, yet vilified and harshly treated by a minority contingent. If you look at brazen antisemitic attacks that you have referenced, they are met with universal, widespread condemnation by the politicians, press and business leaders of those areas. Now they haven't necessarily done anything about it substantively, but I attribute that to those 'Leaders' having more than one perceived sacred cow, they need to take care of.
Kinda like the big shot who makes sexist remarks and when somebody complains says “It’s a joke. Don’t be so touchy”
Western Europe is pretty much amoral by now. European anti-Semitism is no joke.
Yes yes it is a bit disconcerting but remember they still make wonderful chocolates and they maintain the Teutonic pathway to France and all those French women Mac make Prussian blood boil.
"It's hard to make fun of the Belgians."
No, it isn't.
"Belgium" is a bad joke of a country, so it's natural they'd have a bad joke of a parade.
Think Hercule Poirot.
Belgium still has a King. And he makes great waffles.
Some things really aren't funny. The Hutu and Tutsi massacres were not funny. The Holodomor was not a laugh riot, nor were the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution. Antisemitism is not even mildly amusing.
Blogger Jeff said...
Some things really aren't funny. The Hutu and Tutsi massacres were not funny. The Holodomor was not a laugh riot, nor were the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution. Antisemitism is not even mildly amusing.
Holodomor Humor
This is part of Carnival. German carnival floats have been raunchy for- forever, it seems.
Germany Rose Monday carnival floats
Germany carnival floats Bush.
Big Mike
Meh. Let me know when they also mock Muslims. Until then “Dutch courage”‘ will continue to mean the sort of bravado that comes from the bottom of a glass of genever.
I don't know about Belgian carnival, but Muslims have been targets of ridicule in German carnival floats.Germany carnival Muslims.
William @ 8:40
They should have made fun of Trump and his supporters.
Granted, this link is not for Belgian carnival, but German carnival. Germany carnival Trump. From "Belgium carnival Trump" I don't see as many Trump images as in Germany.
I don't know about Belgian carnival, but Muslims have been targets of ridicule in German carnival floats.Germany carnival Muslims.
Is that what triggered that driver of the vehicle that plowed into a crowd injuring more than 30 people?
Jeff: Some things really aren't funny. The Hutu and Tutsi massacres were not funny. The Holodomor was not a laugh riot, nor were the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution. Antisemitism is not even mildly amusing.
I've heard funny jokes about all the above. Some utterly tasteless. But funny.
I doubt that not laughing at black humor is any kind of indicator of lower susceptibility to being caught up in horrible crimes against our fellow men.
I just call all Belgians Walloons.
It's OK to make fun of Muslims. It's when you make fun of Muhammad that they get pissed off. Jews are the opposite. I suppose that should tell us something.
"Joël Rubinfeld, head of the Belgian League against anti-Semitism, said:"It is sad, deplorable, shameful that 50 persons are tainting an entire carnival, a popular celebration"
50 persons, that's all it takes to bring out the bigots. And people wonder how you get 'anti-semitism' if that's all it takes to get some racist whiner here to declare that "Europe cannot help itself".
Btw, I'm 'Phlegmish' (wow, that must have taken much brain power to invent that). As for 'muslims will kill you'? The ones who get extreme conniptions about this anti-semitic float are also the ones who cover up islamic anti-semitism.
"A mosque was set on fire in the Indian capital on Tuesday by Hindu mobs, as several Muslim-populated areas in the city were attacked during three days of violence, which were triggered after attacks on sit-ins against a new citizenship law."
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