Althouse: "Me and the wife are thinking about voting for Moore, but I just don’t like some of the things they saying about him."

December 11, 2017

"Me and the wife are thinking about voting for Moore, but I just don’t like some of the things they saying about him."

Roll Call finds an Alabaman to quote.

325 comments:

1 – 200 of 325 Newer› Newest»

Greg Hlatky said...: Found an Alabaman to quote? Took them long enough to find one.; 12/11/17, 9:22 AM
mockturtle said...: So they interview a guy named Jock-itch? Seriously?; 12/11/17, 9:26 AM
Yancey Ward said...: I am going to stick with my original call I made the day after WaPo dropped the first story about Moore- he wins by 10% tomorrow.; 12/11/17, 9:29 AM
Michael K said...: Ricochet, which I once quit because of weird religious extremism and NeverTrump sentiment has another anti-Moore post about how "us Republicans can't elect this fellow who is a child molester."

They seem to lack self awareness. You would think a 40 year old accusation with no evidence would trump (sorry) an abortion-until-birth enthusiast.

The perfect is always an enemy of the good.; 12/11/17, 9:29 AM
Tim said...: I'm not surprised they found an older person who holds this opinion. Folks who grew up during the age of media empires, the "Big three" or Walter Cronkite still tend to think that the media would not willfully lie to the American Public. It is difficult I suppose to overcome a lifetime of belief, no matter.
I and my party* we believe that Roy Moore is a grandstanding blowhard who cut his teeth in public office in Alabama by being an outspoken defender of what used to be a common faith. The allegations against him I think are not credible as to assault or harassment mostly because of the timing of their release.

The really interesting thing to me is how much the public has become wise to the shameless lying by the press. I think Tolkien, among others remarked that a conspiracy, once unmasked cannot be secreted again. When the press, acting at the behest of the Democrat party trots out accusers of impropriety at every single election time, always with unprovable allegations at the last possible minute, normal people kind of get jaded. At least speaking for my party.*

*My party of one. I wouldn't be associated with any other, I have too much self respect.; 12/11/17, 9:32 AM
Curious George said...: So Moore is a lock , eh?

If he does win, wanna bet these women accusers disappear like a fart in the wind?; 12/11/17, 9:34 AM
donald said...: Roy Moore is gonna win because Doug Jones is pro abortion.

This makes Alabaman’s uneducated rubes in the Post’s eyes.

I’m guessing Corey Booker didn’t say one word to the fellow travelers about this biggest issue in the whole election. at that photo op.; 12/11/17, 9:34 AM
Michael K said...: "Jock Itch" is a wonderful name for a guy who doesn't like men with jock itch.

It's like the woman, who had a boy carrying her groceries to her car, who said "I have an itchy pussy."

The kid said, "Ma'am, you'll have to point it out. All these Japanese cars look alike to me."; 12/11/17, 9:34 AM
stevew said...: 'The wife', yeah, I like that, gonna use that, will be interested to see how the wife takes to it.

Willing to bet they had a bunch of other Alabaman quotes but none were as authentic as this one; to their ears at least.

-sw; 12/11/17, 9:35 AM
mezzrow said...: And we're supposed to believe this, right?

Yep, that's where I'm at.; 12/11/17, 9:38 AM
Robert Cook said...: "When the press, acting at the behest of the Democrat party...."

Hahahaha! They act at the behest of their corporate boards.; 12/11/17, 9:40 AM
rhhardin said...: There's a book "Down in the Holler" that can be used to construct Alabama quotes.

Moore usin' his hoe-handle on them young gals.; 12/11/17, 9:41 AM
Bob Boyd said...: A more frequently expressed sentiment was,
"Me and the wife are thinking about voting for Moore, because Fuck You."; 12/11/17, 9:42 AM
chickelit said...: It's almost time to compile a list of the AL boycotts planned should Moore win. And the counter boycotts by people fed up with the boycotters. So much boy and girl behavior trying to undo Trump prosperity.; 12/11/17, 9:43 AM
Birches said...: The truth is no one knows what will happen tomorrow because the press has shamed reluctant Moore supporters into silence.; 12/11/17, 9:44 AM
FIDO said...: A study in contrasts:

Nelson Mandela, in 1963, was found guilty in a court of law of sabotage, having worked with MK to set off 57 bombs in one day. He was a Communist and a 'Freedom Fighter' (i.e. a terrorist who won).

He was released, reformed and rehabilitated in 1990. A BOMBER was rehabilitated in 30 years. (Bill Ayers could not be reached for comment) MK did some rather other odious things.

Moore's crime was hitting on girls 40 years ago. No rape was alleged.

So...let's talk about statute of limitations on outrage.; 12/11/17, 9:45 AM
Michael said...: Had to find one with grammar issues!! Good work. Extra points for "the wife."; 12/11/17, 9:47 AM
Tim said...: "Blogger Robert Cook said...
"When the press, acting at the behest of the Democrat party...."

Hahahaha! They act at the behest of their corporate boards."

Well they may be, but if that is the case the boards are in really deep trouble...
ESPN bleeding subscribers as if through a severed artery.
Newsweek sells for $1 That's ONE DOLLAR
CNN, MSNBC et al, viewership all down, Advertising down, newspapers going bust all over the country...

Here's an idea: How about produce a product that has an unblemished reputation for HONESTY and INTEGRETY and stop lying and making up news to please your "corporate boards" Then oh, I dunno, maybe people will start watching/buying again.

... NAH!!!!; 12/11/17, 9:49 AM
traditionalguy said...: NB: Alabamians are not Hill Billies. They made a bad forgery out of this interview too. Most Alabamians are tough as nails and as well educated as Bible Belt Southern Baptist standards allow. The voters in Huntsville, Birmingham, Auburn, and Montgomery are quite smart folks.; 12/11/17, 9:49 AM
chickelit said...: Robert Cook said...Hahahaha! They act at the behest of their corporate boards.

Yes, and so far Dems are charging into 2018 and beyond fueled by the same corporate interests that controlled Hillary. All Dem candidates still work pro dono and the party has yet to have its revolution.; 12/11/17, 9:50 AM
FIDO said...: Still recalling that standing ovation that Roman Polanski got after, not being accused, after being INDICTED by the law, not the court of public opinion.

Long time for the Dems to walk back on that one.; 12/11/17, 9:50 AM
narciso said...: The rivonia trial, that was why he was not listed as a prisoner of conscience by amnesty
International, now Jacob zuma has turned out to be just the fellow we were warning about.

of course there is this kerfluffle fir today:
https://mobile.twitter.com/businessinsider/status/940036656693833730; 12/11/17, 9:50 AM
traditionalguy said...: I left out Mobile, Alabama.; 12/11/17, 9:51 AM
narciso said...: You should clarify you were speaking of umkhonto do size the militant arm of the abc.; 12/11/17, 9:54 AM
SteveR said...: “They act at the behest of their corporate boards.

No difference; 12/11/17, 9:55 AM
buwaya said...: In most of these companies the board is mostly irrelevant.
What you really have are individual owners, influence and ownership is usually indirect however.
The structure of power in this area is an interesting subject and poorly studied.

What is clear is that the ultimate owners are, the vast majority, aligned with the Democratic party, with a few backing GOPe Republicans.

Trumps main business support is from the levels below this.; 12/11/17, 9:58 AM
Etienne said...: In my case, if I were stupid enough to live in Alabama, then I would write in a candidate.

I would elect the underdog who doesn't owe $10 or $20 million worth of favors to the Party.; 12/11/17, 10:05 AM
Kevin said...: This was the best they could do?

I would think it much easier and more effective to quote anti-Moore people who have "friends" who say mean things and are planning to stay home.

In 2017 it's called journalism.; 12/11/17, 10:12 AM
Robert Cook said...: "Yes, and so far Dems are charging into 2018 and beyond fueled by the same corporate interests that controlled Hillary."

And the same corporate interests that fund the Republicans.; 12/11/17, 10:17 AM
Michael K said...: "And the same corporate interests that fund the Republicans."

Except Trump and that is why he is where he is.; 12/11/17, 10:19 AM
Unknown said...: Moore's opponent has out spent him 7 to 1.; 12/11/17, 10:20 AM
Char Char Binks, Esq. said...: Is it illegal for an adult man to date a 17-year-old, or just un-Biblical?; 12/11/17, 10:21 AM
Michael K said...: "if I were stupid enough to live in Alabama, then I would write in a candidate."

How you get Trump.

And Moore, for that matter,; 12/11/17, 10:21 AM
traditionalguy said...: Interestingly, Steve Bannon has become the point of the spear on the politics of making America great again. Bannon is taking the multiple barrages of incoming propaganda hate now.

But attacking Steve is like attacking the US Navy at Pearl Harbor. US Navy veteran Bannon will attack them back like Nimitz attacked the over confident Japs at Midway. After the Moore election Bannon will probably say "scratch 4 carriers." He will mean that he has sunk Jones, Franken, Flake and McCain.

Admiral Trump will need to spend most his time on destroying the NORKS, who out of nowhere suddenly have ICMBs tipped with H-Bombs pointed at the entire USA.; 12/11/17, 10:22 AM
Luke Lea said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 12/11/17, 10:22 AM
KittyM said...: @FIDO "Still recalling that standing ovation that Roman Polanski"

Absolutely right. The treatment of Polanksi by the entertainment community is shameful, ditto that of Woody Allen imo.

But in that super obvious way that shouldn't need pointing out, two (three here) don't make a right. The fact that we feel disgusted at the way that people overlook and forgave Polanksi - the way he was given more work for example and didn't lose his privileges - should make us *more* alert to the same thing happening here with Roy Moore. I would think.

I'm like a broken record on this one, I know, but seriously - again - sexual harassment and bad behaviour is about power and predators and it cuts right across political lines. Men abuse women in all sectors and while of course there is harassment that is bad and some that is worse, it is definitely not made better or worse by the political views of the predator doing the abusing!; 12/11/17, 10:25 AM
Luke Lea said...: This is why the polls are likely to underestimate the number of Moore voters just like they did for Trump last fall: people are not comfortable admitting how they intend to vote given the media atmosphere surrounding the campaigns. To some it feels like they are being asked, "Are you a racist, misogynist, or some other kind of bigot?" The fact that the Washington Post "interfered" in the Alabama election by publishing a piece of opposition research between the primary (when it would have been fair) and the general (when control of the senate and hence Trump's whole agenda is at stake) is something most voters are aware of. As are the Washington Post and all but the most naive Democratic partisans, of course, though they are too hypocritical to admit it.

This is all so obvious, why do I even bother to write it? (Because I don't read it often enough, that's why.); 12/11/17, 10:25 AM
narciso said...: Not out of nowhere, the warheads were known about four years ago, the hwasung boosters were like the product of tbe peregriska (reset); 12/11/17, 10:26 AM
Luke Lea said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 12/11/17, 10:26 AM
buwaya said...: The corporate interests backing "Republicans" are few and paltry. Its quite amazing how hard it is for the left to see reality. The corporate interests that matter are nearly 100% backing liberals. And those few that don't (the Kochs are one of just a few) have no love for the Trumpian populism.

This point just keeps bouncing off armor-plated skulls. Or the people saying the opposite may simply be automated systems.; 12/11/17, 10:27 AM
Dennis said...: Pollster and Focus Group Organizer Frank Luntz cannot seem to get his head around the fact that Albamans see Roy Moore differently than he does. Listen to some of the compelling comments in the video at the link. It appears that Alabamans are NOT the bigoted rednecks that they are made out to be by the mainstream media.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=83&v=HjLMAoejW-A; 12/11/17, 10:32 AM
KittyM said...: May I ask a question of the "crowd" here? Putting the sexual accusations to one side...what about the racism? What about his anti-semitic remarks recently? Does this not bother you? Do you agree that Jews are going to hell? Do you agree that saying this is a perfectly normal thing for a potential senator to say?

Just so you don't think I am "setting you up" or being snarky, I should say openly that I personally find Moore to be repellent because of this and disqualified to represent his state. I think these kinds of remarks are inflammatory and Anti-American.; 12/11/17, 10:34 AM
Hagar said...: "When the press, acting at the behest of the Democrat party...."

Again, totally the wrong way around. It is "the press" that is leading the Democratic Party over the cliff.; 12/11/17, 10:38 AM
steve uhr said...: Eye-witness testimony IS evidence. One would think that a former state Supreme Court judge would know that. It is admissible. It is not hearsay. It is sufficient evidence to support a criminal conviction even in the absence of any other evidence. One of couse can try to discredit such testimony but to say it isn't evidence is just silly; 12/11/17, 10:39 AM
Hagar said...: According to "fundamentalist" Christians,all non-believers are going to Hell.
And, since they are all reading from the same original texts, so do all "fundamentalist" Jews, Moslems, etc. believe, only differing as to exactly what fraction of humanity will be allowed into Heaven.; 12/11/17, 10:43 AM
Ron Winkleheimer said...: what about the racism?

What racism?

Do you agree that Jews are going to hell?

That is a point of contention in regards to Christian doctrine. Its been standard Christian doctrine that you have to acknowledge Christ as your savior to be saved, though some biblical passages have been interpreted by some to indicate that Jews will have a chance to acknowledge Christ at the Second Coming and therefore all Jews will be saved. More recently liberal Christians have been arguing that God is too merciful to condemn anyone and that eventually everyone will be saved. Conservative Christians argue, among other things, that such a doctrine eliminates free will and therefore moral agency. In any event, saying Jews will go to hell is no more anti-semetic than saying people from Michigan will go to hell. As to it being "normal" a lot of people are tired of "normal" because the status quo is screwing them over.; 12/11/17, 10:46 AM
buwaya said...: Technically, by the book Catholics would agree that Jews are going to hell - or, at least, they aren't going to heaven, which amounts to the same thing. This is not controversial to think, but uncharitable and unfashionable to say.

Thinking Jews are going to hell certainly isn't un-American. That is completely ahistorical. Heck, it is American tradition to say that Catholics are going to hell.

A lot of current thought is unexamined. It is knee-jerk. I think it comes of not examining ones own world view. Classic Catholic education stresses these things, on the question of questioning ones faith, of questioning the tenets of the faith, and learning the responses thereto - apologetics. This is a very ancient tradition that is disappearing. It is one of the symptoms of the modern death of the mind.; 12/11/17, 10:46 AM
KittyM said...: @Luke Lea "This is why the polls are likely to underestimate the number of Moore voters just like they did for Trump last fall: people are not comfortable admitting how they intend to vote given the media atmosphere surrounding the campaigns. To some it feels like they are being asked, "Are you a racist, misogynist, or some other kind of bigot?"

I think you are right, albeit we certainly disagree about whether a Moore win would/will be a Good Thing or not.

The thing is - Moore absolutely is a bigot. I mean, a real live, open bigot, if the word means anything at all. So if you vote for him, you are at least tacitly endorsing his bigotry. You just are. And it *may* mean that you disapprove of it, but are "holding your nose" because you believe for example that he is the least bad option (a perfectly legitimate way to decide who to vote for in a democratic election, btw). But it *may* be that you yourself are a bigot. I mean, *some* people are, right? Some people think Jews go to hell, for example, and think that this is such an obvious point that they say this aloud in a widely-watched election campaign, presumably because they a) believe it and b) think that other bigots will hear this and say, "Oh great! I agree! Must vote of this guy".

So - yeah - I agree with your point - but that doesn't mean those people *aren't* bigots, does it?; 12/11/17, 10:47 AM
Fabi said...: "...I personally find Moore to be repellent because of this and disqualified to represent his state.

He's unqualified because you find him repellent -- is that what you mean?; 12/11/17, 10:49 AM
Bay Area Guy said...: If I were in Alabama I would have trouble voting for Moore. Just being honest. Trump was totally right to support Luther Strange in the primaries, who would have quietly been a 100% conservative vote in the Senate, without all this drama.

But 40-year old allegations -- however horrendous the alleged conduct -- have red flags written all over them. Then, you add the bogus, yearbook "inscription," and you see the organized, politicized crap against Moore.

And, then, you add the multiple sexual harassers coddled by the Dems over the years (mostly Ted Kennedy and Bill Clinton) and then you see their ploy to push Franken out in a safe Dem seat. And, the ploy to undo the razor thin margins on the Tax vote, by seating Jones, and you add all that up, take a deep breath, and vote for Moore. But don't tell anyone!; 12/11/17, 10:49 AM
KittyM said...: @ Hagar Wbat a person believes in the privacy of his heart is none of my business. Fundamentalist religious believers of all stripes believe all sorts of "nasty" things about non-believers. Yuk. But again, none of my business.

My question is whether you think it doesn't disqualify him as a senator, to say these things out loud. To be proud to say them. Question answered in your case I think.; 12/11/17, 10:50 AM
KittyM said...: @Fabi "He's unqualified because you find him repellent -- is that what you mean?"

Sorry no. I meant he's unqualified because he is a bigot. Sorry if that wasn't clear.; 12/11/17, 10:51 AM
Ron Winkleheimer said...: See "Love Wins" for the everyone will be saved argument and "God Wins" for the counter-argument if you are actually interested in the subject.; 12/11/17, 10:51 AM
mockturtle said...: Chickelit predicts: And the counter boycotts by people fed up with the boycotters.

What shall we call counter boycotts? Any ideas? Procotts? I know I'd never visited a Chick-Fil-A until the leftist boycott.; 12/11/17, 10:52 AM
KittyM said...: @buwaya "Thinking Jews are going to hell certainly isn't un-American."

Well, from that point of view, so is racism and bigotry of all kinds. But I think you know what I mean.; 12/11/17, 10:52 AM
Michael K said...: should make us *more* alert to the same thing happening here with Roy Moore. I would think.

You obviously have the evidence unlike that incompetent Gloria Allred.

Share it with us, please.

You know Moore is guilty because............

Please complete the sentence. I sure can't.; 12/11/17, 10:52 AM
mockturtle said...: Sorry no. I meant he's unqualified because he is a bigot. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

Sorry, Kitty. You seem to have him confused with his Democratic opponent.; 12/11/17, 10:53 AM
KittyM said...: @Ron " In any event, saying Jews will go to hell is no more anti-semetic than saying people from Michigan will go to hell. As to it being "normal" a lot of people are tired of "normal" because the status quo is screwing them over."

Sorry? I may be dense, but I don't understand your point at all. How is saying Jews will go to hell no more anti-semitic that saying people from Michigan will go to hell??

And when you say a lot of people are tired of being normal, what do you mean? How is that connected to anti-semitic remarks by Moore?; 12/11/17, 10:55 AM
buwaya said...: Objectively, there are much worse things than being a bigot.
If we open our hearts book, we will likely read in there much worse bigotries than in Moore's. That would make us hypocrites. Jesus condemned hypocrites, but he educated bigots.

And from this we have to extract the deformations of fashion, intellectual and rhetorical.

If one were to weigh Moore's soul against the NYT's David Brooks, say, on which side would the scales fall?; 12/11/17, 10:56 AM
The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...: "May I ask a question of the "crowd" here? Putting the sexual accusations to one side...what about the racism? What about his anti-semitic remarks recently?"

The party of Keith Ellison wants to know! No, seriously...

Kitty, Democrat hypocrisy ground the "have you no decency?" schtick to dust long ago.; 12/11/17, 10:57 AM
Ron Winkleheimer said...: A lot of current thought is unexamined. It is knee-jerk. I think it comes of not examining ones own world view. Classic Catholic education stresses these things, on the question of questioning ones faith, of questioning the tenets of the faith, and learning the responses thereto - apologetics. This is a very ancient tradition that is disappearing. It is one of the symptoms of the modern death of the mind.

A lot of Churches seem to be embarrassed by the subject of apologetics. Christians are told to just have faith. The Christian religion has a two thousand year intellectual history concerning God and Christ, but God forbid we teach any of that to kids who are about to go off to college where there faith will be mocked and they will be told they are bigots for having it.; 12/11/17, 10:59 AM
buwaya said...: The people are tired of being lectured by their alleged betters, who are in truth entirely hypocritical. All these decades of constant sledge-hammers to the head have brought about their penultimate effect.; 12/11/17, 10:59 AM
KittyM said...: @Michael K "You know Moore is guilty because............Please complete the sentence. I sure can't."

No, sorry Michael (lots of apologies today from me!) I didn't mean to imply I had any special evidence or insight. In these matters, all any of us has are the news reports. You and I have certainly read and heard the same information.

For me, my opinion is that the accusations are credible and I must admit to having made up my mind that Moore must have been a creepy dude who had a thing about young women and that he abused his power to get his thrills.

But I respect that others will look at the same reports and remain unconvinced.

That's why I was interested in putting that aside for one moment to look at the other issues about Moore.; 12/11/17, 10:59 AM
Michael K said...: Do you agree that Jews are going to hell? Do you agree that saying this is a perfectly normal thing for a potential senator to say?

Hagar answered you,

Eye-witness testimony IS evidence.

Steve Uhr has never heard the expression, common in police and legal circles, "lies like an eyewitness."

Eyewitness testimony has sent a lot of innocent people, mostly men, to prison.

Plus, he has never seen Rashomon.

The evidence has mostly contradicted her story, the 14 year old's story., The other has admitted to forgery.; 12/11/17, 11:00 AM
Bad Lieutenant said...: Etienne said...
>In my case, if I were stupid enough

You are. Don't sell yourself short.

>to live in Alabama, then I would write in a candidate.

Yes, that would be stupid.

The funny thing is, you in Oklahoma (?) seem to look down on AL. Here in NY, the (stereotypical) difference between OK and AL is invisible to the naked eye - you're all cousin-fornicators.

That's who's slicing this shiite sandwich, and look at you eating it up!

You may not be SMART enough to live in Alabama.; 12/11/17, 11:00 AM
KittyM said...: @Ron "they will be told they are bigots for having it."

Nobody should accuse somebody of being a bigot on the basis that they have faith in their religion. But a person saying publically that Jews go to hell is a bigot. Was else can you call him?; 12/11/17, 11:01 AM
rcocean said...: According to the Bible all unbelievers are headed for HE double hockey sticks.

Don't like it? Why?

If you're an athiest - you don't believe in Hell

If you're a non-Christian - you don't believe in Jesus.

But then pretty much anything can be "antisemitic" or "Racist".; 12/11/17, 11:02 AM
KittyM said...: @ buwaya "The people are tired of being lectured by their alleged betters, who are in truth entirely hypocritical."

Do you mean, tired of being lectured that you shouldn't say nasty anti-semitic things in public? What about Jews being tired of being told they're gonna go to hell?; 12/11/17, 11:03 AM
rcocean said...: BTW, I didn't know Jack tapper was Jewish. I must missed his "I am Jewish" nametag.

Antisemitism = pointing out Jack Tapper is Jewish
Antisemitism = not knowing Tapper is Jewish & wishing him a "Merry Christmas".; 12/11/17, 11:05 AM
Ron Winkleheimer said...: Sorry? I may be dense, but I don't understand your point at all. How is saying Jews will go to hell no more anti-semitic that saying people from Michigan will go to hell??

Their not going to hell because they are Jews, they are not going to hell because they are not Christians.

Some Jews and some people from Michigan will go to heaven.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messianic_Judaism

If you believe in that sort of thing that is. Religions are inherently exclusive. Orthodox Jews believe that Jesus was a false messiah.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judaism%27s_view_of_Jesus

Does that make them bigots?; 12/11/17, 11:05 AM
KittyM said...: @ rcocean "pretty much anything can be "antisemitic" or "Racist"."

Maybe.

But you know that when Moore made his remark, he meant it in a nasty way, right? You do recognise that this, at least, is into.semitic? He wasn't giving a lecture on "What Christians Believe", was he? He was making a shitty remark so that other people who have anti-semitic views understood that he, like them, doesn't like Jews.; 12/11/17, 11:06 AM
Unknown said...: The Trump Economic Agenda is in danger if Moore loses, the people of Alabama Know this. They also know the party that comfortably controls the Senate controls judiciary appointments and they also know the ages of Supreme Court justices.

Voting for Moore they can't be of accused of not voting in their own interest.; 12/11/17, 11:07 AM
KittyM said...: @Ron See my comment to rcocean and also my previous thoughts. Moore was definitely being nasty about Jews, the very definition of anti-semitic.

C'mon you guys! Surely you don't want to defend this???

I'm sort of flabbergasted.; 12/11/17, 11:08 AM
Michael K said...: There are mixed choices in Alabama, which has an election almost as bad as the last Senate election in California.

Moore is a kook. As I posted somewhere else, if all kooks were banned from the Senate, we would have trouble with quorum calls.

Jones is a pro-abortion until kindergarten type.

I am prochoice because of seeing the consequences of illegal and mostly self induced abortions as a medical student,

However, viability is certainly at or before 20 weeks now. I operated on a 1 pound 10 ounce infant in 1969 and she survived and went home. That was before neonatology even existed.

There is just no excuse for post 20 week abortions. The "mother's health exception" is bullshit.

I had a pregnant patient with rapidly growing and spreading melanoma when pregnant. The OB and I monitored her with L/S ratios until infant viability and then did a C section.

Her melanoma regressed and ten years later, when I wrote my second book, she was still OK.

The baby was now in school.; 12/11/17, 11:08 AM
Drago said...: You could be forgiven if you read KittyM's posts and assessed that in form and "technique" they are quite similar, very very similar in fact, to a certain other poster on these boards.

And you might also not be surprised that KittyM was very much defending a certain other poster on these boards just yesterday.

You might also not be surprised that KittyM is simply the latest in a handful of Long time reader and Decided to Comment now-poster that follows that particular pattern.

Its all very interesting...from an poster analysis perspective.; 12/11/17, 11:10 AM
rcocean said...: BTW, peeps need to understand that

"You're gonna go to Hell"

AND

"Go to Hell"

Are two different sentiments.; 12/11/17, 11:10 AM
Drago said...: KittyM: "But you know that when Moore made his remark, he meant it in a nasty way, right?"

Hmmmm, engaging in a bit of mind-reading as well.

Well, that is a "skill" that many posters of a very particular ilk tend to display.

Unexpectedly.; 12/11/17, 11:11 AM
mockturtle said...: Kitty, Christianity [and Christ himself] teaches us that everyone who rejects Christ [a Jew] as Lord and Savior will spend eternity in hell. If you are one of those people, you don't believe this!. It's that simple. And if you don't believe it, how can you be harmed by it? That said, believing Jews are among God's chosen. The Apostle Paul [also a Jew] discusses this dilemma in Romans 11.; 12/11/17, 11:12 AM
Ron Winkleheimer said...: I looked it up. Moore didn't say "Jews" were going to hell. He said a Jew was going to hell. George Soros in point of fact.

"He's still going to the same place that people who don't recognize God and morality and accept his salvation are going," Moore said Tuesday. "And that's not a good place."

http://www.businessinsider.com/roy-moore-anti-semitism-george-soros-jews-hell-2017-12

So the whole premise is bullshit.

And if this is true:
,
Conservative news source The Reagan Battalion tweeted that Moore's statements about Soros were "straight-up anti-Semitism."'

Then The Reagan Battalion is a bunch of GOPe assholes fighting for the status quo.; 12/11/17, 11:12 AM
Hagar said...: @Kitty M,
But only "white," Protestant Christians are castigated as "bigoted" for expressing these beliefs. All others seem to be ignored or excused for one reason or another and indeed in some cases even praised.; 12/11/17, 11:12 AM
rcocean said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 12/11/17, 11:13 AM
Bad Lieutenant said...: Blogger KittyM said...
@Ron "they will be told they are bigots for having it."

Nobody should accuse somebody of being a bigot on the basis that they have faith in their religion. But a person saying publically that Jews go to hell is a bigot. Was else can you call him?

12/11/17, 11:01 AM

Dear KittyM,

1) I am a Jew who dearly hopes Roy Moore will be elected Senator from AL.
2) I cannot entirely credit your paraphrase, can you provide accurate quote please? It's curious, if not suspicious, that you have not done so already.
3) Think how bad the Ds must look, if all you say is true, for Moore to be elected in the face of all this calumny.; 12/11/17, 11:13 AM
Fabi said...: Is it illegal to be a "bigot", KittyM? Who defines "bigot"?; 12/11/17, 11:15 AM
KittyM said...: @rccocean "Antisemitism = pointing out Jack Tapper is Jewish; Antisemitism = not knowing Tapper is Jewish & wishing him a "Merry Christmas".

I don't know what you're referring to. I was talking about his comments about Jewish people who don't recognise God and morality and salvation going to hell.

Look, we are not talking about any old private individual who is entitled to his private shitty hateful prejudices, to share with friends and family. We are talking about a man who wants to be senator - representing *all* Alabamans, also the Jewish ones.

This is a horrible, hateful, divisive, bigoted remark that disqualifies him from representing in an honest and non-biased way the interests of his constituents who aren't fundamentalist Christians. You can't possibly think this is a good thing.; 12/11/17, 11:15 AM
FullMoon said...: The fact that we feel disgusted at the way that people overlook and forgave Polanksi - the way he was given more work for example and didn't lose his privileges - should make us *more* alert to the same thing happening here with Roy Moore. I would think.

One guy is known to have drugged a little girl so he could stick his dick in her ass and fuck her. Do you suppose she bled into the hot tub water? Did it hurt her? And, it happened back before ass fucking was still taboo.

One guy is conveniently accused \ in a typical liberal attack fashion, of(stuff), which he denies.

How can you equate the two? Weakens your innocent just curious newcomer persona.; 12/11/17, 11:15 AM
Unknown said...: Not to mention it, but Moore was a Democrat when he supposedly did the heavy petting with the 14 year old.; 12/11/17, 11:15 AM
rcocean said...: "He was making a shitty remark so that other people who have anti-semitic views understood that he, like them, doesn't like Jews."

Yeah, the ol "racist dog whistle" crap that EVERY Republican is accused of.

"But a person saying publically that Jews go to hell is a bigot. Was else can you call him?"

A Christian telling the Biblical truth, for one. Does Judaism even believe in Hell or the afterlife? I've read different things from different Rabbis.; 12/11/17, 11:17 AM
Bad Lieutenant said...: Ron: I looked it up. Moore didn't say "Jews" were going to hell. He said a Jew was going to hell. George Soros in point of fact.

--See, KittyM, You have misled us. Which decreases your future on this board, so please don't do it anymore.

As a Jew, George Soros to me is next door to a Kapo, a quisling, a collaborator with both fascist and communist regimes. I certainly hope that he gets Gehinnom without parole.; 12/11/17, 11:17 AM
FullMoon said...: This is a horrible, hateful, divisive, bigoted remark that disqualifies him from representing in an honest and non-biased way the interests of his constituents who aren't fundamentalist Christians. You can't possibly think this is a good thing.

Your remark exposes your hatred of all fundamentalist Christians. If Moore is a bigot for his beliefs, then they all are.; 12/11/17, 11:18 AM
Ron Winkleheimer said...: @Bad Lieutenant

KittyM totally misrepresented what was said. Moore said that George Soros is going to hell.

Here is the quote and a source.

"He's still going to the same place that people who don't recognize God and morality and accept his salvation are going," Moore said Tuesday. "And that's not a good place."

http://www.businessinsider.com/roy-moore-anti-semitism-george-soros-jews-hell-2017-12

So this entire discussion has been premised on a lie.; 12/11/17, 11:18 AM
buwaya said...: By excluding the man in the present, due to the taint of his alleged views on his public acts, for these reasons, one must logically also require the exclusion of ones ancestors without exception, and likewise all their acts, their institutions, their patrimony, in that they do not personally meet the modern standard of thought.

And, note, this logical extension is indeed what modern intellectual fashions require. Thats universal in higher education.

What is worse than bigotry? Tyrrany.

This is exactly the sort of thing Orwell was on about in 1984. The judgement of the past by immediate whims justifies the ruthless judgement of our contemporaries, likewise. The memory hole makes tyrrany possible.
One of Orwells points anyway.; 12/11/17, 11:20 AM
Michael K said...: KittyM is working on her transition to Inga,; 12/11/17, 11:22 AM
HoodlumDoodlum said...: Honest question: is any of the Media coverage of these "average Alabamaians" ugly, Professor?
I mean, if I recall correctly the video of the people celebrating getting their "Obamaphones" was a real video and coverage of it really quoted what the people really said...but spreading that around was "ugly" because it cast those people in a bad light.
Shouldn't the same be true here--shouldn't it be "ugly" to accurately quote the ungrammatical statements of people in Alabama?; 12/11/17, 11:25 AM
Hagar said...: About the yearbook thing.
I think it is not uncommon for early maturing girls to pretend to be a couple of years older than they actually are, and some may hold a grudge when they find their act does not work?

I also think that former "14 year old" should be checked out for colorblindness and if she has any history of petty crime involving forgery. The yearbook thing looks legit down to the signature "Roy," but then "Moore/DA" and the full date is added in blue ink. The "Moore/DA" looks to be an intentional imitation of Moore's actual signature, which seems to be a very odd thing to do if the motive was not forgery.; 12/11/17, 11:25 AM
Fabi said...: KittyM beared false witness against Moore, so she's going to Hell! Say hello to all the Kennedys for me, please!; 12/11/17, 11:25 AM
mockturtle said...: BTW, Soros is an atheist. He is a Jew by ethnic heritage only.

Rev. 2:9: “I know your works, tribulation, and poverty (but you are rich); and I know the blasphemy of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan."; 12/11/17, 11:27 AM
KittyM said...: @Bad Lieutenant "1) I am a Jew who dearly hopes Roy Moore will be elected Senator from AL." Wow. I'm so shocked. Please, please rethink your position.

2) The direct quote is here. He was talking about Soros on American Family Radio and said 'Soros comes from another world that I don’t identify with. I wish I could fact him, face him directly. And I’d tell him the same thing. No matter how much money he’s got, he's still going to the same place that people who don't recognize God and morality and accept his salvation are going. And that’s not a good place.'

This is straight-forward old-school anti-semitism, as you surely must immediately recognise.

3) "Think how bad the Ds must look, if all you say is true, for Moore to be elected in the face of all this calumny." I draw another conclusion. I think it shows how many people are bigoted. How many people think "tribally" = my guys *whatever* rather than the other guys. I think it is very very depressing.; 12/11/17, 11:27 AM
Lem Vibe Bandit said...: After giving it some thought I think the couple mean exactly what they say.

We support president Clinton. His personal life is between him and his wife.; 12/11/17, 11:28 AM
Qwinn said...: I'm agnostic, and will remain so until an otherwise acceptable religion can assure me, with no equivocation, that George Soros will go to hell and never leave.

Cause the trivial metaphysical coin that is my hypothetical worship needs to have SOME value to make me spend it, and if it can't promise me that a Nazi collaborating communist evil tool like Soros will burn in agony for eternity... seriously, it's not asking for a lot in the Universal Justice department, is it?

(And yes, I find the notion that saying a willing Nazi collaborator should go to hell is anti-semitic to be priceless.); 12/11/17, 11:30 AM
BamaBadgOR said...: Today, on the anniversary of his death, my wife and I are playing the greatest hits of Sam Cooke, which include "She was only 16," which would make her two years older than Priscilla when she went on her first date with Elvis, and three years older than the cousin Jerry Lee Lewis married. Is this relevant today? Asking for a friend.; 12/11/17, 11:31 AM
rcocean said...: If its antisemitism to dislike George Soros than the entire Republican party - and every Conservative - is "antisemitic".; 12/11/17, 11:31 AM
Fabi said...: Some people may think that Jones is a baby killer for supporting abortion and vote for Moore instead, as the choice is binary. Have you considered that angle, KittyM, or is it easier for you to reflexively label Moore's voters as "bigots"?; 12/11/17, 11:34 AM
Unknown said...: Kitty M
Traditionally, Jewish dogma doesn't emphasize an after life in "heaven", it emphasizes living a good life, doing the right thing, making God "happy". It's a individual belief among some Jews that there is an afterlife.

At least what my Jewish friends tell me on the golf course. Seems every time I'm kicking ass my friends want to talk religion, Jews, Protestants it doesn't matter. Ever try to explain the Catechism in your back swing?; 12/11/17, 11:35 AM
Drago said...: "Your remark exposes your hatred of all fundamentalist Christians. If Moore is a bigot for his beliefs, then they all are."

KittyM is ok with Christians just as long as those Christians reject the most fundamental tenets of their Faith.; 12/11/17, 11:37 AM
KittyM said...: @rccocean "If its antisemitism to dislike George Soros than the entire Republican party - and every Conservative - is "antisemitic"."

No it is not, anymore than it would be racist to dislike Obama. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Please read what he said though. That *is* anti-semitic.

Btw I think this might be the last comment I post on this subject. I asked a question and although no one actually answered my question directly apart from Bad Lieutenant (thanks!), I think I got the answer anyway. I brought it on myself by raising the subject, I recognise that, but I honestly thought this conversation would go in a slightly different direction (more along the lines of, "Better to vote for Moore than his opponent").

I did not anticipate the defence of Moore's anti-semitic remarks or the nastiness about Soros. Depressing for me (obviously not for those of you who share the political views here). I gotta go before it gets too dark here.

But thank you anyway for your responses. Have a lovely day.; 12/11/17, 11:38 AM
Etienne said...: Trump says he needs Moore for the majority votes in the Senate.

This presupposes that Moore is a lap-dog.

Sadly, Moore has not said he will not be a lap-dog. He is willing to vote for the Party. Thus, useless as a true American.

I don't know anything about the Democratic candidate. He/she is invisible on this side of the Mississippi. I assume, the millions being spent are proof that they are a lap-dog as well.; 12/11/17, 11:42 AM
Gahrie said...: I did not anticipate the defence of Moore's anti-semitic remarks or the nastiness about Soros

Why would anyone be anything but nasty about Soros? (Unless of course they were on his gravy train)

The man got rich by destroying other people's wealth and was a NAZI collaborator.; 12/11/17, 11:43 AM
buwaya said...: An exercise for Kitty - I got this from a Jesuit actually, at a "Spiritual Exercises" retreat, a la Saint Ignatius. This is not one of the traditional bits, quite, in the "spiritual exercises", which may help explain some of the problems of the Jesuit order. But I digress.

The exercise (personal, mental) is to present yourself with an ethical, or at least a human problem - the matter of Roy Moore would be excellent. And one must solve it, or judge it, fully, according to what premises you require. And then you must ask "why?" to your premises. Then you must justify your premises, and then ask " why? " again. And again. And again. Like a tedious two-year old. As you reach your limit you end by spinning about a logical black hole.

This exercise requires complete honesty, a decent education (its really good at pointing out flaws there), and a lot of dedication and diligence.

This serves several purposes - one is humility. The other is heavy practice of apologetics. And is it is a proof of, if not the existence of God (through a sort of philosophical iterative calculation), the need for faith, because whatever you can do under your own intellectual steam, you won't get into that black hole.; 12/11/17, 11:43 AM
Fabi said...: I gave you a scenario at 11:34 AM devoid of Soros -- a realistic one at that, KittyM -- but you've declared this place "dark" and decided to run away. Have a lovely day yourself.; 12/11/17, 11:44 AM
KittyM said...: @ Drago - OK one last thought! "KittyM is ok with Christians just as long as those Christians reject the most fundamental tenets of their Faith."

I think I wrote two or three times in my comments above that I am talking about the public behaviour and speech of a (potential) representative of all the people of Alabama.

That is the key distinction. I am aware that people believe all kinds of things in their hearts, in the privacy of their homes and places of worship even. I would defend the right of people to believe what they want to - even things that I find personally distasteful. None of my business.

BUT - Moore is campaigning to be senator. So what he says in public on the radio is very relevant to considering his qualification to be senator.

THAT is my point. Please don't make it seem like I don't like him because he is Christian. That is not a fair depiction of my views as everyone can see if they read my comments.

Anyway. So much for leaving the subject!!!; 12/11/17, 11:45 AM
Michael K said...: How many people think "tribally" = my guys *whatever* rather than the other guys. I think it is very very depressing.

KittyM is well along in her transition to Inga,

I did not anticipate the defence of Moore's anti-semitic remarks or the nastiness about Soros.

Hmmm. English spelling. Maybe Londonstan ?; 12/11/17, 11:45 AM
narciso said...: The personal is the political, but only for some people.; 12/11/17, 11:49 AM
Larry J said...: Bay Area Guy said...

If I were in Alabama I would have trouble voting for Moore. Just being honest. Trump was totally right to support Luther Strange in the primaries, who would have quietly been a 100% conservative vote in the Senate, without all this drama.

But 40-year old allegations -- however horrendous the alleged conduct -- have red flags written all over them. Then, you add the bogus, yearbook "inscription," and you see the organized, politicized crap against Moore.

I am in Alabama (Huntsville) and my choice is to hold my nose and vote for Moore (whom I strongly dislike) or to stay home. There isn't a Democrat alive that I will vote for. Growing up here under the massive corruption of Democrats like George Wallace will do that to you.

There are holes in some of the allegations. There is no evidence beyond he said, she said. The "fake but accurate" yearbook pretty well sealed the deal for me. As much as I dislike him, Roy Moore has been in politics for decades. For this to come out now (and conveniently after the deadline for someone else to replace him on the ballot) has the mark of a very dirty smear campaign. If it works, you can count on a lot of similar allegations coming out in future elections. As much as I dislike Moore, I do believe in the presumption of innocence. Further, Democrats have been protecting their cretins for decades. Why should we destroy ours when they protect theirs?; 12/11/17, 11:50 AM
exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...: KittyM: there are people who believe Catholics are going to hell. I'm Catholic. Do their beliefs bother me? No. They are free to believe what they wish as long as they don't start shooting us, or blowing up Catholic churches or denying Catholics basic civil rights.

I know an atheist who got upset because someone told him he was going to hell. If you don't believe in hell, what's the problem?

The truth is that no matter what Moore believes, conservatives are now far better friends to Israel than the left is (even if Jews persist in voting Dem.) If I were Jewish, I'd rather have Moore in the Senate than Keith Ellison.; 12/11/17, 11:52 AM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: “C'mon you guys! Surely you don't want to defend this???

I'm sort of flabbergasted.”

Of course they want to defend it. And they do. Everyday. Why be flabbergasted? This is why they voted for someone like Trump and continue to defend and make excuses for him. This is who these people are. I’m never surprised to hear such opinions here on these comments threads. I’ve been around here since 2011, it’s only gotten worse.; 12/11/17, 11:55 AM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: “Please don't make it seem like I don't like him because he is Christian. That is not a fair depiction of my views as everyone can see if they read my comments.”

This is Drago’s schtick, he does it everyday many times a day when addressing those he thinks are liberals, leftists, etc. He’s incapable of any other modes of argumentation.; 12/11/17, 11:58 AM
exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...: Blogger Ron Winkleheimer said...
I looked it up. Moore didn't say "Jews" were going to hell. He said a Jew was going to hell. George Soros in point of fact."

Oh, well, then. I don't know who is going to hell, but Soros is certainly a strong contender.

He is an evil man.; 12/11/17, 12:00 PM
rcocean said...: "Kitty" has done an excellent job of smearing Moore as "antisemitic" based on nothing. Its not that she's made a good case, its simply by repeating the accusation over and over as if it were a fact - she wins.

That's also how the MSM works. Just keep repeating the same ol' lie over and over again as if it were fact. And it works, because most people are stupid. They feel rather than think, and pay half-attention to the news.

I've never got the hate the RINO's and National Review "True-cons" have for Moore. What he is for, that makes him so horrible is never expressed. Just like Trump.; 12/11/17, 12:03 PM
Kirk Parker said...: mockturtle,

"What shall we call counter boycotts?"

They already have a name: buycott.; 12/11/17, 12:08 PM
Qwinn said...: Per Kitty's request. I have read and reread what Moore said about Soros multiple times. I cannot even vaguely see how what he said is "antisemitism". If that qualifies, absolutely everything qualifies. I do not believe at all that the argument can be made in good faith. Of course, I can't recall the last time I heard a leftist argument that didn't turn out to be made in bad faith (Inga certainly proved it Friday).

This is just another desperate smear the day before election day. No surprise at all.; 12/11/17, 12:10 PM
donald said...: Kittym, who is probably another regular poster here knows nothing about religion, especially fundamental belief.

You don’t have to believe it toots, but when these people say that, it is meant with nothing but love and concern for the person’s mortal soul.

Maybe they’re wrong, when it gets down to it all we (Including atheists) is a faith in our belief. So you might want to reflect on YOUR casual and as is typical of bigots everywhere your ignorance. I suggest getting together with John Lewis and you two look into your hearts and figure out why you are consumed with such hatred.

Course, you’re probably white and John Lewis has no use for you.; 12/11/17, 12:10 PM
exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...: 2) The direct quote is here. He was talking about Soros on American Family Radio and said 'Soros comes from another world that I don’t identify with. I wish I could fact him, face him directly. And I’d tell him the same thing. No matter how much money he’s got, he's still going to the same place that people who don't recognize God and morality and accept his salvation are going. And that’s not a good place."

No, it is not. He is not saying Soros is going to go to hell because Soros is Jewish. He is saying that Soros is going going to hell because Soros is a bad man. And that is true.

Substitute the name "Pelosi" for "Soros." Would that be an anti-Catholic statement, or just an anti-Pelosi one?

BTW, it's funny that all those vicious Jew-haters down there are so happy about Trump's announcement about Jerusalem.; 12/11/17, 12:11 PM
KittyM said...: Blogger Ron Winkleheimer said..."I looked it up. Moore didn't say "Jews" were going to hell. He said a Jew was going to hell. George Soros in point of fact."

"He's (Soros) going to the same place that people who don't recognise God and morality and accept his salvation are going"

The same place that people who (= Jews) are going. So no, Ron, he said "...people who don't recognise God and morality and accept his salvation are going..." Not just Soros.

@rcocean "Its not that she's made a good case, its simply by repeating the accusation over and over as if it were a fact"

I only have one single point. That one comment. It was enough for me to decide - for myself - that Moore is anti-semitic and, because he made these remarks publicly - not fit to be a senator. I didn't have a "case" in that sense. For me, that radio
interview was enough.

"That's also how the MSM works. Just keep repeating the same ol' lie over and over again as if it were fact. " But I didn't lie, did !? I just quoted a statement he made on the radio.

Totally understand not caring about that statement, or indeed agreeing with it (shudder). But you honestly can't say I lied over and over.

(Hmmm . seem to be posting again! This is so addictive!!!); 12/11/17, 12:12 PM
mockturtle said...: They already have a name: buycott.

Thanks, Kirk!; 12/11/17, 12:13 PM
exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...: Inga blathered: "Of course they want to defend it. And they do."

And you're defending KittyM, who has been proven to be a liar in this thread. Since you are a nasty liar yourself, you have no problem with that.

Please explain why saying Soros is going to hell is somehow an attack on all Jews.; 12/11/17, 12:14 PM
Qwinn said...: Nice catch, exiled. Yes, the ONLY people I have seen condemn Trump's Jerusalem recognition are Islamists and the Left. The global conservative response has been "about time!"

Some Jews must have noticed and complained, hence Soros paying Kitty to come here and defend him while projecting the left's white hot hate of Israel onto conservatives. Just like everything else.; 12/11/17, 12:15 PM
mockturtle said...: I know an atheist who got upset because someone told him he was going to hell. If you don't believe in hell, what's the problem?

Exactly, exiled! That's the point I was trying--lamely--to make. Why should people who don't believe in hell be insulted by being consigned there?; 12/11/17, 12:17 PM
Ron Winkleheimer said...: The same place that people who (= Jews) are going. So no, Ron, he said "...people who don't recognise God and morality and accept his salvation are going..." Not just Soros.

Which would be anyone who doesn't accept Christ. I know you want it to be anti-semetic. I know you need it to be anti-semetic. Guess what, telling Christians they are anti-semetic for being Christians is not a good way to convince Christians to vote for you. And that is what you are doing.; 12/11/17, 12:18 PM
exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...: "The same place that people who (= Jews) are going. So no, Ron, he said "...people who don't recognise God and morality and accept his salvation are going..." Not just Soros. "

Bullshit, you fool. There are all sorts of non-Jews " who don't recognise God and morality and accept his salvation." Many of them were born Christian.

It is not a statement about Jews, it is a statement about one particular secular leftist Jew who has devoted much time and money into undermining the American republic and fomenting violence and discord.

It's touching that you feel driven to defend the soul of that nasty POS.; 12/11/17, 12:18 PM
Qwinn said...: Kitty's attitude only makes sense if she believes that Jews do not "recognize God, morality or salvation".

Pretty sure they do all 3.

Why doesn't Kitty think so?; 12/11/17, 12:19 PM
PackerBronco said...: I'm just waiting for CNN to come out with the big scoop that Moore used sexually crude language around a 12-year old girl 4 days ago, only to correct themselves later in day, telling us it was actually a 52-year old man 40 years go, explaining that it was just a misunderstanding with their usually reliable anonymous sources.; 12/11/17, 12:19 PM
n.n said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 12/11/17, 12:21 PM
n.n said...: A preponderance of allegations and hearsay witnesses is a weak standard for justice. Perhaps social justice, but not justice.

In the scientific logical domain, accuracy is inversely proportional to the product of time and space offsets from the observer's frame of reference.

Unfortunately, the veracity of the allegations and defense cannot be established in the scientific logical domain. Fortunately, or unfortunately, we no longer conduct bullhorn prosecutions (e.g. public lynchings, trials by press, witch trials), and we have a civil right to due process, implying a presumption of innocence, as well as individual, proportionate treatment, which, among other things, means that we do not have a constitutional right, and more so, a moral right, to carry out elective abortions of people, careers, etc.

So, choose to the best of your judgment. That's it.; 12/11/17, 12:23 PM
Unknown said...: Kitty M is the same kind of person who believes any criticism of Obama's policies was racist.; 12/11/17, 12:24 PM
Unknown said...: Inga rides to rescue George Soros! Just like KittyM.

Look, if you defend George Soros then you are in fact a Nazi sympathizer. I know he's near and dear to the heart of leftists, but the fact is he sold Jews to the Nazi's in WWII; he is the walking poster child for Satan's helper on earth today, and the fact he is Jewish to a point only makes him more evil--since he himself is anti-semitic and pro "Killing Jews." Defending George Soros is like defending Heinrich Himmler. Defending George Soros is a sign of an anti-semite yourself. Attacking Soros is defending Jews.

As well ask if defending Jesus against King Herod makes you anti-semitic.

By attacking George Soros, Moore is a hero. You'd never, ever catch Nancy Pelosi or Chuck Schumer attacking Soros, though, no matter how many Jews Soros's money kills.

--Vance; 12/11/17, 12:24 PM
Michael K said...: Interesting thread.

Moore is a kook but the Senate is full of Kooks. Not as bad as in the 1950s when Richard Russell was "The Grand Old Man of the Senate" while blocking civil rights.

Or Grand Kleagal Byrd was setting the rules for debate,

The Democrats have been dishonest about this whole thing. Had they dredged up these accusers in the primary, they might have gotten the other guy elected but this was a hit on Republicans specifically,; 12/11/17, 12:25 PM
Ron Winkleheimer said...: By the way, KittyM is shocked because calling people bigots always worked to shut them up before.; 12/11/17, 12:27 PM
Qwinn said...: The most anti-Semitic statement I can imagine is "George Soros represents all Jews."

I mean, that is seriously vile Jew hate.

And it is part and parcel of Kitty and Inga's "argument".; 12/11/17, 12:33 PM
Unknown said...: All this might be wasted time, Fox shock poll says Moore down by 10%; 12/11/17, 12:35 PM
Unknown said...: Actually, I give KittyM credit: She's saying that her real problem is Moore's statement that people who don't recognize God or morality are going to hell. That she says it makes him anti-semitic is irrelevant; it's that statement that immoral people are going to hell that is the fundamental problem the left has with Christianity.

Because the left is all about immoral behavior being "good." That's the entire point of the left, is it not--to rationalize sin and to try to prevent the bad consequences of our choices?

Kitty: Moore is a throwback politician, an openly Christian one. He shocks and horrifies you, and his voters horrify you, because they actually view some things as evil and are not shy about saying so. It's the same reason why Mormons and Catholics and Evangelical christians are despised so much by the left: they say some things are sins, and they are not shy about it.

The left calls it "bigotry" when Christians of any stripe say that behavior XXXXX is a sin. It must be evil to criticize leftist approved behavior (mind you, most of these things are sexual--adultery, gays, fornication--we are all bigots if we think those things are a sin and actually say so. But it's not just sex--drugs, lying, envy.... Democrats promote all of those).

Kitty: Recognize that calling people bigots when they say that your favored behaviors are sins, is itself wrong.

--Vance; 12/11/17, 12:38 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: “And you're defending KittyM, who has been proven to be a liar in this thread. Since you are a nasty liar yourself, you have no problem with that.”

Bullshit. She didn’t lie. This accusing people of lying because you disagree with them is just dumb and lazy. And you are one to call others nasty. Self reflection not your strong suit, lol.; 12/11/17, 12:40 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: Kitty keeps making the same mistake, she expects you people to be rational, she’ll learn.; 12/11/17, 12:43 PM
Qwinn said...: I do think she lied, because I think stretching and contorting what Moore said to be "anti-semitic" cannot possibly be done in good faith. Democrats say vastly worse things about Jews regularly and it never causes a stir. It's bullshit on stilts.; 12/11/17, 12:45 PM
Jaq said...: Bullshit. She didn’t lie. This accusing people of lying because you disagree with them is just dumb and lazy.

Ha ha ha! Looked in a mirror lately Inga? Who thinks that a well supported inference is a 'nutty assumption," who throws around the term liar like beads at Mardi Gras!

That's too much.; 12/11/17, 12:46 PM
n.n said...: I am prochoice because of seeing the consequences of illegal and mostly self induced abortions as a medical student,

That's a point to consider. Elective abortion is natural right.

Since debasing human life is a societal concern, the goal is a reconciliation of moral, natural, and personal imperatives, in order to reach an internally, externally, and mutually consistent solution, which mitigate the risk of progressive corruption and dysfunction. To this end, I would start with religious/moral reform (i.e. education/indoctrination, culture/populism) and recapture normalization to promote self-moderating, responsible behavior that is a prerequisite for liberty and positive progress.; 12/11/17, 12:46 PM
Qwinn said...: And don't bother, Inga. You proved yourself on Friday to be the standard by which all bad faith argumentation should be evaluated.; 12/11/17, 12:47 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: “I know an atheist who got upset because someone told him he was going to hell. If you don't believe in hell, what's the problem?”

“Exactly, exiled! That's the point I was trying--lamely--to make. Why should people who don't believe in hell be insulted by being consigned there?”

You have absolutely no clue as to what KittyM’s religious belief systems are. The assumptions made here regarding someone’s religion or lack thereof, are also not surprising. They do this everyday, make assumptions and false equivalencies.; 12/11/17, 12:48 PM
Jaq said...: There are conservative and Orthodox Jews who absolutely believe in Hell, BTW. I sat through a little speech at the home of of a Jewish acquaintance where they were sitting shiva for the death of her mother, and the cantor who gave it made it pretty clear that I was going to Hell for trusting my own conscience, rather than the Torah. Well, he didn't address me personally, I just applied his words to my thinking.; 12/11/17, 12:49 PM
Qwinn said...: Also, note that Kitty didn't leave room for people to "disagree". She made it quite clear that anyone who did ao was themselves a hateful bigot which leaves her "flabbergasted".; 12/11/17, 12:49 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: “You proved yourself on Friday to be the standard by which all bad faith argumentation should be evaluated.”

You people do this every single day here in the Althouse threads. Don’t hold yourself to a different standard, it won’t work.; 12/11/17, 12:50 PM
Jaq said...: They do this everyday, make assumptions and false equivalencies.

You really should try to understand the difference between making assumptions, and drawing inferences, Inga. You might sound less stupid on account of you would be less ignorant, if you were able to understand the difference.; 12/11/17, 12:51 PM
Unknown said...: I agree with Qwinn: If criticizing George Soros is anti-semitic, then you must believe Soros is interchangeable with "Jews."

And that's far, far more anti-semitic than even the KKK. Heck, Soros is so bad Himmler and Hitler would say you are anti-Jewish for that statement. The writers of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion would say you are being unfair to the Jews by calling them "Soros".

PS: of course, Inga is the same person who thinks that 10,000 Islamic atrocities is nothing and doesn't reflect at all on the "religion of peace" but at the same time on person who burns a Koran is all Christians, so logic isn't her strong suit, clearly.

--Vance; 12/11/17, 12:52 PM
n.n said...: The most anti-Semitic statement I can imagine is "George Soros represents all Jews."

Yes. The Jewish faith and religious/moral philosophy recognize the dignity of individuals (e.g. character, principles), which precludes broad, sweeping judgments including judgment by "color of skin" (i.e. post-normal/pre-normal or progressive "diversity").; 12/11/17, 12:52 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 12/11/17, 12:52 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: Most rational people would think Moore’s comments were anti Semitic. But you people are not rational. Trump sycophants cannot be rational. This is something that any liberal who comments here would take into consideration before commenting, they would not be flabbergasted.; 12/11/17, 12:54 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: And Kitty M should take into consideration that there is a pattern to the way these people respond to a liberal expressing their views here. First they try to be somewhat polite, then they accuse you of lying, then the resort to insulting your intelligence, then they obsess over you.

It’s an unhealthy pattern I’ve seen occur over and over again here on the Althouse comments threads. It is employed by those who don’t have a good argument and simply want to attack the messenger. It’s a lazy, stupid and messed up way that the commentary here always goes.

So I’m never surprised at how low these Trump sycophants go. Never.; 12/11/17, 1:00 PM
Bad Lieutenant said...: I did not anticipate the defence of Moore's anti-semitic remarks or the nastiness about Soros

Kitty, Soros is a Bond villain in the flesh. Why don't you get this?

I'd serve Roy Moore a thousand teenage sluts a day before I'd put a nickel or a vote in Soros' pocket.

I do not agree with your interpretation of his (finally!) quoted remarks, and even given that extreme interpretation, OK, he thinks I'm going to Hell (I'm not, by my interpretation of his standards) -

So what? It neither breaks my leg nor picks my pocket.

What picks my pocket is Leftist economics. What breaks my leg is Leftist machtgelust, and the flirtation with Islamofascists who, indeed, will do more to me than that.

You are preaching pieties - a whited sepulcher - the only thing necessary to you is the maintenance of a goodthink facade.

Why do you think Doug Jones is any better? Moore didn't put out an ad that The Root, no less, condemned for its racial overtones.; 12/11/17, 1:02 PM
Qwinn said...: Yes, Inga, I'm truly embarrassed at my lack of a good argument on Friday when you had to completely redefine the word "forgery" to not include "writing things and attempting to pass it off as someone else's writing", and not only that, accused everyone who used the word the way it has been since the word was invented as being liars, including Fox News.

You sure dismantled our terrible arguments there with your awesomely good argukent that was obviously made in complete good faith.

Uh huh.; 12/11/17, 1:06 PM
Michael K said...: it's that statement that immoral people are going to hell that is the fundamental problem the left has with Christianity.

I agree. The Christian religion has been under attack since the end of th 19th century.

The organized religions haven't helped as they surrendered at the first sign of disapproval by the Kool Kids.

We got gay Episcopal bishops, then the crosses were to be removed so as not to offend people like the ROP member who blew himself up in New York this morning.

Fundamentalist Christians are excoriated for saying sinners go to Hell but another religion that advocates the murder of all infidels is OK because "Brown People."

Inga, you are so upset at these Neanderthal opinions here, one would think that you would hie yourself over to Washington Monthly or Mother Jones where you will not suffer a single trigger event because all right wing opinion is banned.

You change no minds with your weak arguments that consist mostly of This is something that any liberal who comments here would take into consideration before commenting, they would not be flabbergasted.

I think your inclinations instead is "Beat me again, daddy."; 12/11/17, 1:08 PM
exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...: Inga said...
Most rational people would think Moore’s comments were anti Semitic."

No, only deeply stupid and dishonest liberals with reading comprehension difficulties think that, which is why both you and your fellow shit-for-brains leftist are peeing your pants over it.

It's cute to see you use the word "rational" as if you know something about it. You're one who goes on here about the supreme importance of feeeeeeeeeellllllings!!

"I can't prove that this comment was anti-Semitic, but I FEEL like it is! Because the election's tomorrow and we have to come up with more crap to throw at Moore!"; 12/11/17, 1:10 PM
donald said...: By the way, I’m as redneck as it gets and I have never heard anybody I grew up with say “the wife”. It’s “my wife” or “momma”.

I assume they taped this, cause if they didn’t I call bullshit. Or fake news if you will.; 12/11/17, 1:11 PM
John Nowak said...: > then the resort to insulting your intelligence,

Or, they have no trouble seeing the problems with your claims.; 12/11/17, 1:11 PM
buwaya said...: "The Christian religion has been under attack since the end of the 19th century."

End of the 17th.; 12/11/17, 1:13 PM
buwaya said...: "I can't prove that this comment was anti-Semitic, but I FEEL like it is!"

The problem with the modern Liberal Arts, generally.; 12/11/17, 1:15 PM
Jaq said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 12/11/17, 1:16 PM
Jaq said...: As an example, I think it is a fair inference that Inga believes that Clinton's accusers were mostly lying because she said that Louis CK was worse that Bill Clinton, and nobody ever accused Louis CK of forcible rape.

Another piece of evidence supporting that inference would be that her views on Clinton's accusers are apparently some kind of state secret which she refuses to share. Odds are because they would undercut many of her comments here about various Republicans.

That's not an "assumption." An assumption would be "Inga doesn't believe Juanita Broaddrick because she's a loyal Democrat!' I think many loyal Democrats believe Juanita.

As for obsessing over commenters. Well, how can we miss you if you won't go away? If a somebody keeps walking past my house several times a week and sets off stink bombs, and I turn on fans to blow the smell away, am I the one who is obsessed?

You just don't seem to think very clearly, or write very well (the two are connected.); 12/11/17, 1:17 PM
exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...: Qwinn, let's not forget Inga's glee over Don Jrs. email which PROVED, PROVED finally that he was colluding with the Russians.

Ooops, wrong date!

Jeez, you'd think these liberals would get angry at CNN, ABC and their other favorite propaganda outlets for gulling them so often. You'd think they'd demand accurate reporting so they don't get all aflutter over a nothingburger that makes them look like dullards. Instead they get mad at us!; 12/11/17, 1:17 PM
Pookie Number 2 said...: And, since they are all reading from the same original texts, so do all "fundamentalist" Jews, Moslems, etc. believe, only differing as to exactly what fraction of humanity will be allowed into Heaven.

The Talmud (for those Jews who follow it - I think predominantly the Orthodox, but I'm less familiar with Conservative and Reform Judaism) explicitly assumes that there's an afterlife, and that decent non-Jews qualify with no need to adhere to the particular rituals ostensibly incumbent on Jews.; 12/11/17, 1:17 PM
Qwinn said...: "insulting your intelligence"

Assumes facts not in evidence, to wit, that you possess an intelligence that can be underestimated/insulted.

The fact that so many intelligent people here even bother with you is amazingly complimentary, given what you regularly bring to the table.; 12/11/17, 1:17 PM
Bay Area Guy said...: I have legitimate qualms about Moore.

But, since the Left operates in perpetual bad faith mode on sexual harassment/assault claims, I generally tune them out.

Here's a good piece today about Sen. Ted Kennedy -- the Lion of the Senate.

The famous "waitress sandwich" at La Brasserie in 1985:

As [Carla] Gaviglio enters the room, the six-foot-two, 225-plus-pound [Sen. Ted] Kennedy grabs the five-foot-three, 103-pound waitress and throws her on the table. She lands on her back, scattering crystal, plates and cutlery and the lit candles. Several glasses and a crystal candlestick are broken. Kennedy then picks her up from the table and throws her on [Sen. Chris] Dodd, who is sprawled in a chair. With Gaviglio on Dodd's lap, Kennedy jumps on top and begins rubbing his genital area against hers, supporting his weight on the arms of the chair. As he is doing this, Loh enters the room. She and Gaviglio both scream, drawing one or two dishwashers. Startled, Kennedy leaps up. He laughs. Bruised, shaken and angry over what she considered a sexual assault, Gaviglio runs from the room.

And, then, the article describes the famous drowning death of Mary Jo Kopechne.

The Dems ignored these for years for political reasons. So, it's hard to listen to them today on the topic, despite their sanctimony and moral indignation.; 12/11/17, 1:17 PM
exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...: I stand by my belief that conservatives get angry if you lie to them and liberals get angry at you if you tell them the truth.; 12/11/17, 1:20 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 12/11/17, 1:20 PM
Qwinn said...: I have no doubt that Inga will be happy to "admit" that Ted Kennedy was awful, now that he's dead and useless in attaining prog power. And she will demand virtue points for doing so.; 12/11/17, 1:23 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: “Inga, you are so upset at these Neanderthal opinions here, one would think that you would hie yourself over to Washington Monthly or Mother Jones where you will not suffer a single trigger event because all right wing opinion is banned.”

Michael Dearest. If I were truly upset by how commenters here behave I would stop commenting here. I actually enjoy it when you people expose yourselves for the world to see. When you behave in the manner I spoke of, you make it really easy for me to prove how low and vile so many of you are. What you misunderstand is this: You people can not touch me, because I care nothing for you. You’re among one of the most despicable here. An old curmudgeon who likes to hand it out, but cannot take it. Now run along a read a book.; 12/11/17, 1:24 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: “The fact that so many intelligent people here even bother with you is amazingly complimentary, given what you regularly bring to the table.”

Laughable. You “intelligent” people are most always shown to be idiots. I do this to you daily and enjoy myself immensely. I should thank you for your participation!; 12/11/17, 1:28 PM
Jim at said...: One would think that a former state Supreme Court judge would know that.

One would also think 40-year-old accusations of misconduct against said Supreme Court judge would've come out long, long before now.

Which is why this whole thing reeked from the beginning.; 12/11/17, 1:34 PM
Michael K said...: Inga, you would do well to read a book, too.

The fact that you don't is only too obvious.; 12/11/17, 1:37 PM
Qwinn said...: Inga could read 10,000 books, not sure how that would change her apparent belief that she has the power to "win" arguments by redefining words into meaninglessness.; 12/11/17, 1:41 PM
Anonymous said...: Sorry, late to the discussion. Can anyone advise:
(1) How the story of the 14-year-old (Rachel Corfman) has been debunked? I understand that Nelson (represented by Allred) has seen her story blow apart due to her forging of the yearbook inscription; that seems to leave just Corfman as a serious claimant (the other girls were older and claimed only kisses or, in one case, being offered Mateus Rose. Serving Mateus is indeed a felony, even among adults, but that's another topic).

So: any info on current status of Corfman's claims would be appreciated.

(2) How long did the WaPo have to sit on its story (came out right after the primary) in order to inflict the desired maximum damage on the GOP? Can we possibly learn when it interviewed these claimants; how long it had known of them and lined them up for this featured article? Given the incredible timing and impact, we have to look at the WaPo story as being nothing like journalism, everything like a hit job.

Hardly a surprise, I know.; 12/11/17, 1:41 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: “Inga, you would do well to read a book, too.

The fact that you don't is only too obvious.”

Michael K once again makes assumptions, which of course is what asses do. What is obvious is you cannot abide liberal commenters coming here to territory you seem to think belongs exclusively to Trumpists and conservatives.; 12/11/17, 1:42 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: “...arguments by redefining words into meaninglessness.”

If you weren’t so unintelligent, theyd have meaning to you.; 12/11/17, 1:44 PM
Qwinn said...: Owen: the Left (as demonstrated by Inga) continues to insist that the yearbook was not a forgery.

Given how obviously disingenuous that is, why waste time with their other claims?; 12/11/17, 1:44 PM
Jim at said...: Of course they want to defend it. And they do. Everyday. Why be flabbergasted?

CNN called. They've got another e-mail for you to shout from the rooftops.

Mueller is getting closer.; 12/11/17, 1:50 PM
FullMoon said...: "Michael Dearest. If I were truly upset by how commenters here behave I would stop commenting here."

Hardy har har. You left for a minute, then came back as unknown, denying it was you until you were outed by the people who have been dealing with you since your allie oop days.

Inga said...

Stop and think how ridiculous you've become. I'm

fine with becoming persona non grata. Your blog has

become the cesspool it once was. I'm pretty much

done here.; 12/11/17, 1:52 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: “Owen: the Left (as demonstrated by Inga) continues to insist that the yearbook was not a forgery.”
————————————-
“Conservative media spreads conspiracy theories

While many conservatives have rejected Moore’s candidacy, far-right media sites are doing Moore a big favor: They’re giving voters an alternate version of reality so they don’t have to admit they support someone accused of child molestation.

Notably, the website Breitbart, run by Steve Bannon, went so far as to send two reporters to Alabama to discredit Roy Moore’s accusers. (Their big scoop was laser-focused on the length of a telephone cord.) Gateway Pundit, a Trumpist conspiracy-minded outlet, has been “reporting” on handwriting analysis of Moore’s signature in an accuser’s high school yearbook performed by someone who is, notably, not a forensic handwriting analyst.

Outlets like Infowars claimed that Moore’s accusers’ stories had been “debunked” because of a tweet by a random Twitter user who also seemed incapable of remembering how many Purple Hearts he had won. Those articles have been shared on Facebook and Twitter thousands of times, including by Roy Moore’s wife, Kayla Moore.

(For its part, Fox News has been decried by the Moore campaign for spreading “fake news” despite being largely supportive of Moore, with campaign staffers going so far as to “manhandle” two Fox News photojournalists at a rally last week.)“

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/12/8/16742978/inside-bubble-roy-moore-conservative-media; 12/11/17, 1:54 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: Yet, this is exactly what it’s become.

“Conservative media wasn’t supposed to be an alternate reality
Conservative media was intended to be a supplement to mainstream outlets, to offer a different perspective on the news and events of the day. In 2012, conservative pundit and Fox News host Tucker Carlson described his website, the Daily Caller, as “the balance against the rest of the conventional press.””; 12/11/17, 1:56 PM
Michael K said...: What is obvious is you cannot abide liberal commenters coming here to territory you seem to think belongs exclusively to Trumpists and conservatives.

Inga, I'm not the one complaining. You constantly whine about all the mean things others say to you.

You’re among one of the most despicable here. An old curmudgeon who likes to hand it out, but cannot take it. Now run along a read a book.

I admit I'm a curmudgeon and I am pretty old but I can still recognize bullshit when I see it.

Trump was not my first choice but he is tearing up the things that need to be torn up.

His choices of lieutenants has been excellent although I do wish Sessions would take shorter naps.

If you choose to be a punching bag, you have that choice. Meanwhile there are others whose comments are worth reading.

How the story of the 14-year-old (Rachel Corfman) has been debunked?

It really hasn't been but there are suspicious factors. The judge who held the hearing when she allegedly met Moore ruled that she had to move to her fathers house as she was incorrigible. Ten days later she had moved. The alleged calls had to have occured in that ten day window.

She said she met him at a corner near her mother's house. The actual corner is a mile away.

Maybe her memory has faded but then why the exact recollection of what she says he did ?

That and the timing. They also said she was a Trump voter but she has not voted in four years and is on an inactive voter list.

Stuff like that.; 12/11/17, 1:56 PM
Qwinn said...: Note how none of Inga's quotes address just how what Wilson did doesn't qualify as "forgery", as she maintained on Friday.; 12/11/17, 1:59 PM
exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...: "What is obvious is you cannot abide liberal commenters coming here to territory you seem to think belongs exclusively to Trumpists and conservatives"

Wrong again, Inga. What we can't abide is that you can not construct a logical argument or prove a point to save your life. Take this thread: you think that simply asserting that what Moore said was anti-Semitic, rather than just anti-George Soros constitutes an argument because all "rational" people would think so.

"I'm going to ignore the meaning of these words in this order and impose my own meaning on them, the meaning I want them to have!" is not an argument. You did it on this thread and you do it every single time you assert that Trump's line about "they let you grab them by the pussy" constitutes an admission of sexual assault, when it clearly does not. You pretend not to know what the meaning of "let" is.; 12/11/17, 2:02 PM
Jason said...: I just looked up a definition of the "begging the question" fallacy.

It had a picture of KittyM.; 12/11/17, 2:06 PM
mockturtle said...: Woodrow Wilson was an unapologetic racist. Easily the most racist President in US history. He was also a Democrat.; 12/11/17, 2:06 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: Roy Moore's Senate Campaign Is Still Propped Up by Bullshit

“Defenders of the Alabama Senate candidate latched onto a real statement from one of Moore's accusers and distorted it until it became fake news.

On Friday, defenders of the Alabama Senate candidate Moore latched onto a real statement from one of Moore's accusers and distorted it until it became fake news.

Beverly Young Nelson, one of the numerous women who has accused Roy Moore of sexual misconduct—in her case, she says that he assaulted her when she was 16—clarified to a group of assembled press on Friday that the yearbook she claims Roy Moore signed 39 years ago contains his note and signature, but that the text scrawled underneath about the time and place of the signing was her own addition. Nelson explained that it was there to remind her who Moore was.

But when the story got filtered through the editorial departments of America's illustrious right-wing news publications, the takeaway was that the yearbook note was "forged," and Moore was vindicated. "WE CALLED IT! Gloria Allred Accuser **ADMITS** She Tampered With Roy Moore’s Yearbook ‘Signature’ (VIDEO)," said right-wing blog and absolute garbage pile Gateway Pundit. "Roy Moore Accuser Beverly Nelson Admits She Forged Yearbook," wrote Breitbart. Even Fox News accused Nelson of forgery in its headline, but later walked back the intensity of its story (though the url of the story still uses the word "forged").“

https://www.vice.com/en_ca/article/434x59/roy-moores-senate-campaign-is-still-propped-up-by-bullshit; 12/11/17, 2:10 PM
Jason said...: Yes, dumbass, the yearbook note was forged.; 12/11/17, 2:12 PM
theribbonguy said...: "All this might be wasted time, Fox shock poll says Moore down by 10%"

According to Rush, the poll had R's at +2%...R's are +23% in Alabama. So under sampling republicans by 21% give the democrat a 10% lead...OK then.

I don't pretend to know why, but Fox's Poll's have been WAY off since I've been aware of them.

The Real Clear Politics average is +4.7 for Moore as of this morning.; 12/11/17, 2:13 PM
Qwinn said...: I think, going forward, we should track, for each "scandal", what word Inga had to completely redefine in order to maintain her "argument".

Access Hollywood tape: Let = Didn't Let

Moore accusers: Forgery = Something that does not include misrepresenting your oswn writing as someone else's. What possible meaning the word could still have after you exclude that remains unclear.

Moore as anti-Semite: Soros = All Jews.

Any others?; 12/11/17, 2:14 PM
Qwinn said...: Aaah, Inga pretends she didn't insist, on this very blog, over and over, that the ENTIRE signature was Moore's writing.; 12/11/17, 2:17 PM
Unknown said...: I'd dearly love Inga to take a check to a bank and try to cash it where the first half of the signature is real but everything was "added" by herself--you know, notes, annotations, that sort of thing.

I'm sure the bank will accept it as valid, and won't at all call it a forgery.

Right Inga?

--Vance; 12/11/17, 2:19 PM
Inga...Allie Oop said...: “Aaah, Inga pretends she didn't insist, on this very blog, over and over, that the ENTIRE signature was Moore's writing.”

And Quinn now resorts to lies. On Friday I said that just because she added the date and the place of the event, did not mean the entire inscription was fake. Why do you lie? You accuse others of lying, but lie without even a blink of an eye.; 12/11/17, 2:22 PM
Qwinn said...: A partial forgery is still a forgery, Inga. Did Wilson and Alled initially attempt to portray the date and location as Moore's writing? Yes. How do we know? Cause you insisted it was.

In Inga's world, if someone wrote "I hate George Soros", and someone else added "and all other Jews too" and claimed it was all written by the first person, that's not a forgery.; 12/11/17, 2:27 PM
Jason said...: I still want to hear from our resident handwriting expert. He's been on strict radio silence.

For some reason.; 12/11/17, 2:27 PM