The announcement came a day after Taliban envoys appeared before reporters to give a U.S.-demanded statement that they did not want to plan or launch attacks on other countries from Afghan soil, and were open to talking with other Afghans....
However, the Taliban representatives also told reporters that their group would continue fighting NATO and Afghan troops inside Afghanistan even as the U.S. and Taliban delegations explore the possibility of peace talks. In keeping with that statement, the Taliban asserted responsibility on Wednesday morning for a rocket attack on a large U.S. base in eastern Afghanistan that killed four American troops.
June 19, 2013
"Afghan President Hamid Karzai on Wednesday suspended negotiations with Washington..."
"... over a security agreement that would regulate the presence of U.S. troops here beyond 2014, apparently angered by the U.S.-backed initiative to start formal peace talks with the Taliban in Qatar."
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40 comments:
That's our POTUS. Able to anger allies and enemies with a single bound. Foreign policy is foreign to him.
Really a well spent Trillion dollars there.
That seems like the first honorable thing Karzai has done in his life. But time will tell. He might have a chip in this game.
Blogger Tank said...
Really a well spent Trillion dollars there.
6/19/13, 7:55 AM
______________________________
There were more real 'shovel-ready' jobs there than the US.
Smart diplomacy.
Good thing some voters wanted Democrats to take responsibility in the war on terror.
And, on that point, which does one think actually happened?
A) That Democrats actually took responsibility for the war on terror?
Or B) That voters learned Democrats couldn't be trusted to take responsibility in the war on terror?
Answer: C) None of the Above. Democrats and their voters are still fucking things up, unable to take responsibility, unable to learn, and neither accountable for their mistakes.
Good Job!
Beware of using Karsai words or actions to support any political position, liberal or conservative.
(But I still want to know where he shops for his wardrobe.)
Karzai shouldn't be given the lifetime appointment he seems to believe he is entitled.
It is obvious Karzai is crooked, and that in a decade he cannot make it work. He is not deserving of endless chances.
Obama is behaving like a child. His policies are consistently child-like. He doesn't worry about money, and he thinks he can get what he wants by whining. We've got a toddler in the White House.
It's not clear what the Taliban has to gain by negotiating; once Obama's artificial deadline for bringing the troops home is reached they will have won anyway.
Negotiating with terrorists? Really? Who are these rookies?
Trey
Negotiating with terrorists? Really? Who are these rookies?
Trey
Stop negotiating with anyone and come home, no one wins in Afghanistan, ever.
Negotiate with the Taliban??
What have they to give us?
Promises? They won't blow up? They will stop fucking the goats?
Perhaps Afghanis tend to believe that if one fights then one should fight to win, and "winning" means vanquishing one's enemies?
How quaint.
The administration was unable to get a SOFA agreement in Iraq, so what on earth makes anyone think A SOFA is remotely possible in Afghanistan?
Anyway, the saying is you cannot buy an Afghan, you can only rent them. That means that once the "rental" term is up they can do anything the damn please once again....in fact they are doing so right now....e.g., they are happy to fuck your goat as well as their own.
Aridog said...
Anyway, the saying is you cannot buy an Afghan, you can only rent them.
There is no such thing as an Afghan or Afghanistan. Only a collection of tribes, equipped with 8th century morality and 20th century weapons.
Choom doesn't understand that not all Presidents want to destroy their country.
Inga said...
Stop negotiating with anyone and come home, no one wins in Afghanistan, ever.
Thus spaketh the one who told Dolf to go for Stalingrad.
Inga is correct, but it does reflect poorly twice on The Won. First for pimping "The Good War" and secondly for fucking up the peace in Iraq.
When we pull out, if we had a competent POTUS who you know felt:
"Let them hate us as long as they fear us"
We'd make sure that the locals understood that we were prepared to punish them surely and severely for transgressions and without regard to crap about UN approval. By severely, I mean making "butcher and bolt" look like Horse Guards Parade.
Arc Light Strikes come to mind.
Alternately, there is no reason why you can't sling a W-54 under a Predator. Yields can be dialed from 10 tons to 1,000 tons :)
Inga said...
Stop negotiating with anyone and come home, no one wins in Afghanistan, ever.
6/19/13, 8:40 AM
This is a lie. We crushed the Taliban and had only to finish the job. Even after the catch and release policy and the no destroying compounds policy was implemented in 2010 we were still routing them. It is difficult to describe how pathetic the Taliban is and how thoroughly we were beating them.
But after 5 years of this administration and liberal douchebags who want to recreate Vietnam not even the army could win.
Peter said...
Perhaps Afghanis tend to believe that if one fights then one should fight to win, and "winning" means vanquishing one's enemies?
How quaint.
6/19/13, 9:01 AM
The vast majority of afghans are subdued if not openly friendly. We dealt with the worst of the worst and the village elders were almost always happy to see the people we hauled off go. The Taliban charge protection and act like the mob over there.
Stop negotiating with anyone and come home, no one wins in Afghanistan, ever."
The same can be said for Libya and Syria. So why is Zero getting us in there?
How quaint."
Old School rules are tried and true.
The Drill SGT said...
Arc Light Strikes come to mind.
That was an idea of mine way back in 2002 when I suggested making it one big crater hole.
BTW, I agree with your summary of the "Afghan" populace. I suspect the guys I heard that cliche' from were just referring to the geographic collection of a-holes.
Achilles said ...
...the village elders were almost always happy to see the people we hauled off go ...
True enough, but we were merely "renting" the elders by offering our own protection.
How long did this good will last after our units pulled back?
All we're missing is the "Obama is like Nixon" tag.
The Drill SGT said...
Inga is correct, but it does reflect poorly twice on The Won. First for pimping "The Good War" and secondly for fucking up the peace in Iraq.
Sergeant, I can link to Victor Davis Hanson's piece on how many people have kicked the Aghans' collective ass in history, but I know you're already familiar with it.
The one who's losing isn't us, it's Choom and his colossal ego and the Democrats and their propaganda about Iraq.
Achilles said ...
...the village elders were almost always happy to see the people we hauled off go ...
True enough, but we were merely "renting" the elders by offering our own protection.
How long did this good will last after our units pulled back? "
Butcher and bolt with the ironclad guarantee that we will be back if they misbehave. Old School ways that are tried and true.
Karzai is just pissed that everyone went over his head. Fucking idiot. That entire portion of that continent should have been obliterated by now, but nope. We fight PC wars.
Smart Power.
Cubanbob said ...
Butcher and bolt with the ironclad guarantee that we will be back if they misbehave. Old School ways that are tried and true.
Perhaps...but my question is what is happening today...how fond of us are the elders after we depart? We internally prosecute anyone who even thinks about "butcher & bolt" tactics today. We are no longer feared if not on scene....and then only for as long as we are on scene.
I think anyone interested in struggles like these should read General Giaps's memoirs of the Indo-China wars....and while doing so, accept the fact that Giap's forces from the Viet Minh, to the Viet Cong, to the PAVN all used "butcher & bolt" tactics on their own people against us. They rallied around the concept of we'd not stay long term [we're not colonialists and they knew it]...that threat was defeated when the French fell.
In other words, butcher & bolt tactics only work if you are either present full time or are well known to return suddenly. Post WWII and Korea...we are not known for that.
cubanbob said...
Achilles said ...
...the village elders were almost always happy to see the people we hauled off go ...
True enough, but we were merely "renting" the elders by offering our own protection.
How long did this good will last after our units pulled back? "
Butcher and bolt with the ironclad guarantee that we will be back if they misbehave. Old School ways that are tried and true.
6/19/13, 10:30 AM
If we killed the Taliban, i.e. went to every town drug them out in the street and shot them all, left a SOCOM detachment, and pulled out the bulk of our forces it would take very little to keep Afghanistan reasonable.
We could do that easily. But Obama would rather hunt down the tea party and talk peace with the Taliban. They are working for the caliphate after all.
The only people who know how to fight a war anymore, militarily and politically, is the Israelis. A Holocaust does that to you.
Here I was all set to go after Karzai, but you know what? Obama is the idiot here. Why is he talking with the Taliban at this point?
Is negotiating with the Taliban like voters saying they are citizens and that's all that's required to let them vote?
Well the Taliban checked off the box that they aren't going to be terrorists any more. What more is needed at this point?
Insta twists the knife:
At his '08 Berlin speech - 200,000, today - 8000.
We need to get out and leave Pakistan once our stuff and troops are out.
I am a firm believer that in places like that "More rubble, less trouble."
Karzai should take care to get himself out of Afghanistan before the last Americans are gone. The Taliban get him, he won't die easy.
Michael K said...
I am a firm believer that in places like that "More rubble, less trouble.
And that is what Arc Light strikes are for...making rubble. Repeatedly.
Achilles ... I like your optimism and I once upon a time had some myself. Now a days I am not interested in paying to keep special force units in every hovel strewn village in a shit-hole...not to mention their new offices elsewhere like that in Qatar this past weekend.
I would go for the idea of every time they act out we just bomb snot out of them...but I know that wouldn't work long either....I suspect the Qataris would object to it too.
We can't just pack up and leave. That whole region is a tinder-box that we can't ignore.
Pakistan, for instance, is very jittery that we're about to high-tail it out of Afghanistan because that would be a huge signal for the extremists there as well. And Pakistan is a nuclear power, which means it matters a lot.
Lydia said...
We can't just pack up and leave.
No we shouldn't, but we've turned it in to a huggy bear exercise in pseudo-nation building...so we're stuck with leaving as Obama has promised, especially if no SOFA agreement is reached, which I doubt will be reached any more than in Iraq. Beneficiaries of the US military are notoriously fickle lovers once we begin to march out. Just getting out of Afghanistan will be akin to the USMC leaving the Chosin Reservoir in Korea in the 50's unless we are very v-e-r-y careful...there is no easy direct route home. If Vietnam was a quagmire, Afghanistan is a colossal sink hole.
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