tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post8320742923304587362..comments2024-03-19T07:20:02.485-05:00Comments on Althouse: "Stocks Tumble as Bailout Plan Is Unveiled."Ann Althousehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01630636239933008807noreply@blogger.comBlogger109125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-44323963012882542312009-02-11T09:19:00.000-06:002009-02-11T09:19:00.000-06:00@Leland- Thank you.@Leland- Thank you.Michael Hazhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14139261384414481528noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-13259392134338057112009-02-11T08:28:00.000-06:002009-02-11T08:28:00.000-06:00Please give a date when Republicans will take resp...<I>Please give a date when Republicans will take responsibility for something...anything at all...</I><BR/><BR/>10/1/1993 (First FY for Dem Congress and President in 12 years) - DJIA 3,581<BR/>1/3/1994 (Republicans take over Congress) - 3,756<BR/>10/3/1994 (Start of first Republican FY) - 3,801<BR/>10/3/1995 (One year of Republican appropriations) - 4,761<BR/>10/1/1996 - 5,904<BR/>10/1/1997 - 8,015<BR/>10/1/1998 - 7,632<BR/>10/1/1999 - 10,273<BR/>10/2/2000 - 10,700<BR/>9/10/2001 - 9,605<BR/>10/1/2001 - 8,836<BR/>10/1/2002 - 7,938<BR/>10/1/2003 - 9,469<BR/>10/1/2004 - 10,192<BR/>10/3/2005 - 10,535<BR/>10/2/2006 - 11,689<BR/>1/3/2007 (Dems takeover Congress) - 12,474<BR/>9/28/07 (Last Republican Congress FY) - 13,895<BR/><BR/><I>Cedarford - The DJIA was 10,587.60 on January 20, 2001, the day George W Bush began his first term.</I><BR/><BR/>Note, Bush's first FY began 10/1/2001. Clinton's last FY dropped 2,000 pts. Bush's last FY is still dropping, but I think I've shown that drop began with the Democratic Party taking control over the Congress.Lelandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09531159384688653131noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-48682020556353955412009-02-10T23:49:00.000-06:002009-02-10T23:49:00.000-06:00Mexicans make less than Americans.Which means you ...<I>Mexicans make less than Americans.</I><BR/><BR/>Which means you get more value for your money. This is a good thing.<BR/><BR/>And, as I pointed out, the money you're paying them still goes back into the American economy. So again, how clueless does a person have to be to think this is a bad thing?Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-32420931438005900222009-02-10T22:03:00.000-06:002009-02-10T22:03:00.000-06:00Obama a few weeks agoOBAMA: In the end, the answer...<I>Obama a few weeks ago<BR/><BR/>OBAMA: In the end, the answer to our economic troubles ...All we can do, those of us here in Washington, is to help create a favorable climate in which workers can prosper, businesses can thrive, and our economy can grow. <B>And that is exactly what the recovery plan I've proposed is intended to do. Thank you.<BR/></B></I><BR/><BR/>Try reading the whole speech, and you'll see that Obama's being consistent. Another excerpt:<BR/><BR/><I>And they [executives] understand that when it comes to rebuilding our economy, we don't have a moment to spare.<BR/><BR/>The businesses that are shedding jobs to stay afloat - they cannot afford inaction or delay. The workers who are returning home to tell their husbands and wives and children that they no longer have a job, and all those who live in fear that theirs will be the next job cut - they need help now. They are looking to Washington for action - bold and swift. And that is why I hope to sign an American Recovery and Reinvestment Plan into law in the next few weeks.</I><BR/><BR/>http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2009/01/obama_business_leaders.htmlformer law studenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15196697206046544350noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-5897420139974674812009-02-10T21:52:00.000-06:002009-02-10T21:52:00.000-06:00Aww, look, our resident Green-Party Nazi Cedarford...Aww, look, our resident Green-Party Nazi Cedarford is advocating, in his own wordy and not-particularly-interesting way, the takeover of the United States by a military regime. How cute!Palladianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01105490715666718993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-6652391369429379902009-02-10T21:13:00.000-06:002009-02-10T21:13:00.000-06:00I have to wonder just how clueless a person has to...<I>I have to wonder just how clueless a person has to be before a statement like that starts to make any kind of sense.</I><BR/><BR/>Mexicans make less than Americans.former law studenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15196697206046544350noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-90211496497423999442009-02-10T19:57:00.000-06:002009-02-10T19:57:00.000-06:00Obama a few weeks agoOBAMA: In the end, the answe...Obama a few weeks ago<BR/><BR/>OBAMA: In the end, the answer to our economic troubles rests less in my hands or in the hands of our legislators than it does with America's workers and the businesses that employ them. They are the ones whose efforts and ideas will determine our economic destiny just as they always have. For in the end it's businesses -- large and small -- that generate the jobs, provide the salaries, and serve as the foundation on which the American people's lives and dreams depend. All we can do, those of us here in Washington, is to help create a favorable climate in which workers can prosper, businesses can thrive, and our economy can grow.<BR/><BR/><BR/>Obama, last night:<BR/>OBAMA: At this particular moment, with the private sector so weakening by this recession, the federal government is the only entity left with the resources to jolt our economy back into life. It is only government that can break the vicious cycle where lost jobs lead to people spending less money, which leads to even more layoffs -- and breaking that cycle is exactly what the plan that's moving through Congress is designed to do.<BR/><BR/><BR/>This guy is a dangerous dangerous fraud.<BR/><BR/>I am genuinely fearful of every day.VinceP1974https://www.blogger.com/profile/14213974096172795917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-76187135076519127492009-02-10T19:40:00.000-06:002009-02-10T19:40:00.000-06:00Sofa Kinhg - Brilliant! I'm stealing it.Sofa Kinhg - Brilliant! <BR/><BR/>I'm stealing it.sonicfroghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17243418673004541047noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-44722122783174455002009-02-10T19:35:00.000-06:002009-02-10T19:35:00.000-06:00No problem. Consumers can buy either a $20,000 Che...<I>No problem. Consumers can buy either a $20,000 Chevrolet or a $20,000 Toyota. FBI agents have to ride around in Ford Tauruses, however.</I><BR/><BR/>Anyone who buys a car is a consumer of cars, dipshit. It doesn't matter if it is a private citizen or an FBI branch office. So in this example the FBI would be receiving a $20,000 price break from the US Congress provided it chose Chevy over Toyota.<BR/><BR/><I>Kentucky assembly-line workers earn higher wages, so they will pump more bucks into the US economy than the Mexicans will pump into the Mexican economy.</I><BR/><BR/>I have to wonder just how clueless a person has to be before a statement like that starts to make any kind of sense.<BR/><BR/>Company X hires 20 American workers for $50,000 each. Those workers then spend that $1 million here in the United States.<BR/><BR/>Company Y hires 200 Mexican workers for $5,000 each. It spends $1 million to by the equivalent value of pesos to pay those workers with. The workers then spend the pesos in Mexico.<BR/><BR/>At this point, a clueless person says "see? $1 million just left the country". A person who has been paying attention, however, realizes that the entity that sold Company Y a million bucks' worth of pesos now has $1 million in dollars. THAT entity spends its $1 million to hire Americans, buy goods for Americans, etc etc etc. Sure, they might trade the dollars for some other currency, but ultimately those dollars are coming back to America. You can't SPEND a dollar except in the American economy or the economies of those nations that have yoked themselves to ours by opting to use the dollar as their currency of choice (e.g. Panama).<BR/><BR/>So the long and the short of it is that whether you blow all your hard-earned dollars on American workers or those nasty dirty foreign workers, you're pumping the exact same amount of money into the American economy. The only question is whether you're getting good value for the dollars you spent -- which, if you hire based on nationality instead of quality, you likely aren't.Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-13649227293506459012009-02-10T19:31:00.000-06:002009-02-10T19:31:00.000-06:00I keep hearing that we're "sticking our children a...I keep hearing that we're "sticking our children and grandchildren with the bill."<BR/><BR/>Who says they'll pay it? <BR/><BR/>If I went to borrow money and told the bank my children and grandchildren were going to assume all my debts so they might as well just lend me the money, the bank would probably say "hell no." How would they know how eager my children and grandchildren are to pay them back? Our children and grandchildren might decide that since they weren't a party to it, it's not really their problem. Hence, I wonder for how much longer banks will lend to the US based on the good credit of our children and grandchildren.John Stodderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14185881995621265497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-43911610016919279432009-02-10T19:20:00.000-06:002009-02-10T19:20:00.000-06:00Our children and our grandchildren ARE BEING RAPED...Our children and our grandchildren ARE BEING RAPED!ricpichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01321511130788764861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-63489098361522590852009-02-10T19:04:00.000-06:002009-02-10T19:04:00.000-06:00@Cedarford - The DJIA was 10,587.60 on January 20,...@Cedarford - The DJIA was 10,587.60 on January 20, 2001, the day George W Bush began his first term.<BR/><BR/>It fell and rose in response to the usual economic trends, and also to the dot com bubble bursting and the 9/11 attacks.<BR/><BR/>The DJIA stood at 14,087 on 10/01/07, the start of the first fiscal year with the the Dems having a majority in Congress. That is an increase of approximately 40% in six years.<BR/><BR/>The DJIA slid from that high to today's low of 7,888, all under a Dem majority.<BR/><BR/>Your 6:33 PM comment is foolish, although you seem to have avoided blaming the Jews, so that's good.Michael Hazhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14139261384414481528noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-473982903238232672009-02-10T19:01:00.000-06:002009-02-10T19:01:00.000-06:00The only difference is that in the first scenario,...<I>The only difference is that in the first scenario, the prices paid by consumers are $20,000 vs $40,000.</I><BR/><BR/>No problem. Consumers can buy either a $20,000 Chevrolet or a $20,000 Toyota. FBI agents have to ride around in Ford Tauruses, however.<BR/><BR/><I>Is a Ford built in Mexico more American than a Toyota built in Kentucky?</I><BR/><BR/>It's a close question. Both will have significant US content in components and subassemblies. The Toyota will be made of Japanese steel. The $50,000 per job subsidy Kentucky gave Toyota in '85 must have been exhausted by now. <BR/><BR/>Kentucky assembly-line workers earn higher wages, so they will pump more bucks into the US economy than the Mexicans will pump into the Mexican economy. But the low cost of Mexican labor would also mean that Ford would have more money to pay its engineers, accountants, etc. to spend in this country.former law studenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15196697206046544350noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-51353629459827149522009-02-10T18:58:00.000-06:002009-02-10T18:58:00.000-06:00The day he left, Jan 20, 2009, the DOW was 7,888.8...<I>The day he left, Jan 20, 2009, the DOW was 7,888.88.</I><BR/><BR/>Well, you know what they say--the market portends the future. The market was already discounting Obama. BTW, the market peaked under Clinton in 2000 (March I believe) <I>before</I> Bush was nominated. <BR/>Anyway, there's a much better correlation between the Dow and the Fed Chairmanship.chickelithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10773887469972534979noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-66638812183319940612009-02-10T18:40:00.000-06:002009-02-10T18:40:00.000-06:00Unfortunately, the Democrats haven't learned their...<I>Unfortunately, the Democrats haven't learned their lesson: "we have to do something" is the thinking that gave us Smoot-Hawley. Sometimes, the politician's obsession with doing something is precisely what plunges a crisis into a catastrophe.</I><BR/><BR/>This bill is a classic demonstration of the "politician's syllogism:"<BR/><BR/>1. Something must be done.<BR/>2. This is something.<BR/>3. Therefore, this must be done.Sofa Kinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07659133819240484346noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-60869398066269575202009-02-10T18:33:00.000-06:002009-02-10T18:33:00.000-06:00Michael H. The day your beloved Maximum War leader...Michael H. <BR/><BR/>The day your beloved Maximum War leader took office on Jan 20, 2001, the DOW was 10,587.80.<BR/><BR/>The day he left, Jan 20, 2009, the DOW was 7,888.88.<BR/><BR/>The country was trillions more in debt, and real wages for the lowest 2 Quintiles had decreased.Cedarfordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00602418702398818596noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-51350619438237907702009-02-10T18:30:00.000-06:002009-02-10T18:30:00.000-06:00He still hasn't explained how taxing Toyotas made ...He still hasn't explained how taxing Toyotas made in Kentucky help the economy.Joehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04450897654318345683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-33072539305220034802009-02-10T18:28:00.000-06:002009-02-10T18:28:00.000-06:00Choosing to buy a Chevrolet is not "the same thing...<I>Choosing to buy a Chevrolet is not "the same thing" as putting a tax on Toyotas.</I><BR/><BR/>Of course it is.<BR/><BR/>Say you have two cars, selling for $20,000 each. One's a Toyota, the other a Chevrolet.<BR/><BR/>Scenario A: You slap a $20,000 tax on the Toyota. Presto! The Toyota now costs you $20,000 more than the Chevrolet.<BR/><BR/>Scenario B: You hand out bags of $20,000, with the stipulation that it can only be used to purchase a Chevrolet. Presto! The Toyota now costs you $20,000 more than the Chevrolet.<BR/><BR/>The only difference is that in the first scenario, the prices paid by consumers are $20,000 vs $40,000. In the latter scenario, the prices paid by consumers are $0 vs $20,000. The effect on trade is the same either way.Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-53427440531071836572009-02-10T18:26:00.000-06:002009-02-10T18:26:00.000-06:00This comment has been removed by the author.Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-269638780184472682009-02-10T17:25:00.000-06:002009-02-10T17:25:00.000-06:00Careful, you might confuse the little fuzzy headed...Careful, you might confuse the little fuzzy headed liberals with all those facts.The Dudehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05354536924604187137noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-47231722042789615282009-02-10T17:22:00.000-06:002009-02-10T17:22:00.000-06:00Well said Michael.TreyWell said Michael.<BR/><BR/>TreyTMinkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07221261635305430323noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-68146801269964682882009-02-10T17:19:00.000-06:002009-02-10T17:19:00.000-06:00Here is a combination of two posts that Leland and...Here is a combination of two posts that Leland and I put up earlier.<BR/><BR/>Look at the Dow Jones Industrial Average starting with the beginning of Bush's 2nd term:<BR/><BR/>01/20/05 - 10,471<BR/>01/03/07 - 12,474 Democrats take over a majority in Congress<BR/>10/01/07 - 14,087 Start the first fiscal year of Democrat controlled Congress <BR/>01/02/08 - 13,727<BR/>04/02/08 - 12,608<BR/>07/02/08 - 11,215<BR/><BR/>08/27/08 - 11,502 Barack Obama nominated by his party<BR/>10/02/08 - 10,482 End of the first fiscal year of Dem. controlled Cong. Dow dropped back to where it was on the first day of Bush’s second term.<BR/> In one year of Democratic appropriation bills, the Dow Jones erased 4,000 points and moved back to the beginning of Bush's 2nd term.<BR/><BR/>02/10/09- 7,889 Today’s close. <BR/><BR/>The DJIA has dropped 44% since 10/01/07, the start of the first fiscal year of the Democrat controlled Congress. The federal deficit began its wild escalation at the same time, as a veto-proof majority in Congress could pass into law any and all spending bills and President Bush was unable to veto those bills because Congress could override his veto.<BR/><BR/>Barack Obama was nominated on August 27, 2008. On that day, the Dow Jones Industrial Average closed at 11,502.51. The DJIA closed today at 7888.88, a 31% drop in less than 6 months since Obama was nominated.<BR/><BR/>This recession cannot be blamed on President Bush. It is the Democrat recession brought about by the non-management of Freddie and Fannie, by obscene amounts of deficit spending, and by the market’s wariness of the Obama administration’s so-called stimulus plan.<BR/><BR/>In fairness, many of the congressional Republicans share part of the blame for behaving like Democrats, adding earmarks to bills, and wanting to be fiscal ‘moderates’.Michael Hazhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14139261384414481528noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-9413971074887484702009-02-10T16:13:00.001-06:002009-02-10T16:13:00.001-06:00The good jobs that went to Southeast Asia...Now th...<I>The good jobs that went to Southeast Asia...</I><BR/><BR/>Now that's funny. The jobs that went to "Southeast Asia" were shitty jobs. (A big chunk of IT outsourcing was for failed projects that would have been canceled otherwise.)<BR/><BR/>That aside, how exactly do you buy "American" cars? Is a Ford built in Mexico more American than a Toyota built in Kentucky?Joehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04450897654318345683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-6562777180484076662009-02-10T16:13:00.000-06:002009-02-10T16:13:00.000-06:00Michael H - By the way, GWB never blamed the Clint...<I>Michael H - By the way, GWB never blamed the Clinton administration for any of the problems GWB inherited.</I><BR/><BR/>Bush got a lot of mileage from him directly or his surrogates blaming Clinton for "failing to stop Bin Laden", his "suicidal tax increases nearly wrecking the US economy", and of course for the "culture of sleaze and corruption on Wall Street that caused the phony tech bubble"Cedarfordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00602418702398818596noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-23902160931464060252009-02-10T16:12:00.000-06:002009-02-10T16:12:00.000-06:00Well now we know that all it takes to be "indispen...Well now we know that all it takes to be "indispensable" enough to get away with tax fraud is being a gibbering idiot. <BR/><BR/>Clearly this man has not a CLUE what to do; and neither does the man who appointed him. I'll buy the notion that Geithner at least WANTS to figure out a way to fix the economy. Barry's goal, I fear, is to break the back of the economy so government takeover is "necessary". <BR/><BR/>So for our President, things are going exactly according to plan....carlyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10874358471807457239noreply@blogger.com