Myeshia Johnson sits for an interview with George Stephanopoulos this morning:
Trump's response this morning is: "I had a very respectful conversation with the widow of Sgt. La David Johnson, and spoke his name from beginning, without hesitation!"
Stephanopoulos began the interview with "I hope you're feeling the thoughts and prayers of everyone." Meade, who was listening and not watching, said: "He sounds like he's speaking to a child."
I said: "Well, he's modeling the kind of empathy that he wants us to understand that Trump failed to express. But he sounds smarmy and patronizing which shows how hard it actually is to do it right."
Johnson seemed most concerned with the facts about her husband's death and the treatment of his dead body: "They won’t show me a finger, a hand; I know my husband’s body from head-to-toe and they won’t let me see anything." She sounds troubled by doubt: "I need to see him so I will know that that is my husband."
I'm thinking that alternative response open to Trump is to do something to relieve Johnson of these doubts, but that might not be possible, and Johnson seems clear that she wants nothing to do with Trump. Prompted "Is there anything you'd like to say to the President now?," she says, "Nah, I don't have nothing to say to him."
So maybe it is best for Trump to leave Johnson alone. The anti-Trumpers are not leaving her alone.
At the end of the interview, the other "Good Morning America" host — her name doesn't appear on screen or in the linked article — says in a showbiz-sincere way: "Ugh! It's so powerful! And to have to go through all this while she's grieving her husband! Truly unthinkable, but she's a powerful woman." Well, who's putting her through this? Why does she have to go through it? Who's imposing this on her?
And I'm listening again to that line "I hope you are feeling the thoughts and prayers of everyone." You know, you can trash just about anything anybody says if you want.
I could say it's obviously disingenuous to express that hope, because there is no ability to feel the thoughts and prayers of everyone. It seems to express a belief — which I doubt Stephanopoulos holds — that prayer opens up channels of communication that flow to God and then out to the people who are prayed for. And it's absurd to say that "everyone" is praying for Johnson. It's even offensive, because many people do not believe in prayer.
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395 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 395 of 395"Has Trump responded to the widow?"
Yeah, I don't know, Doc, maybe not.
But the point is, that's what it will turn into. Trump vs. the widow. Mrs. Johnson has said the Congresswoman was right and Trump was wrong. If he starts arguing that, he risks looking like he's calling the widow a liar. Not good. The idea is to get past this. It doesn't matter if the widow is technically wrong (not saying she is or isn't). At this point they each remember it differently and there's no recording.
Trump's the most powerful man in the world and Mrs Johnson is the young, grieving widow of a vet. Trump can afford to be big and say he was wrong even if he believes he wasn't. I think we've all done that at some point in life, except maybe for Chuck.
It's no coincidence that Trump's ill considered words about McCain's service and Trump's draft deferment are in the news again today. They want to drive a wedge between Trump and the military, who seem largely to like him.
Trump should do nothing that will have US soldiers thinking, "what if that was my wife".
hush people -
it took two days to find and recover the body lying there in tropical heat -
probably was also mutilated.
screw up all around.
nobody signs up for higher level screw ups.
not condolences but abject apology needed for sending people in harms way with indifference.
DOD CYA mode - heads need to roll as in naval collisions.
@Dust Bunny Queen ... did not see what you said - thanks,
I love the leftists new found love for the military gold star families.
The vast majority of us veterans fucking hate you people. Shit like this is subhuman.
I bet this widow will eventually turn on the left after they are done using her as well.
"If he starts arguing that, he risks looking like he's calling the widow a liar."
Not to mention that (assuming that the exposure of Kelly's lies re Wilson are indicative) it's likely that more evidence will only prove that DJT is lying about this Gold Star Family.
Not to mention that everyone knows that DJT is a MEGA liar:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/politics/trump-claims-database/?hpid=hp_hp-visual-stories-desktop_no-name%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.d7268d516b19
wwww said....A president has political capitol at the beginning of his term. He looses it quickly. It's really hard to get anything through after that point. It takes a lot to get substantive legislation through. Trump is wasting political capitol on fighting with McConnell, widows, and the NFL. And this is what baffles me -- The base doesn't seem to care.
That's contradictory, though. "Political capital" isn't some value that has no association with his popularity. Someone has political capital becasue of their popularity--it's how they threaten/pose a threat to others (support the popular President or you'll get primaried, etc).
Trump (arguably) had less political capital at the start of his term than any Pres. in my lifetime. From before his inaugural he faced a non-trivial challenge from members of his own (nominal) party who wanted to maneuver to prevent him from taking office! The "serious" Media has declared it their duty to oppose him and naturally the Dems makes ure you know he's Literally Hitler but acksually more dangerous (since his tiny hands are on the nuke button).
Now if you want to say "what little capital he could have had with centrists was wasted when he refused to act Presidential/continued to cater to his base," and there's a lot of truth in that...but the counterexample is Obama's 2nd term where he made no pretense at governing to the middle (or at least he didn't ACT in that way despite what he SAID). Despite that I don't remember a lot of worry about Obama's lack of political capital--he remained solidly popular with his base and wildly popular with the Media and, to their cheers!, accomplished quite a lot with a "pen and a phone." The evidence for his lack of political capital is that he had to use a pen and a phone for much of his 2 terms!
I'm open to the possibility that this pattern will hold for modern Presidents (win narrow victories, get little "done" in traditional senses due to divided government, etc).
DBQ - "However, if that is what she wants.....Give it to her."
please to god they have competent counselors at hand also.
I say since Trump released the audio of his call to Natasha De Alenca, he needs to release the call to Mrs. Johnson!!
If they are gonna be crybabies.. let them know they will be shown to be liars.
"I had a very respectful conversation with the widow of Sgt. La David Johnson, and spoke his name from beginning, without hesitation!"
Stop it, Mr. President. Just stop it, please. Let it lie.
Most folks realize instinctively that one simply doesn't get into a back-and-forth with a young, vulnerable widow.
“Most folks realize instinctively that one simply doesn't get into a back-and-forth with a young, vulnerable widow.”
Most normal folks.
wwww,
This is not a situation within the scope of normality you are describing.
"Because, when we turn off the news, we have our children and our spouse, and everyone is healthy."
But they aren't. They are all much worse off, collectively, than they have been in decades. Perhaps this does not affect you or me or our kids in our respective bubbles, but its not that hard to break out of the bubble and see the general case.
As for political conflict, today it is a terrific wild rage on all parts, as the hegemony is being challenged. You have enormous matters at issue and all is fair given the stakes. This is not normal life, you are close to crises in all spheres.
Nothing shows your respect for the military like calling retired generals racist.
Keep dancing on those graves, leftists.
It's what you do best.
Chuck bleats: Looking at that original Trump Tweet, it looks like it was 4:25 am. Is that right? Can that be right? Trump was up at 4:25 am Tweeting on a subject like this?
From an article by Laura Weller about Trump's routine:
"1. He rises early
Exactly what time Trump rises each day isn’t totally clear, but it’s definitely early. The New York Post reported he typically climbs out of bed around 5:30 a.m., but some sources claim it’s actually much earlier. According to Entrepreneur, Trump gets up as early as 4:00 a.m. One way or another, Trump clearly likes to get his day started as soon as possible.
"This is all Trump. Nobody else to blame."
How could you possibly know? AFAIK, no recording of the call has been made public, but I suppose the word of two black women, one of them who always wears a not-at-all-ridiculous cowboy hat, is enough to impugn Trump.
Lydia said...
"I had a very respectful conversation with the widow of Sgt. La David Johnson, and spoke his name from beginning, without hesitation!"
Stop it, Mr. President. Just stop it, please. Let it lie.
Most folks realize instinctively that one simply doesn't get into a back-and-forth with a young, vulnerable widow.
No. Fuck you people.
The left searches and searches and eventually finds the widow of a slain service member who will say something bad about Trump. Then they throw her on TV to hide the Uranium One scandal.
How about you talk to the vast majority of gold star families that hate the fucking leftists? They are soulless shitheads that are willing to find the small number of people they can trash the president with.
We know the left hates us. The feeling is mutual. The only veterans they put up are the ones they can use for the purpose of gaining power. Bush hung us out to dry. Obama just straight crapped on us and his disdain was clear and returned.
This entire thing smells like a setup.
....and the grieving widow agreed to be part of the setup. She's not that much better than that failed rodeo clown.
CNN really needs to get Liz Wickersham on and have her talk about the constant savage beatings she took from Ted Turner. How it felt to get punched right in the kisser whenever Ted got to drinkin.
Well, who's putting her through this? Why does she have to go through it? Who's imposing this on her?
1. Frederica Wilson. She took it upon herself to throw the grieving widow in front of the pack of media dogs like red meat.
2. George Stephanopoulos. Playing upon the widow's grief for ratings.
Johnson seemed most concerned with the facts about her husband's death and the treatment of his dead body: "They won’t show me a finger, a hand; I know my husband’s body from head-to-toe and they won’t let me see anything." She sounds troubled by doubt: "I need to see him so I will know that that is my husband."
Trump isn't even her issue. Her issue is her pain and her inability to resolve the fact that her husband is dead. ABC used her to try to score anti-Trump points.
Tell me again how it's Trump who is politicizing this story. Tell me again how ABC and Stephanopoulos have anything but fake concern for her and what she's going through.
There is also this increasingly weird assumption (as time goes on, I understand less and less why people still cling to it) that the media is made up of human beings. They are not persons with independent judgement that can be influenced and persuaded. The whole mass should be looked on rather as a machine. That is the proper frame for a disciplined human organization.
They are organizations directed to specific purposes. They cannot be persuaded by human argument or behavior as their agenda comes from their directors, not from their staff. They are tools of their owners, who use them to advance their interests. The only way to "discuss" anything with them is to deal with their owners.
And their owners interests have nothing to do with the subjects of daily controversy, or only very rarely. All that is simply ammunition and tactical position.
AReasonableMan said...
This is all Trump. Nobody else to blame. If he hadn't attacked the previous holders of the office of POTUS in the first place, none of this would have happened, including his call to the grieving widow.
Another own goal by a dumpster fire president.
You are just being purposely stupid.
The Uranium One scandal will hit whether you leftists can carry this stupid shit on or not. The entire left is full of soulless shitheads who will sink to any level to take Trump down and hide their corruption.
Stop it, Mr. President. Just stop it, please. Let it lie.
Most folks realize instinctively that one simply doesn't get into a back-and-forth with a young, vulnerable widow.
Kelly went out to stop it. The media eviscerated him for doing it. They did not care one whit that he lost his own son and thus was himself a gold star parent.
If you want rules, play by them. If you don't play by them, don't call them out as rules.
The exposure of the media's hypocrisy in this regard is at the center of Trump's Presidency.
"his administration has not been competent in media relations'
There is no such thing as "media relations".
They have no independent agency. They are simply mechanisms.
"Also, it refers to the ability to move legislation through Congress. "
This is a function of irreconcilably divergent interests between most of the members of the Senate, at least, and the partisans of Trump. The senators are paid to resist Trumps agenda, as their paymasters direct.
"This widow is letting her husband's death be exploited for political purposes by the Democrats. I don't blame her, though, just the Democrats who are taking advantage of her. Shameful."
I blame her as well. By appearing on this show and letting a congresswoman pop off about what was a private conversation, she is politicizing the hell out of it all by herself.
"Tell me again how it's Trump who is politicizing this story."
He literally started this by bragging about his Gold Star Family outreach being much better than that of other POTUSs. He wasn't even asked about that.
It's all him.
Lets put it this way - maybe I have a unique perspective here, having grown up under two dictatorships. You cannot "argue" with a controlled press. They do as they are told and cannot be moved to adjust their views by some display of virtue, or brilliant logic.
You can speak to these gentlemen over drinks, of an evening, and they will very likely be sympathetic and reasonable in person. But that's not what they are being paid for. The next morning they will be given their line, and do as they are directed.
“Kelly went out to stop it.”
Kelly made it worse. Why did he lie about the Congresswomen’s speech? Are there truly no adults in the White House? Kelly besmirched himself in duty to Trump. How sad. What a disappointment.
Kevin said...
"Stop it, Mr. President. Just stop it, please. Let it lie.
"Most folks realize instinctively that one simply doesn't get into a back-and-forth with a young, vulnerable widow."
Kelly went out to stop it. The media eviscerated him for doing it. They did not care one whit that he lost his own son and thus was himself a gold star parent.
Kelly was widely and largely unanimously praised, for his gravitas and for his relation of his personal experience. Had it simply been a matter of Kelly as Gold Star Parent (and combat officer), along with Mrs. Johnson as Gold Star Widow, Kelly would have been as good as gold.
Kelly was criticized only after it came to light that his political counterpunch aimed at Congresswoman Wilson was wildly off the mark and that he had mischaracterized so much of her speech at the South Florida FBI building dedication. It was a mistake that had "Trump communications" written all over it.
"Kelly went out to stop it. The media eviscerated him for doing it."
He went out and lied.
Presumably he would have done better if he'd been honest.
IMHO.
Achilles
I am on the left - or I guess I am since I vote for Democrats most of the time. However, I don't hate the Gold Star families. I have deep respect for them. I think you are generalizing just a bit too much here. There is a HUGE difference between disliking war and disliking the tactics that our government does around the world vs. actually disliking soldiers, which is completely different.
It makes absolutely no sense to hate military families and people on the left understand this. My respect for anyone who serves is tremendous. Soldier make a great sacrifice for this country. They should all be treated with respect. But by the same token if I dislike Trump or Obama or Bush and their military polices that is my right. Would you agree I have that right AND that there is a big difference between disliking policies vs disliking people who serve?
BTW, since Kelly was caught in his lie (when he lied he didn't count on video tape being able to prove his dishonesty), he's compounding the offence by not correcting the record. Not correcting the record proves that he is okay with deceiving the American people. Like his boss.
IMHO.
Achilles said...
...
...
The Uranium One scandal will hit whether you leftists can carry this stupid shit on or not. The entire left is full of soulless shitheads who will sink to any level to take Trump down and hide their corruption.
Would it shock you if I said that the Uranium One scandal is a much bigger deal than the Widow Johnson? I suppose it might.
But of course the reason that so many of the stories that ought to be more newsworthy keep getting pushed off the front page, is because of Trump's obsession with personal matters.
It happens week after week. When we should have the White House doing "Infrastructure Week" or "Healthcare Week" or "Immigration Week," we instead get fights about Inauguration crowd sizes, Mika Brzezinski's face, Scaramucci, and Joe Arpaio.
“It makes absolutely no sense to hate military families and people on the left understand this. My respect for anyone who serves is tremendous. Soldier make a great sacrifice for this country. They should all be treated with respect.”
Not only does it make no sense, it is a lie. There are plenty on the Left who serve this nation in the military and who are veterans.
"I think you are generalizing just a bit too much here"
I think not. There is a deep dislike - or perhaps more usually a condescending contempt - for people who join the military, among the haut-bourgeois class of liberals. Joining the military is very much not the done thing. They will oppose even ROTC/JROTC programs, which other people support, on the grounds of general ickyness.
I have been on the ground in these struggles, and I have seen and heard the other side here.
"Can anyone think of any reason for the media to have reported what the congresswoman had to say about the call?"
Are you kidding? A super-intelligent woman like that? Of course we'd want to hear every bit of wisdom that falls from her mouth. To the people who elected, she's probably a regular Madame de Stael.
Chuck made some good points in his most recent comment.
But, he's wrong about the Mooch.
Getting rid of that dude was mistake. So much fun. And gal sunglasses. Maybe gal clothes, too, incl under--we'll never know. Sad!
"But of course the reason that so many of the stories that ought to be more newsworthy keep getting pushed off the front page, is because of Trump's obsession with personal matters."
Chuck, as you well know, the press is managed. The newsworthiness of anything is entirely a matter of the propaganda line. I know you are smart enough to understand this, I wonder why you refuse it?
“Joining the military is very much not the done thing.”
Do you think no one serving in the military voted for Democrats and are left of center? In what reality?
"A super-intelligent woman like that?"
Wasn't she a gal who ran somesorta get blacks (incl La David) to pull themselves up by boots and such?
Sounds like an admirable gal, IMHO.
The Congresswoman's present actions clearly show General Kelly wasn't wrong in the judgement he formed of her character after the Florida memorial service, even if he misremembered some of the details.
"Do you think no one serving in the military voted for Democrats and are left of center? In what reality?"
The people who own your party consider them a sort of untouchable caste. There are exceedingly few kids out of Pacific Heights, SF, joining the military, even if they are independently wealthy (as they nearly all are).
So how did you know of this incident? Obviously he was criticized for it somewhere, that you in turn read and then posted the incident here.
I linked to the story about it. It is from that story I found out about it. It was hard to find when searching for it. You know why? Because it wasn't on all the news channels for a week.
Why do you say he was obviously criticized for it? It was reported on, but as I said, find me the criticism similar to what Congressman Wilson did.
"You misrepresent Americans."
36 years in America. Mostly in San Francisco. Married an American and raised kids in America. I have long experience with American society, corporations, workplaces, schools, school boards (hence JROTC), universities (having recruited in dozens).
You may be out in some small town where your real leaders are not, but I have met a good number of them.
"Kelly went out to stop it. The media eviscerated him for doing it."
He went out and lied.
Kelly was a gold star parent discussing the death of his son. I keep hearing the rules are that anything a grieving parent says while discussing the death of their loved one is not to be challenged in the name of good taste.
Furthermore, Fredrica Wilson said "empty barrel", which comes from Plato, was a racist term. Did she "lie"? Is she going to apologize? Where is the fucking media outrage about her "lies"? Where are the op-eds calling on her to apologize?
Or are we just singling out gold star parents this week?
I'm truly sick of the "lies" which go one way and never the other.
Either we have an absolute standard of truth regardless of race, creed, color or party.
Or we have a bunch of empty barrels running around believing they are the truth squad.
Its seems everyone is using this woman and her pain for their political purpose, including Wilson who wasted no time going to the media to criticize Trump's clumsy call. I cannot imagine being in this kind of pain, while everyone - the media, Wilson, etc are trying to gain political points with this, keeping the wife stirred up and aggravated over a relativity minor issue. Trump did start this by bragging about these calls, and made it worse after Wilson's accusation, but he's not the only one trying to make political hay out of it. Wilson asked who would 'say such a thing to a grieving widow?" But who would magnify her pain and put her on display to win points against a politic opponent?
Regarding maturity of thought, expression, and behavior (i.e. NFL players and the widow of Sgt Johnson, with allowances for grief) I submit that excuses for poor behavior should not be based on age.
The average age of pilots in WW2 was 21. The average age of US soldiers after D-Day was 20. The average age of an infantryman in Vietnam was 22 (though tradition says 19). At 21 I was on site for my first well blowout. At 22 I was project managing $6M wells in the Everglades (with much guidance from more experienced "Companymen") and at 23 I had to deal with a blowout, a death and subsequent lawsuit. The blowouts are "lowlights" of course. The highlights far outweigh the the bad.
The extension of childhood into a person's 30's has been nothing but disastrous for our society. Most people will rise exactly to the level of the expectations that are placed on them.
msb1958
Back in the days of Bill Clinton's administration, when I watched Meet the Press, George Stephanopoulos was Bill's press secretary at the time and George would be on the show week after week defending Bill with that same look of earnest sincerity. I would turn to my husband and say (regarding Stephanopoulos and the Clintons) "These are truly sleazy people." Things have only gotten worse.
They cannon really answer her questions until they've finished the investigation.
She thinks she wants to see the body, but she may regret it - if he was severely damaged, it might bring only paid. Perhaps some pathologist can run a test to reassure her. But just because they've recommended she not see it doesn't not point to a cover up.
"I'm truly sick of the "lies" which go one way and never the other."
As I have often said, and based on my long experience of dictatorships, you cannot argue with a controlled press. They are not persuadable, they are not independent-thinking human beings. They are hirelings. They are told to say what they say. Speaking back is exactly like speaking to a stone wall.
The only way to fight propaganda is with an infrastructure of counter-propaganda, at which point you have a battle of very similar systems. Which will continue until one side or the other breaks down.
“You may be out in some small town where your real leaders are not, but I have met a good number of them.”
I am an American, left of center politically. I was raised in a major city, live within 30 miles of a major city. You don’t speak for Democrats and those on the Left. You mischaracterize their patriotism based on your warped observations. My family members serve this nation, have been to war zones, are left of center and vote for Democrats. Stop trying to tell us on the Left what we think. You are wrong, you don’t understand Americans, that is obvious
Kevin,
Do you have a link of Wilson saying that that phrase is racist? Somewhere I heard her avoiding the assessment that Kelly was one of the white supremacists she claims are in the WH. If you can show that she said Kelly refereed to her w/ a racist phrase, that'd be her contracting what I heard her say.
Link?
"Either we have an absolute standard of truth regardless of race, creed, color or party."
If we did have this you'd be expressing opposition to Kelly's lies.
Presumably that's forthcoming.
Perhaps some pathologist can run a test to reassure her.
DoD keeps DNA on "file." If there was any doubt or lost dogtags, I'm sure it was tested.
"Ugh! It's so powerful! And to have to go through all this while she's grieving her husband! Truly unthinkable, but she's a powerful woman."
"All this" being the national TV interview that you had your staff beg her to do, and that she agreed to? Yes, unthinkable.
anti-de Sitter space said...Kelly....He went out and lied.
No, I watched the full 2015 speech Wilson gave. Kelly was remembering his impression of that speech, but remembered some of the details wrong. She spent time highlighting her contribution in the naming of the building, not in the funding of the building. Kelly viewed that as unseemly, and I can see why - it seems unseemly to spend time highlighting yourself, publicizing your personal contribution, at a memorial / naming event. In fact, its rather Trumpian!
He should have double checked it rather than relying on his memory, but she did blah, blah for several minutes about her own efforts.
Yes, it would be nice if Trump had squelched the dumpster fire with a nice note to the widow and perhaps an Oval Office meeting.
On the other hand, he didn't start it. He tried to do something nice and it got distorted. He reacted like he was being attacked, because he was being attacked. In his clownish way, he got the main point right. Then progs keep at it, he sends out Kelly. Kelly was very nice and respectable, trying to put out the dumpster fire very civilly. But no dice: the left keeps at it, trotting out the widow, complaining that Kelly "lied" (when the point about Wilson's grandstanding was apropos), and so on.
I wish we had a more subtle CoC, who calls Wilson on her BS with withering sarcasm, who tears up the Dem talking points with Althousian fiskiness, who humiliates the media as the tools they are. But in this war, I'll take bluster as second best.
Do you have a link of Wilson saying that that phrase is racist?
Do you have Google?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGnZt6kw3_I
"Stop trying to tell us on the Left what we think. You are wrong, you don’t understand Americans, that is obvious"
I have seen a huge range of Americans.
In this case specifically, I have seen the sort of Americans that determine your media line and fund your party. These people don't live down your way.
An excellent place to find them, and their proteges, and I have participated for decades, are in the San Francisco School board and Board of Supervisors. It is surprisingly important. It is where aspiring Democratic politicians tend to start out of the San Francisco machines, such as the old Pat and later Willie Brown machines, and the SF bourgeois (Feinstein/Newsom) machine. A great number get to Sacramento, and many get to Washington.
My family members serve this nation, have been to war zones, are left of center and vote for Democrats.
I thank them for their service.
However, it's not wrong to note that people in the military are far more conservative than the country as a whole:
IIn the latest survey, nearly half of respondents identified as Republicans, and only 18 percent as Democrats.
https://www.militarytimes.com/news/2016/05/09/military-times-survey-troops-prefer-trump-to-clinton-by-a-huge-margin/
Either that the military turns liberals into conservatives at an astounding rate, or people growing up with conservative values are much more likely to enter the military.
This was not always so, and it is a grave threat to the nation.
To the usual suspects.
Trump made a hash out of a sympathy call to a woman who lost her husband.
let me ask you a question. Would you rather he just ignored it and just go golfing as Obama did through many a crisis?
“He should have double checked it rather than relying on his memory, but she did blah, blah for several minutes about her own efforts.”
She emphasized the bipartisan effort, not her own efforts.
""All this" being the national TV interview that you had your staff beg her to do, and that she agreed to? Yes, unthinkable."
Actually, "all this" means the POTUS forgetting her husband's name while saying that this unknown soldier's Sad! death was what he signed up for. Then, POTUS and Kelly lying. While she and Wilson have been shown to be truthful.
Ya gots your timeline all mixed up. BTW, as you update your facts you should pay careful attention to DJT initially politicizing this re the origin of this.
Rusty,
Check your facts re DJT golfing v BHO golfing.
That talkin' point don't hunt no more.
Trump has really stepped in it with the people who already hate him.
How did it work out for W to give up golf to appease his critics?
President Bone Spurs will always be good with his base, the 35%.
Trump is wasting political capitol on fighting with McConnell, widows, and the NFL. And this is what baffles me -- The base doesn't seem to care
How many times does it need to be said? Trump's base loves Trump because he fights back, not even though he fights back. The more he is attacked by the Left as Republicans always are, and he responds by fighting back instead of rolling over, the more his base loves him.
She emphasized the bipartisan effort, not her own efforts.
Kelly impression was that she was an empty barrel banging on about her effort. She really did spend time taking about ...they came to me and asked me....and I ..... for several minutes of his 10 minute speech. But it was about the naming and not the funding.
She said he lied because she wasn't involved in the funding. I say he mis-remembered the nature of her 'contribution' but lying isn't really the right charge against him. You may disagree that the was self-promoting at that event - his opinion was that she was. I think she's cringe-worthy.
Video published Friday by the Sun Sentinel of south Florida showed Wilson spent several minutes claiming credit for legislation that named the building for two slain FBI agents, but she made no mention of winning funding for it.
He was wrong in his detail, but right in the whole, I say.
Actually, "all this" means the POTUS forgetting her husband's name...
What evidence do you have that Trump forgot her husband's name? Whether he used it or didn't, there is zero evidence presented that the President could not recall the soldier's name.
It was a conjecture by the widow which has been picked up and repeated as if it were truth.
Is this not a lie? Are you not lying?
I wonder what Wonder Woman Hillary Clinton's approval rating is right now? I guess Democrats figure that once she was in charge of the administration, none of the Russian stuff would have surfaced.
Trump is wasting political capitol on fighting with McConnell, widows, and the NFL. And this is what baffles me -- The base doesn't seem to care
I suppose you are similarly baffled that he beat all those Republican Party stalwarts.
I suppose you are equally baffled he beat Hillary.
LilyB,
Thanks for the link. I'm MAGA-ing w/ at least two other things while in these threads. So, googling is too much hassle v the return re effort. But, obviously I was wrong, i.e. this gal was dumb to make the statement you linked too:
"That's a racist term, too. I'm thinking about that one. We looked it up in the dictionary because I had never heard of an empty barrel. And I don't like to be dragged into something like that," Wilson told CNN Friday morning. "The only thing I want to be dragged into right now is getting back our girls who are the victims of Boko Haram in Nigeria."
BTW, some blacks do say that Kelly's using this phrase to call her loud while stupid is based on her race:
http://www.theroot.com/john-kelly-should-stfu-about-congresswoman-frederica-wi-1819719138
If he hadn't been caught lying about her re the FBI building, he'd be better positioned to rebut this. It's especially bad for him that he's letting his lies about her stand w/o correction. As long as he does this Wilson and other blacks can ID his truculent POV as white privilege run amok. Why else would he not tell the truth?
We've got some new lefty trolls. Who is "de sitter?"
Inga we always have with us like the poor.
Then there is LLR.
I can recall wwww from some time ago but he/she is not unbiased. Just another lefty like Inga.
This is a Journolist operation to hide Uranium One behind a wall of lies.
I admit Trump gets into these things when he might have avoided mentioning previous presidents but what he said is probably true.
The only tome Obama talked to military was Medals of Honor recipients and he even lied there,
Bush did have some visits and Trump probably erred there.
This is war, as buwaya says and Inga showed her racism quickly by calling him a "filipino"
Scratch a leftist and you always get a racist. Stephanopolis way of talking to her is only one more sign.,
Amazing the standards of proof you guys have for Republicans vs yours for Democrats.
anti-de Sitter space said...10/23/17, 3:45 PM
Who has to look up empty barrel in the dictionary? Such a silly thing to say.
Probably what they really did was an exhaustive internet search for some support to call it r acist.
If he hadn't been caught lying about her re the FBI building, he'd be better positioned to rebut this
I agree. He should have checked his facts or left it out. His speech was fine without that remark. But getting your details wrong gives people a reason to say you're a liar. I think 'liar' is harsh.
" As long as he does this Wilson and other blacks can ID his truculent POV as white privilege run amok. Why else would he not tell the truth?"
None of this matters. The MSM will say and repeat whatever they think they need to independent of what anyone else says or does.
This is a propaganda line being put out in an organized fashion. All these people are simply machine components.
And you know this. I wonder in what sense you fit into the machine, where the wires are, the maker of your PLC's.
de sitter is PB&J
“This is war, as buwaya says and Inga showed her racism quickly by calling him a "filipino".”
He is Filipino, not American. Nothing racist about it. He’s been living in this country for over 30 years, self reportedly and has not bothered to become a US citizen. He will not get away with mischaracterizing patriotic Americans on the Left.
Standard Alinsky Tactic on accusing Kelly of having lied, sigh.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rules_for_Radicals
#4 "Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules." If the rule is that every letter gets a reply, send 30,000 letters. You can kill them with this because no one can possibly obey all of their own rules.
Since he was not 100% correct on his memory of the Congress Lady, he is a liar, and can be disregarded.
Also a bit of rule #13:
"Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it." Cut off the support network and isolate the target from sympathy. Go after people and not institutions; people hurt faster than institutions.
Kevin,
DJT's character witness re who's telling the truth was caught lying about Wilson during his testimony re DJT's truthfulness. And, he still is standing by his lie. Like his boss.
At this point even DJT supporters aren't denying Wilson's original claim that what DJT first tweeted (re Wilson's comment re DJT content re La David signing up) was a lie. Instead of questioning the original content that Wilson reported, DJT supporters are now saying that DJT's words were clumsily delivered.
No more: "The Fake News is going crazy with wacky Congresswoman Wilson(D), who was SECRETLY on a very personal call, and gave a total lie on content!"
And, non-political DJT:
“I hope the Fake News Media keeps talking about Wacky Congresswoman Wilson in that she, as a representative, is killing the Democrat Party!”
Sucks to be you.
I am shocked that somebody is being so racist to a person of color on this blog!
We are all citizens of the world!
>He is Filipino, not American. Nothing racist about it.
Special Counsel Robert Mueller has broadened his investigation, originally focused on Donald Trump's ties with Russia, to a major Hillary Clinton bundler who worked for Ukraine's Party of Regions, a political group backed by Russian President Vladimir Putin.
LOL
"But getting your details wrong gives people a reason to say you're a liar. I think 'liar' is harsh."
Not when you won't go back and correct the record after your error is exposed.
Then, the lack of correction proves that you originally knew you were lying and it was intentional.
"de sitter is PB&J"
Thanks for remembering. I've been at least two other names since then. And, at least half a dozen before that.
"He should have checked his facts or left it out. His speech was fine without that remark."
He did not mention her name and the difference between what he said and what she said is insignificant. She claimed credit
Tim in Vermont asks, somewhat rhetorically: How did it work out for W to give up golf to appease his critics?
Appeasement never works. Never. And Trump's critics would never be appeased so it's fruitless and demeaning to try. I wouldn't give them a sliver of Czechoslovakia.
", the lack of correction PROVES that you originally "
Where did you learn logic?
“She claimed credit.”
No she didn’t. It’s pathetic to see how this whole brouhaha is being made worse by Trump sycophants willing to lie for him. Disgusting display.
" You're a newby, yet acting like you own the blog. "
The left really hate free speech. I don't remember how long I've been commenting but it is years not as a "newby."
I don't "own the blog" and never claimed to . Last year before the election, I was subjected to so many vicious personal attacks by lefties here that I decided to stop commenting until after the election.
A number of other commenters, more than ten, emailed me to ask that I return. You were not one.
You are a lefty. Why not admit it ? Even Inga does.
If Wilson was really a friend to Mrs. Johnson, when Mrs. Johnson felt 'hurt' by the call, she should have told Johnson "don't worry about him, he's not important to us". And moved on. It would have been the kindest thing to do. But, no, Wilson had to go out and use this to hit Trump. Its kept this thing stirred up, and likely made the whole event even more painful for the widow.
If you think Trump is an insensitive oaf, have to consider Wilson one too.
"He is Filipino, not American. "
Well, technically I am as much Spanish as Filipino. I hold both nationalities and passports. And the family is dispersed around the world, and we grew up in an expat society. This gives me a unique perspective I think.
I see you and your affairs from a considerable emotional distance, as a colony of ants, from above. Some of you choose to see only one ant at a time, I know to look for their trails and holes, what they are collectively doing, as I have seen many ant colonies.
However, you are in any case indulging in a very weird sort of genetic fallacy. It is a very strange sort of thing.
What kind of grieving widow invites a politician to sit in on a personal condolence call and the goes public to complain? She could have not taken the call if she didn't want to talk to Trump, but she chose to take it with Congress-person at her elbow.
This all sounds like a set-up. Reminds me of the Khan family at the DNC, whom it turns out are Democratic Party activists. The loss of a family member is real, and then the family dishonors the deceased by turning him into a political football.
But somehow Trump is the insensitive one? And Kelly is planning a coup (per The New Yorker in one of the most insane things I have ever read).
I am sorry for her husband and sorry for her and her family losing him.
But who chose to politicize this? Not Trump, not Kelly--this widow and her Congress-critter did. So I have sympathy for her loss, but none for her being in the political cross-fire. She chose that all on her own, over treating the memory of her lost husband with dignity and respect.
Somebody may wind up in Hell for what they are doing, but it won't be Trump (or Kelly).
I wish I didn't have to be so cynical, but whenever I relax I find I was not cynical enough.
Leaders are not always 'sensitive'. Nor do they have to be.
LilyB,
I keep repeating: this whole thing started w/ DJT choosing to brag about his Gold Star Family outreach as being far superior to that of other POTUSs. He did this w/o being asked about this. In this case it's real easy to figure where the buck starts and stops.
Sheesh.
For those of you who are sick of this whole discussion watch this(USMC Sgt. Zachary J. Walters KIA Homecoming)
Martin,
The congress gal had a decades long relationship w/ this family, incl knowing and mentoring La David.
“What kind of grieving widow invites a politician to sit in on a personal condolence call and the goes public to complain? She could have not taken the call if she didn't want to talk to Trump, but she chose to take it with Congress-person at her elbow.”
The Congresswoman is a family friend, she knew La David Johnson since he was a boy. The widow has every right to have with her who she chooses. Now the demonization of the widow begins in earnest. Deplorable.
Unknown said...“She claimed credit.” No she didn’t. It’s pathetic to see how this whole brouhaha is being made worse by Trump sycophants willing to lie for him.
I watched the 2015 video. She spent a good portion of her 10 minute speech outlining her role in the naming of the building. Kelly found this unseemly. He seems to think she should have excluded discussion her own efforts and talked about the dead FBI agents. You and he may disagree about whether her speech was out of bounds, but he didn't lie, and we're not lying. Having a difference of opinion about what is and is not appropriate speech material Is Not Lying.
To understand just how weird the "He is Filipino, not American" complaint is, from a Democrat, conduct the mental exercise of saying the same thing in SF State, or UC Berkeley, or UCLA, or Cal State Hayward. Or for that matter, Stanford.
The expunging will be instant.
I keep repeating: this whole thing started w/ DJT choosing to brag about his Gold Star Family outreach as being far superior to that of other POTUSs. He did this w/o being asked about this. In this case it's real easy to figure where the buck starts and stops.
He did start it. And Wilson extended it when she decided to make a public issue of what Trump said. We don't know if he was actually clumsy (very possible) or if they're Trump detractors and therefore ripe to take offense as slight provocation.
No one has covered themselves in glory here. Knock off the Double Standard Sheesh yourself!
“I watched the 2015 video.”
I watched the entire 2015 speech also. She emphasized the bipartisan effort and she most certainly did speak of the FBI agents that were killed, she even got their names right.
Michael K,
I will respond to you if you post substance. If you want to have a name-calling exchange, I'm not interested.
Listen to how the lefties argue when they think they have the facts on their side, compared to issues like the fact that Mueller and Obama and Clinton were waist deep in with the Russians. Mueller might have to look into where HRC's campaign manager got 75K shares of Gazprom!
The challenge is a huge percentage of the US population believes the Media:
- Can't accept Donald Trump was fairly elected President
- Slants Coverage Against Trump (94% I think per some study)
- Does not represent them, or even understand them.
- Favors the Democratic Party
And they thinks more of Trump than the Media #fakenews
And think more of Trump than Congress.
So all this noise against Trump, coming from what is seen as biased sources, has little or no impact.
Unknown said...She emphasized the bipartisan effort and she most certainly did speak of the FBI agents that were killed, she even got their names right.
A difference of opinion is not a lie. And, btw, she stumbled over the names. It appeared to me that she didn't know her own speech very well, so garbled was her presentation. I would not be surprised that it was the first or second time she'd ever read it!
"K__DSS_!"
WTF?
Among so many other things, I blame this odd culture of capitalization on DJT. No, I don't have any proof or causation data. That sorta thing is for nerds. I don't need that fakeness [btw, this is also DJT's fault, cause of the president precedent].
Carry on.
" If you want to have a name-calling exchange, I'm not interested."
Good. I believe that you began the name calling.
“A difference of opinion is not a lie. And, btw, she stumbled over the names. It appeared to me that she didn't know her own speech very well, so garbled was her presentation. I would not be surprised that it was the first or second time she'd ever read it!”
Maybe she should take lessons from President Bone Spurs on public speaking.
"I would not be surprised that it was the first or second time she'd ever read it!"
She shoulda put in some of the free-style flair that DJT uses when reading a speech on his teleprompter for the first time.
"So true, so true"
Or, she could go full DJT and talk about the SOBs and such.
" Having a difference of opinion about what is and is not appropriate speech material Is Not Lying."
No, if you are around lefties much you will see that any disagreement is a lie and racist.
Sorry but that is what it is. Bush should have learned this years ago.
BTW, DJT talking about the very fine folks who hang w/ peeps w/ torches chanting "the Jews will not replace us" was a DJT ad lib.
Shockingly that wasn't in the printed text he was reading.
Who'd-a guessed?
" If you want to have a name-calling exchange, I'm not interested."
Good. I believe that you began the name calling.
Michael,
I will assume good faith. It appears we have had a misunderstanding, as I do not know what you are talking about. I don't recall having an exchange with you on this thread prior to you calling me a troll. Is this a misunderstanding? Did you not mean to call me a troll? To me, it sounded as if you were trying to start something personal.
If I have offended, I apologize. I sincerely do not recall any personal or subject exchange with you on this thread prior to your post about trolls.
anti-de Sitter space said...10/23/17, 4:27 PM
T rumps shortcommings don't excuse hers. This was Kelly's impression of her performance.
He often makes me cringe. So does she.
"Or, she could go full DJT and talk about the SOBs and such"
Been done.
Look up Alan Grayson D-FLA
He is Filipino, not American" complaint is, from a Democrat
The color diversity quota has been filled. Your services are no longer needed.
Oh yes, what did happen at Charlottesville? Seems like we will never get any facts.
LilyB,
His claim was wrong.
Why do you think he was unjustifiably irked by non-existent offenses that he imagined kwere coming from Wilson when they didn't actually come from her?
Why not conclude that he doesn't like black congress gals giving speeches? I'm far from a golden-years person, but I do think that a lot of y'all are racists. It's what y'all are used to.
An alternative is that he has some sorta undiagnosed medical/mental disorder.
Or, he's just not smart enough to know/assess/recall reality.
I dunno.
buwaya
I have spent a lot of time in San Francisco over the past 30 years. I love San Francisco. But it is not representative of the way Democrats think all across the country. I grew up in Colorado and the Democrats there are very different. I spent time in the east coast and the Democrats are very different as well. One cannot or should not extrapolate one small region as being representative of all people who happen to consider themselves liberals or Democrats or not right of center. The same applies to all political views. Conservatives do not all think alike either.
“He is Filipino, not American" complaint is, from a Democrat.”
Has he at long last become a citizen? No? Well then, he’s not an American. Do you call all green card holders Americans? No? Then why the outrage?
"Has he at long last become a citizen? No? "
And another thought experiment - say this in California, also, and see what your fellow Democrats do to you.
Why not conclude that he doesn't like black congress gals giving speeches?
OMG, seriously? You're an idiot.
Why not conclude that he doesn't like black congress gals giving speeches?
He's obviously racist because reasons.
“And another thought experiment - say this in California, also, and see what your fellow Democrats do to you.”
Oh baloney. I’ve been to California many times, have friends and relatives living there who are liberals. You really have a twisted view of liberals and Democrats. Your observations are not trustworthy.
"One cannot or should not extrapolate one small region as being representative of all people"
No, but it is an excellent representation of a class of people, the sort of which is extraordinarily concentrated and nationally influential, especially those from here and from New York. Let us call them the Democratic haut-bourgeois. They are the tastemakers and money-suppliers, and at a much higher level, those whose interests drive American politics.
“No, but it is an excellent representation of a class of people....”
Wrong again.
Here's another touching and instructive video of the return of a KIA Marine.Todd Heisler - Final Salute
Inga,
Go, as I said, to SF State, set up a card table, put out a sign saying that so and so should not be listened to because he isn't a citizen, and isn't a native. Try this in any university.
And repeat if you like, elsewhere. Do it in front of SF City Hall, or LA, or the Statehouse in Sacramento.
Lilybart - Great comment!
>He often makes me cringe. So does she.
“Go, as I said, to SF State, set up a card table, put out a sign saying that so and so should not be listened to because he isn't a citizen, and isn't a native. Try this in any university.”
You are not to be listened to as a truth teller, because you are mischaracterizing the patriotism of Americans on the Left. You are attempting to tell us Democrats and liberals that your observations are representative of Democrats and liberals nation wide. That is bullshit and you can try to be as cagey as you want, but that is what you said way upstream. You don’t have the gravitas to tell me, a liberal Democratic American how patriotic my party and my fellow Democrats are.
It appears we have had a misunderstanding, as I do not know what you are talking about. I don't recall having an exchange with you on this thread prior to you calling me a troll.
"I can recall wwww from some time ago but he/she is not unbiased. Just another lefty like Inga."
I don't consider Inga a troll but I do have that opinion about PB&J/de sitter and about Ritmo who posts only nasty adhominums.
I did not mean to include you and I apologize for that.
I do feel your posts show a definite left bias but that is also true of Inga but she has been sensible when commenting about something she knows about like health care,
Anyway, I get enough nasty comments directed at me by a few trolls and by a couple of people who have issues I don't understand.
I don't want to add to that number.
I mainly read and comment here for a few very good commenters like buwaya and several others.
I gave up on Patterico when he went off the deep end on Trump.
The blogs I mainly read and comment on are this one and Powerline. I used to read and comment on Washington Monthly but the vicious attacks and hostility drove me away. Ditto for HuffPo.
I was not an early Trump supporter as might be determined from my posts and comments at Chicagoboyz where I have posted for years,
I do think Hillary would have been a disaster and am grateful for his win, which I did not expect,
I consider the entire federal government to be corrupt. I agree with Angelo Codevilla and have met him and attended his lectures.
"Wrong again."
Grounds for objection?
% of Stanford in ROTC/OCS?
Note; you CAN do ROTC in Stanford, but partly because of extremely small numbers (and also social hostility) the programs actually are run out of less much tony Santa Clara U and another private U I don't recall.
% of SF College Prep or University High or any expensive private school enlisting?
or for that matter joining ROTC?
I know these people very very well.
"You are not to be listened to as a truth teller, because you are mischaracterizing the patriotism of Americans on the Left."
He's harder on the cons. Though unintentionally. He likes to describe cons as losers who are on a hair trigger re upending the constitution to steal resources from the job-creators (aka coastal elites) who are responsible for making America great and powerful v the world.
5th generation Californian here - I agree with his Buwaya's observations...
I view his comments more of a Tocqueville. Very insightful.
>“And another thought experiment - say this in California, also, and see what your
>fellow Democrats do to you.”
To understand California more, I highly recommend Read Victor Davis Hanson. He writes of the Central Valley and the Coastal areas.
http://victorhanson.com/
As the Democratic Party has moved into identity politics, they have left the White working class behind that is very pro Military and Patriotic. The top schools also discriminate against the White Working Clas, favoring the elites that are usually White and Asian, with a few minorities allowed in. The Military is seen as the enemy, and something not to be trusted and neutered as much as possible. War is seen as something we have grown beyond. And terrorism can be dealt through police channels. Patriotism is seen as a danger, since they believe this is what caused World War 2. Globalization and Open Borders is the answer. The US unfairly is using it's share of the worlds resources.
In CA politics, it's basically Left and Lefter in a one party state. Heavy influence of government unions such as Teachers and Prison Guards. Southern California has become very Hispanic, due to immigration legal and other.
Big Business has moved out of CA. Aerospace industry largely left, along with the Defense industry. Defense was because other states due a better job of keeping the pork going, and CA congressional delegation R and D would have problems agreeing on the time of day. The business climate has become very anti business. Huge outflow of the Middle Class to other states, being replaced by Immigrants. People are being priced out of the Real Estate Market.
"Huge outflow of the Middle Class to other states, being replaced by Immigrants. People are being priced out of the Real Estate Market."
Right, those wetbacks show up w/ a couple hundred mil, and then middle class folks can't buy a house = economics 101
Got it.
http://www.sfweekly.com/news/jrotc-under-fire-in-s-f-schools/
On a snapshot of the SF JROTC controversies in the 2000's.
I was at that meeting described, and many others.
What struck me most was, beside the public testimony, the interactions between the crowds of spectators. You had a mainly-Asian bunch of parents and kids, many in uniform, carrying US flags. And on the other side a bunch of SF political-activist types looking daggers at them. The hate was boiling.
California is the leader, California is the future.
" those wetbacks "
Indians. They are legal.
Michael K.
What lectures to you recommend in So Ca to attend? Are where to find them?
I wish Diplomad would have had a speaking event before he moved...
>I agree with Angelo Codevilla and have met him and attended his lectures.
"If he hadn't attacked the previous holders of the office of POTUS in the first place"
Here are the relevant portions of the transcript:
Q Why haven't we heard anything from you so far about the Soldiers that were killed in Niger? And what do you have to say about that?
THE PRESIDENT: I've written them personal letters. They've been sent, or they're going out tonight, but they were written during the weekend. I will, at some point during the period of time, call the parents and the families -- because I have done that, traditionally. I felt very, very badly about that. I always feel badly. It's the toughest -- the toughest calls I have to make are the calls where this happens, soldiers are killed. It's a very difficult thing. Now, it gets to a point where, you know, you make four or five of them in one day -- it's a very, very tough day. For me, that's by far the toughest.
So, the traditional way -- if you look at President Obama and other Presidents, most of them didn't make calls, a lot of them didn't make calls. I like to call when it's appropriate, when I think I'm able to do it. They have made the ultimate sacrifice.
So, generally, I would say that I like to call. I'm going to be calling them. I want a little time to pass. I'm going to be calling them. I have -- as you know, since I've been President, I have.
But in addition, I actually wrote letters individually to the soldiers we're talking about, and they're going to be going out either today or tomorrow.
Yes.
Trump says he's in the process of contacting the families, he's written them letters, and he's going to also make "tough" calls to them. He hasn't called on them because he wants a little time to pass, and he's doing it even though most presidents didn't make calls.
There is nothing there that is false. It all stems from a question about why we haven't heard more about the soldiers who were killed, and the subtext is that he is focused on the families of the soldiers before he makes any public statements about them.
After a twelve more questions, we get this:
Q Earlier, you said that President Obama never called the families of fallen soldiers. How can you make that claim?
THE PRESIDENT: I don't know if he did. No, no, no, I was told that he didn't often. And a lot of Presidents don't; they write letters. I do --
Q (Inaudible.)
THE PRESIDENT: Excuse me, Peter. I do a combination of both. Sometimes -- it’s a very difficult thing to do, but I do a combination of both. President Obama I think probably did sometimes, and maybe sometimes he didn't. I don't know. That's what I was told. All I can do -- all I can do is ask my generals. Other Presidents did not call. They’d write letters. And some Presidents didn't do anything. But I like the combination of -- I like, when I can, the combination of a call and also a letter.
First, Trump didn't say Obama "never" called. That is a mischaracterization of what he said. It's as much of a "lie" as what Kelly said about Wilson.
And when asked about Obama specifically, he said he didn't know specifically about Obama but a lot of presidents didn't call. He doesn't know what every one did, but his generals have told him that not all presidents called.
This is exactly what Kelly said in his remarks.
And this is what you have for Trump "politicizing" the whole thing?
It reads to me as if the press tried to get him into a "gotcha" moment, and then ran with a story about how he specifically attacked Obama, when the initial answer didn't single out Obama but lumped him in with all the previous officeholders. And on follow-up questioning, Trump was careful to not say what Obama specifically did or did not do.
A real news organization might have found that part of the transcript interesting. Might have done some research into who called and who didn't. And might have presented the facts - which would have borne out Trump's statement that some did and some didn't call.
But no, our media ran with:
Trump Falsely Claims Obama Didn't Contact Families of Fallen Troops - NYT
Obama aides attack Trump's claim that Obama didn't call families of dead soldiers: 'He's a deranged animal' - Independent
Obama aides lash out after Trump claims past presidents didn't call fallen soldiers' families - Politico
President Trump falsely claims Obama and other presidents didn’t call families of dead soldiers - Daily News
There's your politicizing. It's from a media looking for a scoop and a story to boost ratings, not what Trump actually said during the press conference.
Buw,
Nice call.
I did notice that the quote I excerpted didn't say "illegal."
But, the ones you're worried about re tech jobs aren't showin' up w/ hundreds of millions either. And, so it wouldn't-a mattered re my comment.
BTW, did ya see the NYT piece today saying that AI jobs start at $300M to $500M (I apologize for using M for thousand, it's like fingers on the board for me to use k)?
F-ing loser Americans have all the opportunists to be completely F-ing filthy rich (or at least deep into the so-called one percent), so I will never give into this BS that we need to listen to the concerns of some loser in Kentucky who's fussy cuase coal don't make financial sense v nat gas. And so on.
"Blogger Ray said...
Michael K.
What lectures to you recommend in So Ca to attend? Are where to find them?"
Claremont has an annual lecture which is where I met Codevilla.
I read their Review of Books. I did an NRO Cruise one year and they had some good people like Bing West, That was before they went off the deep end on Trump.
Now that I am in Arizona will probably miss their annual lecture , which is usually in the spring.
I do drive over for some things and, If they get someone really good next year, we might go over.
Usually in the Million+ for Silicon Valley, and West LA for housing. Lots of Chinese in areas bringing in money as a safe haven. Arcadia, San Marino, Irvine, Cupertino, etc. for Million Dollars as a starting place for homes.
Hispanics there is a large variety. My Aunt's ancestors go back to the Ranchos. Others I went to school with are solidly Middle Class. Others are recent immigrants and working class (legal and other).
I saw a 2 bedroom house the other day renting for $5900 a month in Hancock Park. The owners plan on adding a bedroom and increasing the rent to $6900. Average rent in LA is $2218 for a 1 bedroom apartment. My daughter is apartment hunting, and the rents are eye opening.
>Right, those wetbacks show up w/ a couple hundred mil, and then middle class folks
>can't buy a house = economics 101
anti-de Sitter space said...
He's harder on the cons. Though unintentionally.
Buwaya personifies the "The Paranoid Style in American Politics" better than anyone I have ever come across. He has developed an all-encompassing theory/paranoia, which necessarily excludes obvious counter-examples, thereby limiting what he can usefully contribute to any discussion. A less all-encompassing, more modest, theory regarding the eternal perfidy of liberals would be more compelling. Yes, there are liberals, primarily dating from the Vietnam war era, who are reflexively anti-military, although even here not necessarily anti-vet. No, not all liberals are reflexively anti-military.
Thanks!
>Michael K said...
Claremont has an annual lecture
Ray,
What you're describing is vibrant economic growth via capitalism at it's best.
Don't see that in con-heaven Mississippi.
You had a mainly-Asian bunch of parents and kids, many in uniform, carrying US flags. And on the other side a bunch of SF political-activist types looking daggers at them. The hate was boiling.
The kids who apply to the military in LA, where I will be again this week, are about 50% Hispanic and about 25% Asian, mostly Chinese applying to a visa program that grants citizenship after the enlistment is completed.
Phoenix has fewer Hispanics than I expected. No Chinese.
The Vietnamese are very patriotic and that has gone through several generations.
There is nothing like experience with communists to make you anti-communist.
PB&J,
I was around when you could do AI and it was so theoretical these guys in grad school were near-unemployable. I was hanging out a bit with the late John McCarthy (LISP creator) back in the day, we were messing with this in a hardware outfit advertising in Byte and Dr. Dobbs besides industry pubs (did not become a product).
There are always "hot" jobs, market reacts, more people show up, and compensation falls. Ask me about Cobol people in 1998.
Shouldn't it be Le David?
"You don’t have the gravitas to tell me, a liberal Democratic American how patriotic my party and my fellow Democrats are."
You're not an American, you're a German. Which is why your opinions are so weird. In any case, I'll tell you how patriotic Liberal Democrats are - most of them are open borders, anti-American shits.
Most of them get all worked up when ever actually expresses patriotism, they get all offended, or angry. Like when they see a Cross in public.
The only time they express a love of country is when they can use it as political weapon, and even then it comes off as phony.
buwaya
The Republican party too is a political power machine at the top who run politics. It is no different than the Democrats. Both parties can be said to be rotten at the top. The political class may certainly spoil each party but - alas - each party is all we have. The overriding idea that one side is 'better' I find to be wrong on many levels. It's all opinions anyway. Which party is better for America? Both or neither is a good answer....
I have a feeling that because History as taught in Liberal States, such as CA, is becoming less patriotic, you are seeing the end product being less patriotic.
When Howard Zinn is basically being used as the textbook for US History AP in High School, you get students without a very positive view of the US. Colleges where the K-12 teachers come from are usually anti military. Basically it's taught that the US was an imperial power that was just as bad as the Imperials in Europe, plus we had the original sin of slavery. No to mention racism, critical theory, micro aggressions, multi culture, identity politics, White Supremacy, etc. End result as taught in schools, there is no reason to be proud of the US.
And the way History is taught, is an inch deep, and a mile wide. Same with most subjects. And when they get to college, they don't need to take a US History class. Instead they have to take some type of ethnic, race, sex class from the Social Science Department. My daughter's passing of the US History AP Test was a waste, and counted for nothing in her college for her social science requirements. It just took away an elective.
Yes, I have a teaching credential in History.
>No, not all liberals are reflexively anti-military.
My only comment on the Trump-Widow Johnson thing is this. Why hasn't Widow Johnson released a recording of the call? They call was setup, and she made sure to have the Congresswoman, her aunt, and her uncle there to listen in. Are we supposed to believe that NO ONE took out their cell phone or Ipad and recorded the talk - On speakerphone?
If you were called by the POTUS, wouldn't you record it?
I believe their is a recording, and its not been released because it will show Trump did a good job.
"When Howard Zinn is basically being used as the textbook for US History AP in High School,"
Zinn was a fucking communist! That his work is being taught as "Mainstream" is incredible.
“You're not an American, you're a German. Which is why your opinions are so weird. In any case, I'll tell you how patriotic Liberal Democrats are - most of them are open borders, anti-American shits.”
Are you addressing me? I’m an American citizen, Buwaya is not. Ever heard of Americans that are not native Americans? What is your ethnicity? Assholian?
Trump is basically taking over the GOP. Time will tell if it's successful or not.
Bannon's vision, which I believe is close to Trump, is a party that focuses more on Economic Nationalism (what is good for US), is not afraid to hit back, is color blind, less government regulation, for Gay Rights, focuses on the economy, wants immigration under control, distrusts global agreements, and what is good for the US.
GOPe does not agree with a lot of this, and I see them much closer to the democrats in ideals. They go to the same elite schools. Immigration is a big issue.
Democrats are big into identity politics, educated (or should say credentialed), and have become the party of the government workers. They have abandoned the private Unions and White Collar Workers.
Trump is very pro union, and his electoral success showed that.
>Matt said...
>Both or neither is a good answer....
"Bannon's vision, which I believe is close to Trump, is a party that focuses more on Economic Nationalism (what is good for US)"
Coal is the future!
What is good for the US? Coming from the “burn it all down” contingent, I’ll pass.
"The Republican party too is a political power machine at the top who run politics."
Its not really the political machine, as in that which elects politicians, we are dealing with here.
It is a social caste and a bureaucratic-hemi-semi ngo-legal-regulatory system.
It is quite a complex and curious machine, with much of the "government" spilling out of bounds of the formal government. This is far more important than the elected politicians.
The Republican political machine, that which sustains McConnell and co., is just as deeply implicated in the SAME caste and system as the Democrats. They are chocolate and vanilla out of the same ice-cream vendors cart.
That's the politicians. As for the rest, the actual state structure, the permanent government and all of its semi-private appendages, they are Democrats nearly to a man.
At many schools in the LA area on campus, you will see a sea of Che Guevara Shirts.
Comrade LLR said, "As usual, the knee-jerk reaction on the Althouse comments pages is to attack me, in the name of Trump, or to presume that I am attacking Trump."
It is humorous to me how much our beloved Comrade is like the president he cannot refrain from attacking. Like his version of Mr. Trump, Comrade LLR always attacks back, always makes ad hominem comments in these testy exchanges, always sees a unitary enemy, and saves his greatest venom for certain special targets.
But, if he is to be believed, he voted for the guy, so there's always that; ultimately I find his neo-Trumpkinism quite precious and endearing in its own special way.
"When Howard Zinn is basically being used as the textbook for US History AP in High School,"
"Zinn was a fucking communist! That his work is being taught as "Mainstream" is incredible."
Its a bit worse than that. They don't make people read Zinn, just what I can only described as simplified paraphrases of Zinn. As the kids can't read.
"At many schools in the LA area on campus, you will see a sea of Che Guevara Shirts."
This used to be a thing in SF, but not for a long time now. At least a decade.
You might see a bit in SF State, maybe. Haven't been there in a while.
This made me laugh.
>Coal is the future!
Fortunately we (the US) have a sorta kinda free economy, where cost is important. So Natural Gas is slowly killing coal. It does not need outside help, as Hillary promised.
I wish we had a clean way of burning coal, go MHD! Europe is actually burning a lot more coal, so they are not meeting their emission goals, unlike the US. We have Fracking to thank for the cheap Natural Gas.
I meant at a High School level. My observation in Hispanic Areas, he is seen as cool.
>"At many schools in the LA area on campus
Bob Boyd said...
Trump should do nothing that will have US soldiers thinking, "what if that was my wife".
--------------------
Good advice.
Gotta love ARM mansplainin' Buwaya to us political unsophisticates. Such reasonability!
That his work is being taught as "Mainstream" is incredible.
Have you read the Camille Paglia piece ?
“What has happened is these young people now getting to college have no sense of history – of any kind! No sense of history. No world geography. No sense of the violence and the barbarities of history. So, they think that the whole world has always been like this, a kind of nice, comfortable world where you can go to the store and get orange juice and milk, and you can turn on the water and the hot water comes out. They have no sense whatever of the destruction, of the great civilizations that rose and fell, and so on – and how arrogant people get when they’re in a comfortable civilization. They now have been taught to look around them to see defects in America – which is the freest country in the history of the world – and to feel that somehow America is the source of all evil in the universe, and it’s because they’ve never been exposed to the actual evil of the history of humanity. They know nothing!”
The video.
Earlier in this comments thread, I wondered how it was, legally, that the U.S. Military could prevent Mrs. Johnson from viewing her husband's remains, as she claimed.
Naturally, because I was the one asking the question, there were a number of hostile responses, telling me that I should know better, that a wife wouldn't want to view the badly decomposed or mutilated remains of her husband. None of which went to my question, of course. With that question being whether the military or any other legal authority can prevent a viewing by the next of kin.
And so I had to note further, that my question is not particularly helpful to Mrs. Johnson; she either mixed up the answer she was given, or she didn't effectively press her legal rights, or she was so obviously and severely emotionally wrought that someone prevented her from the viewing in a form of in loco parentis.
I had asked a good question*, the Althouse commentariat freaked out, and no explanation from me, however detailed and specific could rescue the discussion.
Now, in apparent recognition that my question (posed by many others, obviously) above all needed an answer, Marine Corps General Joseph Dunford, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff undertook a rare and hastily-convened press conference to answer that question. No, there is no legal bar to a wife viewing her deceased husband's remains. He noted, with good reason no doubt, that such a viewing may be very unadvisable. All the right answers from General Dunford. No speculation as to why Mrs. Johnson might have been told, or thought she was told, why she was not "allowed" to view her husband's remains. It's not DoD policy.
""The Republican party too is a political power machine at the top who run politics."
Of course ! That is what Codevilla is about.
I would be a Libertarian except for their foreign policy insanity.
The destabilizing of the Middle East began with the Iran Revolution but that might have settled down if Saddam had not invaded Kuwait.
Now there is a reasonable case that he was provoked by Kuwaiti dishonesty but what explains the Middle East if not dishonesty ?
All that saved us from him at the time was his pause at the Saudi border.
It was the same as Hitler's mistake at Dunkirk.
"that a wife wouldn't want to view the badly decomposed or mutilated remains of her husband."
No, the "freakout" I saw was that it was a merciful response.
I suppose one could allow her to do so as punishment for allowing herself to be used by politicians.
Ann is too tough on Stephanopolis, whom I don't care for and consider a big biased phony. But he conducted a difficult interview in a fair and respectful manner. He also did not go out of his way to make Trump look bad. Perhaps at some level he realizes that, while Trump is not without fault, this also is a democratic hit job. And, he probably does respect the soldier and his wife.
This deal about Trump never apologizing is interesting. I think Scott Adams considers it a strength of Trump's persuasive skillset. I don't get it. I think Trump would look good apologizing for the unintended distress.
Why the heck does the widow not get to see the body? That seems strange to me.
Also, she identified six people in the car. I think we only have heard from two or perhaps three. While I am happy to let this unfortunate controversy pass, how about the other witnesses?
She did "slip up" on the name. She acknowledged that Trump did say her husband's name. I assume she heard some uncertainty in Trump's words at some point, but previously the report was that Trump did not know his name.
"Have you read the Camille Paglia piece ? "
Thanks. Boy was that depressing. I shouldn't be surprised given how dumbed-down the new History books are. Our library keeps getting rid of the old ones and replacing them with new ones. 90% of the new ones, on almost Historical topic, are worse.
"Zinn was a fucking communist! That his work is being taught as "Mainstream" is incredible."
When I bitch about AP teachers using Zinn, everyone in the room looks at me like I'm crazy.
Gotta love ARM mansplainin' Buwaya to us political unsophisticates. Such reasonability!
ARM's brain cells are not in the same class with buwaya's and he knows it. Most of our brain cells are not and I don't hold that against ARM but I do object to his presumption.
"When I bitch about AP teachers using Zinn, everyone in the room looks at me like I'm crazy."
Are you saying that there are some rooms where everyone doesn't look at you that way?
What a sad and pathetic bunch they are, and so startlingly disrespectful of a dead service man.
-sw
Michael K said...
"that a wife wouldn't want to view the badly decomposed or mutilated remains of her husband."
No, the "freakout" I saw was that it was a merciful response.
I suppose one could allow her to do so as punishment for allowing herself to be used by politicians.
You keep trying to debate me -- force of habit, I expect -- on a point for which I have no information and no argument.
I don't know what is the condition of Sgt. Johnson's body. I don't know if it would have been good or bad for Mrs. Johnson to view the body.
All I questioned was whether there was a legal or procedural basis to deny her that opportunity. And now we know the answer, from General Dunford; there is no basis, and the DoD had no policy that would direct anyone to deny her that opportunity.
My question was the right one, and my presupposed answer (that no legal basis exists, to deny Mrs. Johnson's request) was also right.
But again I say that what is so interesting to me is the knee-jerk reaction in the Althouse commentariat to fight me on something even as clear and as mundane as this.
"to fight me on something even as clear and as mundane as this."
Chuck, paranoia is not good for you.
My only response was to ask if you had ever seen a body that lay outside in a hot climate for two days.
I have. Nightmares are made of those things.
Since there is no law, she is welcome to do so.
Look, the phone call had to be arranged ahead of time. The President is not going to cold call and hope they are there to take his call.The widow knows the President of the United States of America is going to call regarding her heroic husband. She is going to record that call for herself and for her children. There has to be a recording from the widows side. They are not mentioning or releasing it. Wonder why?
And, I keep seeing that Congresswoman is a family friend. Since when? Way back, or just since news of the soldiers death?. She eat dinner with the family once in awhile? Live in the neighborhood?
Just like the "hands up don't shoot" lie - the "it was the video" lie has never been corrected by the msm.
If the wife had bothered to view the remains instead of lying about not being able to, she might have vented some of her anger at the scum who did that to him instead of at President Trump like she was was told to do. Or, she could have trusted someone in the military to tell her why she wouldn't want to, and still vent that anger at the enemy instead of her husband's CiC. I name the Congresswoman: All hate and no cattle.
Here is some background on the region
http://spice.fsi.stanford.edu/docs/the_spread_of_islam_in_west_africa_containment_mixing_and_reform_from_the_eighth_to_the_twentieth_century
This is the official who has dismissed our intelligence:
https://www.africaintelligence.com/lce/power-brokers/2015/03/04/bazoum-back-to-basics
-at-pnds-party,108064518-art
Some sources like the via and nbcs dilanian suggest theynerre lured to the ambush, others like general dunford said they were attacked on way to njamey.
This fellow pulls the Juan Cole card, as in Iraq, as if he was the only expert of the shoals worth consulting
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/author/paul-stoller
If the situation anything like what happened to tucker and menchaca in mahmoudiyah she really would want to open the casket.
And there in lies the rub, where is the hatred for sahroui. I know Frederick would think its some exotic spice.
"LLR" and "Accidental Leftist" Chuck: "..on a point for which I have no information and no argument."
Oh, same old, same old.
On the one hand I have the word of Trump and Kelly on what occurred during the phone call. On the other hand I have the word of the widow and her handler, an anti-Trump Democrat politician, so it’s a very easy decision for me on what to believe.
If the widow made a recording of Trump’s call it’ll never see the light of day so speculation about a recording is irrelevant.
If the wife requested to view the body and was not allowed to view the body the person responsible for that decision should be punished. I suspect that the request was never made.
Late here (I was on the road) but all I can do, considering the way the left has handled//propagandized this affair is to quote that great political philosopher Lilly Tomlin: "I try to be cynical, but I can't keep up."
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