Althouse: David Broder on Sarah Palin: "The lady is good."

February 11, 2010

David Broder on Sarah Palin: "The lady is good."

"Those who want to stop her will need more ammunition than deriding her habit of writing on her hand."

And that band on her wrist.

303 comments:

«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 303 of 303

former law student said...: As for Palin's RNC speech being "mean, petty, and contemptuous," well, guess what? Obama started it, attacking Palin's executive experience (which of course far surpassed his own)

Because an interview is just like an acceptance speech? The difference was that Obama responded to an issue that Anderson Cooper wanted to raise, while Palin brought up several issues that she alone (or McCain) wanted to raise.; 2/11/10, 4:46 PM
Brian said...: I wrote a long response to Vicki, and it got lost, but here goes, shorter and sweeter.

I understand your point about miscarriages of justice, and stipulate what the Innocence Project does is necessary work to expose inadequacies, shortcomings, or plain unethical lapses of judgement in criminal law. I'd also stipulate that capital cases dservere more scrutiny and a higher burden of proof (I know reasonable doubt reigns, but I mean after conviction, a furthur need to prove it's necessary for deterence).

That said, if you oppose the death penalty on the grounds that justice isn't perfect, then you also have to oppose cops carrying guns. After all, if you can't trust the judgement of 12 jurors, a judge, a defense attorney countering a prosecutor, and inevitable appeals, then why would you trust the judgement of a cop who may fire a gun in a split second at night at a suspect who he thought had a gun, but didn't? I mean, if he shoots an innocent dead, it's just as tragic and wrong, correct?; 2/11/10, 4:47 PM
JAL said...: On[e] court appointment does not a pro choice advocate make.

I didn't MEAN she was pro-abortion. I meant she's not the raving lunatic that the Left wants her to be oooohhhhh soooooo badly.

And she governed from a wider viewpoint than the Left thinks she could possibly even comprehend.; 2/11/10, 4:48 PM
JAL said...: Think about the language style, fls.

Doesn't that Palin quote sound like something ... Levi Johnson would say (and/or think)?

C'mon. Really.; 2/11/10, 4:49 PM
former law student said...: serial liar

Unless Levi -- a hockey player and aspiring electrician -- has a Tom Clancy level gift for fiction, I don't see how he could have made all that stuff up. Occam's razor says it's the truth.; 2/11/10, 4:50 PM
JAL said...: Occam's razor says it's the truth.

On please.

I'm a therapist.

I hear people lie on a regular basis.

Occam's razor applied to people has to factor in the fact that Levi Johnson hates Sarah Palin.

He has more to gain psychically from trashing her (again -- look at the type of language you quoted or approximated) every which way than he does from just keeping quiet and getting on with his life.

Of course in the end it will cost him dearly. But then, people can change and forgive. So there is always hope that the parents will mature and learn to be civil and no one will show Tripp the incredibly crass and ugly things his father has utterd.; 2/11/10, 4:59 PM
Brian said...: @fls:
Occam's razor says it's the truth.

Of course, Levi had a ghost writer, but nonetheless,

Occam's razor would also say that Andrew Sullivan, an experienced writer and columnist/blogger, wouldn't write so much about how it's possible Trig isn't really Sarah Palin's baby, that it's possible he was really the product of incest between Todd Palin and Bristol, and Sarah covered it up, because she wanted to be V.P. and take the Republican Party down in flames when it got out. Because, you know, Andrew of all people should understand how unhinged and crazy it is to say such things.; 2/11/10, 5:00 PM
Paddy O said...: "They can be congressmen (Issa, Drier etc) but not Senators or Governor."

...thank gerrymandering.

I'm a resident in the same LA urban suburb, and I don't feel at all alienated by Palin.

Of course, my family has been around these parts for a long, long while, and the suburbs sort of grew up around us, on former farmland. This neck of the woods is the heartland. Well, not so much anymore right here. But, it's as near as the closest Stater Bros. at least.

Of course, all the recent immigrants have changed everything with their liberal voting ways and derision of the heartland. Not the ones from south of here, the immigrants from the Eastern US who bring all their foreign ways and attitudes with them, and then expect all the West coast natives here to conform to their alien ideas whether we like it or not. :-); 2/11/10, 5:00 PM
victoria said...: JAL Blah, blah, blah. So what. I stand by my belief, no mater what your demi-god Palin says. What are you trying to do, get me to change my mind. Better people, and people with more persuasive arguments than you have tried. Don't like her, won't vote for her, won't support her. And pretty much anything you say will not get me to like her at all. I think she is a narrow minded, energy guzzling, gun toting, rights rescinding uber right wing idealog. She will never get my vote. Now, if you are saying to yourself, well she is a woman and Vicki is scared of strong women, no. I wouldn't vote for Romney, Huckabee, Gingrich or Jindal either. Meg Whitman, she is cool. Give me a moderate and maybe I'll vote for them. But, maybe not. I do, a s I have said before, prefer RINO's. Fiscally conservative, socially liberal. That's how I roll.

Vicki from Pasadena; 2/11/10, 5:08 PM
garage mahal said...: He has more to gain psychically from trashing her (again -- look at the type of language you quoted or approximated) every which way than he does from just keeping quiet and getting on with his life.

If he wanted to trash Palin hard he would have come with a lot more than a "retarded baby" comment. And I don't know why he has to shut up sand keep quiet, yet she has to blab about something every single day.; 2/11/10, 5:09 PM
JAL said...: @ Theo 11:28

I say 387 before it's over. Somebody should start a pool.

@ Lem 11:37
I say just over 150.. I dont want to go over ;)

[Why not?]

@ Lem 11:40
2012?

I don't think Althouse has ever commanded 2012 comments on any topic.. not even boobs.

I think it might break blogger.

We're over 200 and the ML trolls haven't even arrived. The night is still young. If the Professor doesn't add bunch of posts tonight, it may end up in Theo's range.; 2/11/10, 5:10 PM
victoria said...: Paddy, where do you live? Gerrymandering done on both side, boyo.

Not just the failings of the left.; 2/11/10, 5:11 PM
former law student said...: has to factor in the fact that Levi Johnson hates Sarah Palin.

Why? Did you hate any of your girlfriends' mothers? Much more likely that a mother will hate the boy who knocked up her teenage daughter. Especially the social conservative mother who suddenly finds herself on the national stage with a knocked-up daughter. Especially the mother who had launched a vendetta against the man who cheated on her sister.

Don't therapists like you look for patterns of behavior, motivations, etc.?

But most of all, I think this kid is just too dumb to make all that stuff up.; 2/11/10, 5:13 PM
Original Mike said...: Damn. I hate it when it goes over 200.; 2/11/10, 5:13 PM
victoria said...: You do all know that Palin had a ghost writer too, who cares.

Vicki from Pasadena; 2/11/10, 5:13 PM
Original Mike said...: Occam's Razor was meant to be applied to physical systems. It's useless for assessing the behavior of people.

For that, you need to talk to Hari Seldon.; 2/11/10, 5:16 PM
garage mahal said...: You do all know that Palin had a ghost writer too, who cares.

yea hard to write an entire book from scribblings on one's hand.; 2/11/10, 5:18 PM
Brian said...: Vicki:
JAL Blah, blah, blah. So what. I stand by my belief, no mater what your demi-god Palin says.

No, she's a goddess. That would make Sarah Palin Artemis, goddess of the moon and hunting. Please respect our religious beliefs and don't demote her.

But seriously, she's no demigod. Why'd she have keywords written on her hand for that speech? So that she wouldn't start to ramble, like when she announced her resignation from the governorship. It's OK to ramble at a book signing, it's different on CSPAN.

I don't know if Sarah's fit to be president; she'd have to survive the campaign trail, raise money, and fend off rivals for the nomination. Not all Republicans are enamored with her; it would be interesting to see how she would handle a primary in northeastern states like New Hampshire.

WV: revag. Does this mean I have to see a re-run of Eve Ensler's play?; 2/11/10, 5:21 PM
JAL said...: Vicki --

You can vote however.

But when you perpetuate misinformation and demonstrate stereotypical thinking, don't expect people to sit around and go "Aaawwwwhh. That's nice. Vicki from Pasadena is talking out of the top of her head. Sweet."

You are opinionated and don't hesitate to jump in. But what you say much of the time sounds and is parroted.

Can you enumerate the rights that Sarah Palin has rescinded?

I don't recall seeing anything you have posted previously which would lead me to believe that you are "Fiscally conservative, socially liberal."

There are actually a fair number of people who post regularly on here who fall into that category. (That's one of the appeals of this list.)

I don't recall ever having the sense that you and they were lined up together. Are you? I think they'd be surprised.

And how's that Obama Spendagenda working for you?; 2/11/10, 5:25 PM
Paddy O said...: Victoria,

Both sides indeed. They made a nice little deal with each other to keep everything comfortably status quo, making moderation a less likely reality.

I think both parties in California are full of all kinds of blame.

I'm just south of the 210, a little bit east of Old Town (ten minute walk); 2/11/10, 5:28 PM
victoria said...: Brian

You are all willing to believe all the bad stuff about Obama but not the bad stuff about Palin. I tend to agree with law student, I think Levi is just too dim to lie too much. I am a mother of a daughter and can understand some of her anger towards the father of her grandchild. But the idea that she always takes the higher ground is preposterous. She is human, like anyone else and is as vindictive, maybe more so than we mere mortals.

If what you say is true about juries, then why are convictions overturned? They are because the decisions made by the judge and the jurors were wrong. I have sat on many juries, one of them a murder trial, so I know what goes on in a jury room. The people are not always convicted, exonerated by the facts alone. I sat on a jury where the preponderance of evidence pointed to the fact that the defendant had beaten and tied up his girlfriend and kept her prisoner for 3 days. Pictures, evidence from uninterested 3rd parties and police reports. He was not convicted. Why, because 2 of the men on the jury believed that she had it coming. She deserved it. One of those people was a college professor from UCLA. Nothing we said or did would convince them otherwise. Hung jury, no conviction. Miscarriage of justice, you bet.

I do not oppose policemen having guns. It is part and parcel of their job responsibility. They do not carry guns for fun, entertainment or with a misguided sense of entitlement. They would be apt to use guns sparingly, whereas the average citizen would be more apt to shoot first, ask questions later. If you have known any cops you know that they use the gun as a LAST resort, not the first. Hell yes, I trust them more than I would you or me.

Vicki from Pasadena; 2/11/10, 5:29 PM
Lem Vibe Bandit said...: We're over 200 and the ML trolls haven't even arrived. The night is still young. If the Professor doesn't add bunch of posts tonight, it may end up in Theo's range.

Insta has posted again about this bracelet nonsense.. if he updates to the Althouse post that will be all she wrote.; 2/11/10, 5:30 PM
former law student said...: Occam's Razor was meant to be applied to physical systems.

Who said?

Explanations requiring fewer assumptions are better. To believe that Levi is lying we must believe he is in the habit of lying (and St. Sarah is not); that he has much more reason to hate St. Sarah than the reverse; that he has hidden gifts of fiction; that he is far more mean, petty, and vindictive than is St. Sarah -- the assumptions collapse of their own weight.; 2/11/10, 5:33 PM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: We like our Republicans in California more like Meg Whitman and Arnold, they are actually RINO's. Meg is pro choice and pro gun control but a fiscal conservative. I like her.

Speak for yourself, Victoria. I'm a Californian and have been for over 50 years. I grew up in the Bay Area before Silicon Valley was even a wet dream.

Meg...meh. Ok I guess. Arnie...Democrat Lite. Pro choice, really who gives a rip. Fiscal conservative....sort of. Pro gun control...forget it, she will never get the votes on that issue from Republicans AND Democrats who live outside of the urban enclaves. But certainly miles ahead of the wild eyed leftist Democrats they are running against.

And as to the hispanic issue in rural areas, I think you are paranoid. Maybe it is different in other parts of the country, I don't know. There are lots and lots of Hispanics in the rural area that I live in and, unless they are gang banger types, there is no issue whatsoever. People who work, participate in the community, abide by the laws are accepted no matter what ethnicity they are.

Plus the hispanic families in our area put the garden club to shame. They buy a house or piece of property and immediatly turn it into a garden of eden, even in our difficult climate. (I'm jealous of their skills and trying to recruit my neighbor into the club so he can instruct us on pruning fruit trees and vegetable garden tips. He is awesome); 2/11/10, 5:33 PM
JAL said...: @ garage
And I don't know why he has to shut up sand keep quiet, yet she has to blab about something every single day.

Because he's not doing his child any favors. And that's the point. He's a father.

The one time I saw Palin interviewed where she was asked about Levi she was civil and restrained. I think what the interviewer (can't remember who -- Oprah? Don't hold me to that --) wanted was some dirt. She didn't get it.

If Levi wants to go on his Facebook he can write about hockey and electrical stuff and Alaska and whatever -- he can even write about his mother-in-law and his baby's mother. But don't expect that to work in his favor when it comes to the influence he has with his child.

She can blab every single day, but people seem to want to know what she thingks about certain things. And she isn't making up s___ about her grandson's daddy.; 2/11/10, 5:34 PM
Phil 314 said...: fls;
There are times when you're just about to rise above standard talking points....but this thread was not one of those times. A few suggestions:
1)Try REAL hard not to suggest that people who oppose President Obama are racists (as implied in your 2:32 comment)
2)avoid responding to a critique by saying Your side did it too (see comment 2:39) It sounds childish ("Well you started it!") and actually reinforces the original point.
3) Never, ever quote Levi Johnson. Regardless of one's opinion of Sarah Palin, using the quotes of an unemployed high school hockey player who's greatest claim to fame is impregnating a governor's daughter and then going on multiple talk shows (we won't talk about his mom)will not get you style points

Now I agree that it won't earn you THE LOVE of many on this blogs but it might gain you a bit more RESPECT; 2/11/10, 5:35 PM
JAL said...: @ Vicki and Garage

V: You do all know that Palin had a ghost writer too, who cares.

G:yea hard to write an entire book from scribblings on one's hand.

Ha ha.

She announced her co-author before she started.

And have either of you READ the book?

If you read it you wouldn't say stupid things like that. :-); 2/11/10, 5:38 PM
victoria said...: JAL you obviously haven't read many of my posts. I am not thrilled with Obama's spendorama, I am not thrilled with him. If you've read my posts you would know that.

I think the whole healthcare discussion and agenda should have been pushed to the side and work needed to be done to get us out of this recession and get the economy moving so that people, including my daughter who will be graduating from Law School this spring, some jobs. And anyone who thinks that tort reform is going to solve the healthcare mess is on drugs. That will account for less than 300m in savings. A drop in the bucket.

I am so mad at the uber left for making this their mission for 2009 I could just spit.

However, I do not believe that tax cuts alone will lift us out of this recession. It is trickle down at it's worst and bad for all. Tax cuts stimulate some, but not enough.

How's that for balanced and fiscally conservative.

vicki from Pasadena; 2/11/10, 5:38 PM
Lem Vibe Bandit said...: Theo needs about 50 more comments..

Maybe somebody remembers.. how did we suppress Broward again ;); 2/11/10, 5:39 PM
Brian said...: I do not oppose policemen having guns. It is part and parcel of their job responsibility. They do not carry guns for fun, entertainment or with a misguided sense of entitlement. They would be apt to use guns sparingly, whereas the average citizen would be more apt to shoot first, ask questions later. If you have known any cops you know that they use the gun as a LAST resort, not the first. Hell yes, I trust them more than I would you or me.

I trust policemen to carry guns too of course. No, they don't carry guns for fun, and they do shoot as a last resort. That doesn't counter the fact that sometimes a police officer shoots, hits the wrong person, or makes a mistake. My point is: dead is dead, whether it's someone on death row, who after 16 years and multiple appeals, calls to the governor, etc., is executed, with evidence that may be faulty, vs. someone innocent shot on the street by a cop who thought he saw a gun.

You try to learn from this, and not do it again, is my point. It's fair to argue that outlawing the death penalty means no innocent person ever gets executed by lethal injection. I'd like a system where no innocent person dies this way. Instead, they spend the rest of their life in prison and die of old age, medical problem, in a prison riot, etc. Because just outlawing the death penalty doesn't do anything as far as changing the system to guarantee innocent people aren't convicted and sentenced to life without parole.; 2/11/10, 5:40 PM
Bruce Hayden said...: On December 24, 1865, at Pulaski, Tennessee, during a meeting in a small law office, Captain John C. Lester said "Boys, let's start something to break this monotony, and to cheer up our mothers and the girls. Let's start a club of some kind." ("Authentic History of the Ku Klux Klan" 6)

I am not sure that I would be touting this. After all, what we are talking about today is their slow realignment with conservatives. For well over a 100 years they were at the core of the Democratic Party, which is why pretty much all lynchings in the South of Blacks were done by Democrats. And why the only Klukker in Congress is a Democrat (Sen. Byrd, D-WV). And, from that post, we can see why, as WV is right along that M/D line.; 2/11/10, 5:43 PM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: That will account for less than 300m in savings. A drop in the bucket.

A drop here a drop there. A trickle down here and a trickle down there.

You have to start somewhere. Instead of trying to shove the entire camel backassward through the tent all at once, the politicians would have been wiser to do it in little increments.

Instead of a humungous bail out bill, small steps that would encourage small businesses to ramp up. Instead of a gigantic turd of a health care bill shoved down our throats, fix things in baby steps and keep working on what works.

Of course, it is to OUR good fortune that they tried to shove the camel at us all at once, because....NOW we have really noticed and been put on alert.

How's that for balanced and fiscally conservative.

Nice try.; 2/11/10, 5:45 PM
Synova said...: "This is the righties way. When you can't use logic, attack."

Alex isn't a "rightie". Probably not a "leftie" either.; 2/11/10, 5:45 PM
Synova said...: "And she governed from a wider viewpoint than the Left thinks she could possibly even comprehend."

This is true.; 2/11/10, 5:47 PM
former law student said...: 1)Try REAL hard not to suggest that people who oppose President Obama are racists (as implied in your 2:32 comment)

More support for that idea -- Scotch-Irish living along the Mason-Dixon -- than that they are opposed to "elitists." Why did they vote for draft-dodgers, anyway? I thought Bruce's "elitism" was a code word ro "uppity Negroes," but I did not want to go all the way there.

2)avoid responding to a critique by saying Your side did it too (see comment 2:39) It sounds childish ("Well you started it!") and actually reinforces the original point.

I tried to point out the hypocrisy of criticizing a behavior when one's opponent does it, while ignoring that identical behavior in an ally. Those who criticize earmarks should be evenhanded.

3) Never, ever quote Levi Johnson. Regardless of one's opinion of Sarah Palin, using the quotes of an unemployed high school hockey player who's greatest claim to fame is impregnating a governor's daughter

Yes, Levi's too dumb to tell a lie and too dumb to see why he should keep his mouth shut. Therefore, his descriptions of St. Sarah's behavior are likely true.; 2/11/10, 5:47 PM
victoria said...: Hey, JAL, I didn't say anything stupid about Sarah Palin using a ghost writer. It's just the way of the world. She uses a speech writer too, so does everyone else. I don't object to her writing notes on her hand, many do it. I think it was a little snarky to make comments about Obama and his use of the teleprompter, especially after the Q and A with the Republicans last week, no notes, no prescreened questions. Palin's questions for the Q and Q after her speech were prescreened by her, so she knew what was coming and had ample opportunity to fashion her answers. Not necessarily bad, Bush did it for the 8 years of his presidency and I suspect other presidents did it too.

Please, don't go on and on about her brilliance. Her speeches are ok, but her dropping of the final consonants just drives me crazy.
I had an English teacher in High School who was fanatical about that and using verbal pauses, ah, um and you know. To this day I don't use any of those and I speak clearly, crisply and distinctly. That is what I do and that is what I expect of people I listen to. Not snobby or elitist, just good english. If this makes me an elitist, so be it.

Vicki from pasadena; 2/11/10, 5:48 PM
Automatic_Wing said...: Explanations requiring fewer assumptions are better. To believe that Levi is lying we must believe he is in the habit of lying (and St. Sarah is not); that he has much more reason to hate St. Sarah than the reverse; that he has hidden gifts of fiction; that he is far more mean, petty, and vindictive than is St. Sarah -- the assumptions collapse of their own weight.

Um, no. All you're doing is taking one assumption - that Palin's more trustworthy than Levi Johnston - and stating it a bunch of different ways. This is just a typical he said-she said situation, either you take Johnston's word it for or Palin's. Or I guess you could think they're both lying.; 2/11/10, 5:50 PM
Alex said...: what's really fascinating is that Vicki & FLS automatically believe Levi Johnston.; 2/11/10, 5:50 PM
Synova said...: BTW... has anyone met a dumb kid that couldn't lie well? Really?

And who says Levi is dumb?; 2/11/10, 5:51 PM
Alex said...: Because... if Levi Johnston's account is correct... Sarah Palin is a disgusting human being and unfit for office.; 2/11/10, 5:51 PM
garage mahal said...: And how's that Obama Spendagenda working for you?

Heh. If you're a Republican, you loudly vote against it, call it socialism, and back home pose smiling with the great big checks taking credit for it.; 2/11/10, 5:54 PM
victoria said...: Brian, I never said that outlawing the death penalty means that no innocent person will die.

That is ludicrous. Don't put words in my mouth.

Thanks, Dust Bunny. Never said that tort reform wasn't anything, I am saying that, unlike the feeling of some republicans, it isn't the be all and end all of healthcare reform. Lots of other things we can do, starting with being able to purchase medical insurance in California for someone in New York. This simply boggles my mind that I cannot purchase the same healthcare insurance for myself and my husband and my daughter, who is in New York going to school and is over 23. What idiot passed that law? Oh, no, it is the insurance companies who are doing that. Grrr. Trust the government, hell no. Trust the insurance companies, double hell no.

Vicki from Pasadena; 2/11/10, 5:58 PM
victoria said...: Alex never said that I believe Levi.

Vicki; 2/11/10, 5:59 PM
Bruce Hayden said...: More support for that idea -- Scotch-Irish living along the Mason-Dixon -- than that they are opposed to "elitists." Why did they vote for draft-dodgers, anyway? I thought Bruce's "elitism" was a code word for "uppity Negroes," but I did not want to go all the way there.

I am sure that there are some S-I living along the M-D that are racist just like that. But the anti-elitism is national, just maybe more pernicious from the part of the country from which Andrew Jackson came.

And, of course, this demographic broke for that uppity Negro in the 2008 election. It is that right now, if the election were held today, he would lose maybe 25-35% (overall, not relative) of their vote for him in 2008 to pretty much any Republican.

It is interesting that they would vote for draft dodging Reagan, Clinton, and Obama (ok, he really didn't dodge the draft, since he never was given the choice of dodging or serving). Before that? Maybe FDR?; 2/11/10, 6:00 PM
Synova said...: "I do not oppose policemen having guns. It is part and parcel of their job responsibility. They do not carry guns for fun, entertainment or with a misguided sense of entitlement."

"sense of entitlement" Never!

Cops never beat up people either.

I'm pro-cop, generally. I got to go through my teen years with the same last name as the county sheriff (and the same first name as his daughter)... lost a job because of it, actually. Other relatives were deputies and what not... lots of respect going on for that.

But police are people just like anyone else with the same limitations and vices. And they have those limitations and vices coupled with a great deal of government sanctioned power.

The idea that a cop is automatically more trustworthy than any other law abiding citizen is delusional.; 2/11/10, 6:01 PM
former law student said...: what's really fascinating is that Vicki & FLS automatically believe Levi Johnston.

Nothing "automatic" about it. I compared motivations, previous behaviors, and skill levels.

Synova -- dumb kids can say "I didn't do it," or "Not me." They're not novelists, creating character, dialogue, and plot.

Put it this way: if Levi did make all that up, he should go to the Iowa Writers Workshop. Forget running wires.; 2/11/10, 6:13 PM
Alex said...: FLS - the only motivation we know of Levi Johnston is revenge against Palin. He's a scumbag, son of a scumbag.; 2/11/10, 6:17 PM
Synova said...: "Synova -- dumb kids can say "I didn't do it," or "Not me." They're not novelists, creating character, dialogue, and plot."

I disagree, strongly.

I think that nearly everyone does create character, dialogue and plot every moment of every day as we assimilate the events that happen around us. That's why eye witnesses are so unreliable... everything we experience goes through that filter.

The most common lie is the lie to ourselves about what is happening. When that sort of lie is related to anyone else it is complete with dialogue and plot and character development.

A completely knowing lie has that "I didn't do it" feel. The person talking knows they did it and they are consciously trying to convince others of the lie. Those are pretty easy to catch.

The other sort is the most common high school alternate reality sort of lie where every single party to a disagreement is utterly convinced that they are in the right and that what they *say* happened really did.

I've never encountered anyone who wasn't good at that sort of lying. The difficulty there is making a dispassionate assessment that recognizes what the truth actually is. It's far more difficult *not* to fall into that than it is to carry it off convincingly.; 2/11/10, 6:22 PM
former law student said...: revenge against Palin

For what?

For plucking him out of Wasilla and putting him on the national stage? For threatening a shotgun wedding? The Armani suit didn't fit and the Prada shoes hurt his feet?; 2/11/10, 6:26 PM
Anonymous said...: You do all know that Palin had a ghost writer too

So did Obama! See what I mean, mirror image.; 2/11/10, 6:35 PM
Synova said...: "For plucking him out of Wasilla and putting him on the national stage?"

You don't think that's enough?

Dear god, the Palin haters went after his *mother*.; 2/11/10, 6:35 PM
Anonymous said...: 250!

PALIN FOR EMPEROR!

Should we give her the title of "Father of the Country" now, or wait a little bit?

Regarding the death penalty debate that is going on in this thread:

The dude who wants to kill 'em is right.

I say: Once the judge and jury have screamed "Kill Him!", that society ought to go ahead and do it.

The only difference is that I think the criminal should be crucified. If we're gonna do these executions we've got to do them right. This means, of course, that the judge and jury should scream "Crucify Him!" and not just "Kill Him!".

If you don't agree with with me that crucifixtion is the way to go, then I'm sorry but you are just a supporter of the criminals. And why do you support them? Are you one of them?

Perhaps we ought to crucify you too just to be sure.

Perhaps we will be able to do that when Palin becomes Emperor of this fine Scot-Irish nation called America.; 2/11/10, 6:37 PM
Alex said...: JRH - your hysteria about Palin is comical to say the least. If she's such a lightwight nobody, then why are you scared to death of her?; 2/11/10, 6:41 PM
The Scythian said...: FLS wrote:

"Synova -- dumb kids can say 'I didn't do it,' or 'Not me.' They're not novelists, creating character, dialogue, and plot."

Wait, what?

Johnston said, basically, that Sarah Palin claims to love her mentally disabled child but secretly calls him a retard and neglects him. And you're saying this has to be the truth because Johnston would have to be William fuckin' Faulkner to come up with something like that?

Personally, I think that Sarah Palin is a dimwit. I think that Levi Johnston is a simpleton, too. However, if you genuinely believe the bullshit that you are typing, they both might as well be Albert Einstein compared to your dumb ass.; 2/11/10, 6:41 PM
Anonymous said...: PALIN FOR EMPEROR!

Should we give her the title of "Father of the Country" now, or wait a little bit?

Now, now, that title's already been given to Obama.

See what I mean, mirror image.; 2/11/10, 6:42 PM
Phil 314 said...: fls;
I tried....

And I'm not a "rightie"

And I don't worship Sarah Palin (in fact you'll see that I've used the same phrase to describe who continued public appearances and speeches with BO's....
Cowbell)

Of course the difference with BO and Sarah is that BO's cowbell actually involves policy + spending so that's costly cowbell; 2/11/10, 6:43 PM
Alex said...: Once again if Sarah Palin was saying such things about Trig, she's a disgusting horrible human being and should be shunned by all society. But fortunately we don't just believe slander in America.; 2/11/10, 6:43 PM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: What idiot passed that law? Oh, no, it is the insurance companies who are doing that. Grrr. Trust the government, hell no. Trust the insurance companies, double hell no.

Sorry. It isn't the insurance companies who made the rules.

"States have regulated health insurance since the 1945 passage of the McCarran Ferguson Act, which, among other things, forbids interstate sale of insurance (health, auto, homeowners). States have regulated insurance ever since. Many insurance companies sell policies in different states but, in doing so, must comply with a given state's regulations."

It is a Federal Law prohibiting insurance companies from offering across state lines the same policies.

"The McCarran–Ferguson Act was passed by Congress in 1945 after the Supreme Court ruled in United States v. South-Eastern Underwriters Association that the federal government could regulate insurance companies under the authority of the Commerce Clause in the U.S. Constitution.
"

Each State's Department of Insurance sets the rules for coverage for ALL insurance. This is why certain types of life or annuity policies are available in some States and not others.

THIS is also why health insurance in California is more expensive than in some other States. The insurance commsioner insists that the coverage in California include all sorts of things that many people don't want or need.

•Alcoholism
•Blood Lead Poisoning
•Bone Mass Measurements
•Breast Reconstruction
•Cervical cancer/HPV Screening
•Clinical Trials
•Contraceptives
•Dental Anesthesia
•Diabetes Self Management
•Diabetic Supplies
•Drug Abuse Treatment
•Emergency Services
•Home Health Care
•In Vitro Fertilization
•Mammogram
•Mastectomy
•Mastectomy Stay
•Maternity
•Maternity Stay
•Mental Health General
•Mental Health Parity
•Off-Label Drug Use
•Orthotics/Prosthetics
•Other Infertility Services
•PKU/Formula
•Prostate Cancer Screening
•Second Surgical Opinion
•Well-Child Care

Why should I be forced to buy a policy that covers pregnancy, well child care or invetro fertilization. I'm hardly likely to need those services, yet they are mandated to be in my coverage.; 2/11/10, 6:43 PM
Anonymous said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 2/11/10, 6:50 PM
Anonymous said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 2/11/10, 6:51 PM
Cedarford said...: Aside from the Levi-Sarah "National Enquirer-level debate" happening on this thread - a recent poll shows the Goddess of the Right claims of some conservatives butt up against some very bad numbers.

"Palin's own ratings are weaker, apparently hurt rather than helped by her return to the spotlight. Fifty-five percent of Americans see her unfavorably, the most basic measure of a public figure's popularity, and 71 percent believe she's not qualified to serve as president, a position she said Sunday she'll consider seeking. Both negatives are at new highs.

Palin's more popular in her own party -- 69 percent of Republicans see her favorably. But far fewer, 37 percent, do so "strongly." (By contrast, in an ABC/Post poll last month, 70 percent of Democrats had a strongly favorable opinion of Barack Obama.) More problematic for Palin is that even in her own party 52 percent think she's not qualified for the presidency -- up by 16 points from an ABC/Post poll in November."

Bad...for all the traditionalguy "Sarah is our point guard who will lead us to victory" talk.

69% of Republicans like her, but they by 52% say she is unfit to be President. Better numbers than the 86% of Democrats and 71% of Independents saying she is unfit - but still bad.; 2/11/10, 6:53 PM
Anonymous said...: If Palin and Obama are mirror-images of each other, can't they just sleep together and thereby annihilate one another?

I believe that is called the ole "fuck-and-cancel-each-other-out" trick.

Instead of asking her if she would die for her country, we ought to be asking her if she would die to get rid of Obama. She'd have to have sex with him first, of course, but I don't think she'll put up any hesitation to that part of it.; 2/11/10, 6:53 PM
Paul said...: "Even before things started falling apart, they didn't seem happy. "

They're white and Americans. Basically the world's villains in their ideology so of course they're miserable!!; 2/11/10, 6:54 PM
Anonymous said...: Come on, people let's count the ways that Obama and Palin are two sides of the same coin:

* Speaking styles: Obama has his teleprompter. Palin has her crib notes.

* Militaria: Obama has his corpse-men. Palin has her wrist band.

* And let's not forget health care: Obama had the entire federal bureaucracy, a huge majority in the House, and a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate. Palin had her Facebook page.; 2/11/10, 6:55 PM
DaveW said...: That url for Pollster.com that Jon posted at 12:43pm is pretty interesting.

If you go check it out you can hover your mouse over the individual data points for the polls that are in the average. The 3 lowest favorables for Palin from July through today are all CBS polls and they are *way* lower than the rest, clear outliers. The next 3 lowest are NBC/WSJ polls and they are also outliers, though not quite as far out there.

Anyway, her approval rose sharply after she was nominated and then flattened. It looks like it was never higher than about 43 and never lower than about 40.; 2/11/10, 6:55 PM
Brian said...: My my, where to start? I thought we had solved that death penalty thing!

Vicki said:
Brian, I never said that outlawing the death penalty means that no innocent person will die.

That is ludicrous. Don't put words in my mouth.

I just said outlawing the death penalty guarantees no one dies from lethal injection, innocents included. But that, unless you can successfully overturn the conviction, they will remain in prison for life.

Still, the motive to outlaw the death penalty is rooted in the belief that you're saving an innocent life. But outlawing the death penalty doesn't overturn a conviction, so if the system is broken in the sense that too many are convicted of crimes they didn't commit, you still have a major problem. And innocent people will die in prison as a result.

Julius Ray Hoffman:
Perhaps we ought to crucify you too just to be sure.

The hyperbolae is unwarranted. I was saying the system needs to be fixed so that people don't wind up on death row that shouldn't be there. Not crucifictions, or summary executions, or no appeals.

I've gotten off topic here, but the thread ran long. Also, I guess I shouldn't acknowledge it when somone baits me to respond to such an over-the-top taunt.

Back on topic:

Sarah probably won't be president. If only because of the negatives that cannot be overcome. There's real hay to be made over resigning as governor, even if she did it because of her family. At this point, she needs to demonstrate that she can build bridges to candidates with fiscal-responsibility bona fides, despite differences on social issues, e.g. moderates.

If she can demonstrate she can deliver votes, she could be party chairman.; 2/11/10, 6:57 PM
traditionalguy said...: JRH...If Obama and Palin go to bed together, the winner will be the one who ends up on top. Barry expects that he can look to the right and move suddenly to the left, while Sarah plans to move into him and grab a headlock, duck her shoulder and roll him over until he cries for uncle Mao to come save him from the big bad moose hunter. Smoking will make Barry wear out first.; 2/11/10, 7:40 PM
jeff said...: Oh, well if LEVI says that. Clearly it must be true. Where would you put his credibility if he was still with her daughter and was a rabid Palin supporter? Still take him at his word?; 2/11/10, 7:45 PM
bagoh20 said...: The woman never has run for President and has never said she will, so this is freaking hysteria.; 2/11/10, 8:07 PM
Quaestor said...: former law student wrote:
From the time she spoke at the RNC, Palin revealed herself to be mean, petty, and contemptuous.

Those all tall words, pilgrim. Care to cite chapter and verse? Don't bother justifying the contemptuous part. Contemptuousness is a only fitting stance to take vis-à-vis the contemptible Barak Obama and his contemptible crew.; 2/11/10, 8:14 PM
bagoh20 said...: I support the Innocence Project and feel it is one area that should get plenty of tax money.

Although there may be innocent people killed by capital punishment, there are also innocent people killed when it's not carried out: other inmates, guards, and citizens if the convict escapes or are released. Either way innocent life is taken.

I support capital punishment on moral grounds, but I wish we had the data to figure out which saves more innocent lives: reasonably quick execution or our current system of virtual non-execution.

My guess is that many more die by extending the lives of convicted murderers for decades.; 2/11/10, 8:18 PM
JAL said...: @ Vicki 5:48

Please, don't go on and on about her brilliance.

? Can you give me a cite?

Her speeches are ok, but her dropping of the final consonants just drives me crazy.

You must love the POTUS's cadence and sentence upswing and clipping. {/s}

I had an English teacher in High School who was fanatical about that and using verbal pauses, ah, um and you know.

You must love the POTUS's ums and ahs. {/s}

To this day I don't use any of those and I speak clearly, crisply and distinctly.

That's nice.

That is what I do and that is what I expect of people I listen to.

No one's talking here.

Not snobby or elitist, just good english. If this makes me an elitist, so be it.

Sooo ..... why are you telling us this?; 2/11/10, 8:23 PM
Alex said...: FLS:

From the time she spoke at the RNC, Palin revealed herself to be mean, petty, and contemptuous

My god man, the only one here mean, petty and contemptuous is YOU. Ever hear of projection, mate?; 2/11/10, 8:32 PM
chickelit said...: mean, petty and contemptuous

That's POTUS addressing SCOTUS at the SOTU. But WTF do I know.

(was that under 140 characters?); 2/11/10, 9:11 PM
Anonymous said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 2/11/10, 9:46 PM
Anonymous said...: Although there may be innocent people killed by capital punishment, there are also innocent people killed when it's not carried out: other inmates, guards, and citizens if the convict escapes or are released. Either way innocent life is taken.

I support capital punishment on moral grounds, but I wish we had the data to figure out which saves more innocent lives: reasonably quick execution or our current system of virtual non-execution.

Excellent point--one that I often think about. I once heard (from George Will?) that someone had figured out that between 600 and 700 people had been killed in prison and in the course of escapes by convicted murderers whose capital sentences had been invalidated by SCOTUS's 1972 decision in Furman v. Georgia.

That's a pretty steep death toll that the anti-death penalty camp has never come to grips with.; 2/11/10, 9:52 PM
JAL said...: @ Theo

You betcha.

wv fabless
;-); 2/11/10, 10:00 PM
Anonymous said...: Sarah Palin has had a lot of success at a relatively young age, which I attribute to her energy, courage and winning personality. Unfortunately she seems to know far less than one would expect from someone who has done so much. My conclusion is she's just not very smart.; 2/11/10, 10:06 PM
Big Mike said...: It's petering out around 280. Sorry, Theo, doesn't look like it's going to hit 387. Over a hundred to go.

But you were wa-a-a-y off the mark, Lem.

Me, I like Palin a lot.

Because of who hates her.; 2/11/10, 10:20 PM
Anonymous said...: 280!

PALIN FOR EMPEROR!; 2/11/10, 10:21 PM
Synova said...: You're just having too much fun today, Julius.; 2/11/10, 10:26 PM
Synova said...: What does Palin know less of than she should?

What I want to know if she knows is...

... what was the right reaction to Zelaya?

If she knows the answer to that, she knows what's most important.; 2/11/10, 10:29 PM
Lem Vibe Bandit said...: But you were wa-a-a-y off the mark, Lem.

According to the Price is Right game show rules, Theo is over and I'm under.

That means I win ;); 2/11/10, 10:31 PM
Alex said...: Frankly I find it amazing that a mother of 5 can know as much as she does. To expect Sarah Palin to be the ultimate policy wonk is unrealistic and frankly smacks of sexism.; 2/11/10, 10:40 PM
Anonymous said...: "If Palin is up against Obama, California could still be a possible GOP win."

Hey, I'm a big Palin fan and have been since about a year before McCain picked her. But this is wrong. I don't see any way she can win California. At least half of the people there turn into howling, drooling nincompoops at the mention of her name and probably always will.

If she did win California by some miracle, it would be in conjunction with a Mondale-class ass-kicking in 45+ other states, brought about by inexcusable societal breakdown due to incompetence by Obama of an order of magnitude worse than anything seen hitherto. In other words, it would be essentially nothing to do with her or her policies.; 2/12/10, 12:20 AM
Opus One Media said...: Vicky from Pasadena....

Don't pay the right wing lunatics on here any mind at all. Someone tied a bell around that cow's neck and this herd will follow her off the proverbial cliff rather than admit that their only view of the world before they fall to their demise is the rear end of ya'betcha babe.; 2/12/10, 3:27 AM
Anthony said...: I do not want Palin to run for president or to be elected president. And I am someone who had wanted McCain to choose her for VP.

What I think her role will be in the next 2 1/2 years is to drive the left absolutly batshit crazy so that their heads will explode. Yes, it will be messy, especially in certain neighborhoods like my old stomping grounds of Park Slope in Brooklyn and Lincoln Park in Chicago, with all the brain parts on the ground but it is necessary.; 2/12/10, 3:38 AM
MDIJim said...: Why I don't comment much. I'm clearly outclassed by many of our dear professor's commentariat. In many cases I was wrong and you are right and I sincerely apologize for offending anyone.

It is amazing how Palin sets of this mostly intelligent discussion of the real state of the union. I guess it is her power to cut through all the euphemistic gobbledygook and get to the point whether you agree with her or not.

"Social Security payments are not taxes. The fact that they have been stolen by the politicians does not change that fact." Original Mike brilliantly illustrates our dilemma. Since FDR politicians of all parties and the media that enable them have sold Social Security and Medicare as "insurance". Originally people were led to believe that their FICA and Medicare "contributions" (taxes is what they are because if you don't think so try not paying and see what the government will do to you) were going into some account dedicated to them. As it gradually dawned on people that these taxes were really an intergenerational transfer, there was more talk about a "trust fund" or "lockbox" as Gore called it where money was piling up to be used for future beneficiaries, including you, dear worker. If there is a lockbox, it is filled with IOUs signed by presidents from FDR to Reagan to Obama. How will the good folks governing us when you retire redeem those promises?

The elites laughed uproariously when some deluded senior citizen at a Tea Party rally yelled about Keeping the government's hands off "my Medicare." But that person was only reflecting what he or she had been taught by generations of elites.

The reaction to Palin's "death panel" remark really exposed the stupidity of the intelligent elites. They solemnly intoned that the 2,000 plus pages of the various health bills contained no mention of death panels and this proves that Palin is a demagogue. Others, however, understood what she was getting at.

If the government is going to control all health care spending as it will through mandates to buy insurance and mandated benefits and "bending the cost curve", it is one way or another going to decide who lives and who dies. Is that what we want?; 2/12/10, 5:36 AM
Anonymous said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 2/12/10, 7:36 AM
Hoosier Daddy said...: So I see one reason Vicki doesn't like Palin is that she is pro-life and pro-death penalty.

So Vicki is cool with killing innocent unborn children but thinks killing convicted murderers is an abomination.

Gotcha.; 2/12/10, 7:39 AM
Original Mike said...: Me: Occam's Razor was meant to be applied to physical systems.

FLS: Who said?

Occam, for one. Common sense for another.; 2/12/10, 7:40 AM
Hoosier Daddy said...: I also got a kick out of FLS's belief that the qualifications of being a liar is intelligence and the ability to write well. "Levi is too dumb so what he says has to be true".

I am honestly trying to figure out if FLS is just tossing chum out here or if he is really that stupid.; 2/12/10, 7:40 AM
Original Mike said...: I can't figure FLS out. Sometimes he seems intelligent, insightful. Othertimes, he says the dumbest things. Like yesterday's "free oil change" argument.

I'm entertaining the theory that FLS is more than one person. But Occam's Razor tells me he's one person with multiple personality disorder.; 2/12/10, 7:59 AM
Hoosier Daddy said...: I can't figure FLS out. Sometimes he seems intelligent, insightful. Othertimes, he says the dumbest things. Like yesterday's "free oil change" argument.

/snaps fingers

That's it! By jove Original Mike I do believe you got it!

FLS is Obama!; 2/12/10, 8:16 AM
Original Mike said...: I don't know, Hoosier. We need to develop a test of your hypothesis.

This should do it...

Hey, FLS! Who saved Iraq?; 2/12/10, 8:24 AM
Original Mike said...: No. That won't do. That's a test of whether or not FLS is Joe Biden.; 2/12/10, 8:28 AM
John henry said...: To all those who have their shorts in a knot over Palins hand notes:

PWND!!!

The more I think about it, the more I think that Palin wrote the notes on her hand to annoy all the right people. It certainly worked.

Look at teh video of when she lookd at them. Short of waving her hand in front of the camera while saying "looky here" I don't think she could have been more obvious.

And you all fell for it.

John Henry; 2/12/10, 8:45 AM
JAL said...: 298
....; 2/12/10, 9:24 AM
Fen said...: But when you perpetuate misinformation and demonstrate stereotypical thinking, don't expect people to sit around and go "Aaawwwwhh. That's nice. Vicki from Pasadena is talking out of the top of her head. Sweet."

Exactly. I'm not so fond of Palin, but like Rush, I don't trust ANYTHING the media or her opponents say about her. I assume every quote is either made up or taken out of context, and start from there.

And too many libtards still confuse something Tina Fey said with Palin.; 2/12/10, 10:58 AM
Hoosier Daddy said...: And too many libtards still confuse something Tina Fey said with Palin.

Understandable. I confused Marx and Obama all the time.

300!~; 2/12/10, 11:16 AM
Original Mike said...: Marx is the dead one, Hoosier.; 2/12/10, 11:46 AM
Big Mike said...: Interesting take on the Palin-hatred phenomenon here.

This article's thesis may explain why nominally intelligent people (well, Joy Behar and Eve Ensler, who maybe don't qualify as even nominally intelligent) can lambaste Palin for being a global warming denier when she is, in fact, a supporter. It certainly explains people would lambaste her for wearing a black bracelet honoring her son's service when, in fact, the bracelet isn't black at all.

It's a plausible analysis of a strange phenomenon.; 2/12/10, 12:38 PM
JAL said...: @ Big Mike

My husband cruises by periodically while I read him the political goings on off the blogs. (How did we manage without this fount of blessing?)

His question: "Isn't there a DSM-IV diagnosis for this Palin stuff?

Here's an idea:

Wiki on Mass Delusion.

Mass hysteria

Mass hysteria — other names include collective hysteria, Mass Psychogenic Illness, or collective obsessional behavior — is the sociopsychological phenomenon of the manifestation of the same or similar hysterical symptoms by more than one person.[1]

[1]^ Bartholomew, Robert E.; Wessely, Simon (2002). "Protean nature of mass sociogenic illness: From possessed nuns to chemical and biological terrorism fears". British Journal of Psychiatry (Royal College of Psychiatrists) 180: 300-306. http://bjp.rcpsych.org/cgi/content/full/180/4/300. "Mass sociogenic illness mirrors prominent social concerns, changing in relation to context and circumstance. Prior to 1900, reports are dominated by episodes of motor symptoms typified by dissociation, histrionics and psychomotor agitation incubated in an environment of preexisting tension. Twentieth-century reports feature anxiety symptoms that are triggered by sudden exposure to an anxiety-generating agent, most commonly an innocuous odour or food poisoning rumours. From the early 1980s to the present there has been an increasing presence of chemical and biological terrorism themes, climaxing in a sudden shift since the 11 September 2001 terrorist attacks in the USA."

Heh. Seems like BDS and PDS (which is almost worse than BDS) belong in here some place.

wv guise
No kidding.; 2/12/10, 6:35 PM