November 9, 2016

Can we expect the repeal of Obamacare?

Here's Alison Kodjak at NPR:
"It's a challenge for a Trump presidency," says Jack Hoadley, a research professor at Georgetown University's Health Policy Institute. "To get a true repeal and replace through, he needs 60 votes in the Senate." That's the minimum number of votes needed to block Senate action through filibuster.

"Repeal of the law is absolutely going to come up, and the only potential defense against that would be a Democratic filibuster — if Republicans even allow a filibuster," says Austin Frakt, a health economist who runs the blog The Incidental Economist.

But even if Trump can't repeal the Affordable Care Act in its entirety.... "He could change the details of how the marketplaces work," Hoadley says. "It's all worked out through regulation. You could just suspend the regulations."

130 comments:

clint said...

Why would he need 60 votes in the Senate?

It was passed without 60 votes, wasn't it? Goose, meet Gander.

Left Bank of the Charles said...

No, it's a tax/budget bill, so a simple majority will do.

damikesc said...

Honestly, we'd be wise to try small improvements.

Allow national sale of policies. If somebody wants a "lesser plan" from a state with "looser regulations" --- why is it anybody's job to tell them no? They are adults. They can make their own decisions.

Can it be repealed? Probably. Not instantly. It will take a bit of time. But it can be done. It needs to be done.

rehajm said...

Yes, it can. It will. Special session and reconciliation. You don't need 60. How soon we forget...

Curious George said...

"To get a true repeal and replace through, he needs 60 votes in the Senate."

Not sure if this is true, but getting the votes shouldn't be hard. Democratic Senators and House members remember the purge in 2010 for those that voted for ObamaCare....and if they had forgotten they got a refresher course last night when Russ Feingold and Evan Bayh...both part of that purge...failed miserably to regain their seats.

ObamaCare is a fucking trainwreck. After last night it is toast.

Scott McGlasson said...

I'm pretty sure President Trump will have a pen and phone.

n.n said...

Obamacare did not address the key issues: economic revitalization, individual rehabilitation, and market-based cost controls.

CStanley said...

I think Curious George is right. And frankly, I would love to se Trump twist the knife, reminding the Democratic senators that the people have spoken and they must act to fix this debacle or face the voters if they choose not to.

Thorley Winston said...

Couldn't it be repealed through reconciliation? My understanding is that this can be done once per term and I can think of no better reason for invoking reconcilation than to repeal this monstrosity once and for all.

rehajm said...

Interesting though that it could be done in lame duck. Reintroduce Democrats to negotiation by getting some concessions on leftie obstruction in future sessions...

MikeR said...

Meh. The Senate should _anyhow_ go back to the older filibuster rules, where you have to actually keep speaking, like Mr. Smith Goes to Washington. They should announce that they're doing that because it's a good idea, not as a threat of a "nuclear option". That's how the Senate has worked for most of its history.

But as you say, it shouldn't be hard to sabotage Obamacare. Ideal though would be to repeal it outright, starting a year or two years from that day. Then invite Democrats to join in planning its replacement - and mean it. No one needs another law stuffed down the nation's throats. I imagine that some Democrats would want to join in since there are pieces of Obamacare that they will want to protect.

WisRich said...

Politifact says: False,

Reconciliation.

He might even get some Dem votes.

tim in vermont said...

It was passed through reconciliation, it can be repealed in the same way.

Matthew Sablan said...

Ryan should offer Democrats compromise now or deal with Trump.

Some things in the ACA are good/great, and Republicans would keep them.

Tom Gallagher said...

At least Obama's legacy is Donald Trump and not Obamacare; Ha

tim in vermont said...

This new regulation MACRA, is a major change to health care that never went through Congress, it was done with the pen and a phone. It can be repealed with a pen and a phone.

CStanley said...

The biggest challenge of course is how they're going to replace it with something better. There are some obvious things they can do to tinker around the margins but our healthcare system is a bloated disaster and that's not changing anytime soon. And suddenly the media is going to become very interested in reporting the problems.

tim in vermont said...

Do you think they have sobered her up yet?

William said...

The Dems keep saying that twenty million uninsured now have health insurance and that cannot be taken away from them. Well, if a working family has a five or ten thousand dollar deductible they do not have ,in actual practice, any health insurance. I think there was thus a net loss in people with functional health insurance. It would be pretty easy for Trump to jerryrig some kind of system that's an improvement over Obamacare. It will, however, be almost impossible for the media to report on such a change as an improvement.

Michael K said...

Just make it optional and allow other insurance products to compete.

It is only an expanded Medicaid anyway. Let the poor have it and offer better options. Catastrophic coverage for the young is very important.

n.n said...

suddenly the media is going to become very interested in reporting the problems

A competitive market is good, better.

Curious George said...

I have a salesguy who is an indy rep, so is forced to go to the Exchange to get insurance. His premium for he and his wife was $600/mo in 2015, and $1,000/mo this year, and will be $1,600/mo next year. All for a POS Bronze Plan that has a $7,000 deductible. This is not at all unusual. You think that's gonna be hard to repeal?

There are 23 Senate seats held by Dems in play in 2018, most in states carried yesterday by Trump. I think there will be a rush to repeal by Democrats.

Obama's legacy is swirling in bowl. It's about to get flushed.

Matthew Sablan said...

"Do you think they have sobered her up yet?"

-- I thought she was going to concede at 9:30. I wasn't going to bother listening; she had her chance last night to have me in the audience, and decided she didn't want to talk.

MikeR said...

"our healthcare system is a bloated disaster and that's not changing anytime soon." Nuts. The average American likes his health care, and thinks it got worse under ACA. We pay health care professionals too much compared to Europe, but that isn't changing any time soon. All that really needs fixing is the way the safety net is handled. There is absolutely no reason why my premium needs to go way way up because of the safety net.

Curious George said...

"Matthew Sablan said...
Ryan should offer Democrats compromise now or deal with Trump.

Some things in the ACA are good/great, and Republicans would keep them."

This is idiocy. Despite the fact that the GOP wouldn't go for it, Obama is the President still. DO you really think he would sign a bill to repeal?

Curious George said...

"William said...
The Dems keep saying that twenty million uninsured now have health insurance and that cannot be taken away from them. Well, if a working family has a five or ten thousand dollar deductible they do not have ,in actual practice, any health insurance. I think there was thus a net loss in people with functional health insurance. It would be pretty easy for Trump to jerryrig some kind of system that's an improvement over Obamacare. It will, however, be almost impossible for the media to report on such a change as an improvement."

You are correct. My company provides revenue recovery services to acute care hospitals, and these high deductible plans are killing them.

Scott McGlasson said...

The Dems keep saying that twenty million uninsured now have health insurance and that cannot be taken away from them.

Perhaps President Trump should tell that twenty million that if they like their current plan, they can keep it. Period.

dbp said...

As has been noted, repeal can be done through reconciliation.

This was because MA legislature changed the law to prevent the Governor from choosing a replacement Senator when it looked as if Mitt would pick John Kerry's replacement. Then Kennedy up and died, the (by then Democratic) governor did not have the power to appoint and Scott Brown was elected in a special election.

Now that the Democrats lacked 60 votes in the Senate, they decided to pass the thing on reconciliation rather than actually negotiate with Republicans.

But...a replacement would need to have the usual rules followed. So the filibuster could be invoked. The repeal threat is one hell of a bargaining chip though.

Once written, twice... said...

I am going to predict that Trump will expand the Federal government's commitment.

Trump is not a conservative. He never uses that term or argues for fiscal restraint. Trump will expand the reach of government way beyond anything Obama could do.

We know that Trump likes to spend money.

Bad Lieutenant said...

tim in vermont said...
Do you think they have sobered her up yet?

11/9/16, 9:26 AM

Has she been seen alive since voting Tuesday?

Bad Lieutenant said...

Once written, twice... said...
I am going to predict that Trump will expand the Federal government's commitment.

Trump is not a conservative. He never uses that term or argues for fiscal restraint. Trump will expand the reach of government way beyond anything Obama could do.

We know that Trump likes to spend money.

11/9/16, 9:37 AM

So, that's good, right? You like that, right? Or are you pretending today to be a conservative?

TreeJoe said...

People keep saying whether or not it's going to be repealed? That's missing the point. It was labelled the Affordable Care Act. And now, going into it's ~4th or 5th year of implementation (depending on how you look at it), we have AVERAGE increases in premiums of 25%. That even assumes the plan remains, which is not the case in many many instances.

My wife and I are mid-30s. 2 young children. No pre-existing conditions. A silver plan with a $14k family deductible and $7k individual deductions in PA is running $12-14,000 a year out of pocket and that is NOT tax deductible (like it would be if paid by an employer) and I'm not eligible for subsidies.

Put aside repeal - the law has FAILED. It has insured 20 million more people, 15 million of which are through Medicaid. It has decreased affordability and quality and options. It has decreased affordability.

This is no longer about repeal. This is about fixing a broken system.

MikeR said...

"I am going to predict that Trump will expand the Federal government's commitment." Hope not, but we'll see. Fortunately we have a pretty conservative Congress as well. And there are certain things that I think I can trust him to do, and he may not necessary spend all his time stopping Congress from doing others.
Or, he may really do his job and gut the Executive Branch of useless and harmful barnacles.

rhhardin said...

The right thing is open health insurance sale across state lines, buy whatever you want.

There's a complication, to avoid screwing people who were screwed by Obamacare. Namely people who had an insurance policy before and then became chronically sick, meaning that they won the bet against the insurnace company, namely they'll get more out than they put in.

Then Obama cancels their policy, ie cancels the bet that they won, and with the repeal of Obamacare they should reacquire their won bet instead of starting out fresh, sick and uninsured.

I don't know what to do about that special case.

rehajm said...

This is idiocy. Despite the fact that the GOP wouldn't go for it, Obama is the President still. DO you really think he would sign a bill to repeal?

Who knows? This is uncharted territory. Any legacy he hoped to have is dead and he knows it. The GOP has more than enough leverage. Politically, it's entirely positive to try and negotiate something before he leaves.

Larvell said...

The idea that the Democrats have any moral ground to insist on the right to filibuster is absurd. Republicans should feel free to get rid of it altogether or exploit any means available to get around it.

rhhardin said...

Derb says health care should be a government service and not an economic good, and suggests looking for systems that work in the world.

That's plausible if you leave open the option of buying your own health care in a private market, as an escape clause.

walter said...

<even if Trump can't repeal the Affordable Care Act in its entirety.... "He could change the details of how the marketplaces work," Hoadley says. "It's all worked out through regulation
--
And also why it truly was "pass it to see what's in it".

BJK said...

4 years ago, Romney said something to the effect that his first act in office would have been to take executive action to block the enforcement of the ACA; I see no reason why a President Trump couldn't do likewise, while we wait for the Senate to find a path for the replacement through a fillibuster.

MikeR said...

"Derb says health care should be a government service and not an economic good, and suggests looking for systems that work in the world." Sigh. Our health care works well. Most of us like it. Most of us expect to get a doctors' appointment very soon after we need it, unlike most places in the civilized world. It has certain drawbacks, and we should try to fix those. We should not throw the baby out with the bathwater, which is what Obamacare did.

Luke Lea said...

Could also change the rules of the Senate, no? Only takes a majority if I am not mistaken.

Drago said...

Once written, twice: "I am going to predict that Trump will expand the Federal government's commitment."

LOL

I think we all know the real value of your predictions.

Thanks for playing.

Curious George said...

"rehajm said...
Who knows? This is uncharted territory. Any legacy he hoped to have is dead and he knows it. The GOP has more than enough leverage. Politically, it's entirely positive to try and negotiate something before he leaves."

LOL Ryan's job as Speaker is in serious Jeopardy...mostly because he went against Trump and was seen as capitulating to the left. There is no way he is going to negotiate with Obama, and no way the rank and file members will either. This is truly moronic.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

My recommendation:

1) Repeal
2) Rejoice
3) Remove the tax benefits for anything other than the catastrophic coverage portion, so that consumers are sensitive to the costs.
4) For all non-emergency medical services, require the provider to present the consumer with a breakdown of costs of the procedure, along with the medicare reimbursement rates for those same procedures, for comparison.
5) Create a new form of bankruptcy, the medical bankruptcy, where your assets are used to pay your medical bills, and if you run out of assets the program continues to pay for your needed treatment. What treatment you need will be determined by a best practices review board ( aka death panel). This will ensure that people who fail to buy catastrophic coverage, or can't because of a pre-existing condition, will not die due to a lack of reasonable care.

Drago said...

Being against Trump is not a killer for any republican.

Seen as capitulating to the left? Well, that's a different matter.

Peter Casas said...

The market is repealing Obamacare...

Once written, twice... said...

If you think you elected a small government conservative with Trump then you are going to be sadly mistaken.

David said...

You can't just repeal it. It has to be replaced by something. It will be.

David said...

"Remove the tax benefits for anything other than the catastrophic coverage portion, so that consumers are sensitive to the costs."

What tax benefits? Basically there are none.

n.n said...

Obamacare did not help Gaddafi. As a reformed dictator, who did not invade a sovereign nation, he deserved better than a trial by sodomy. Too bad we can't repeal his abortion. The survivors who helped the abandoned Americans certainly deserve better than the social injustice visited upon them.

320Busdriver said...

But that is the first black Presidents signature legislation.

What about his legacy?

Once written, twice... said...

I can see Trump expanding the role of government greatly. Trump is not about doing LESS. He will want to do more, and he is saying he will take care of the American people. Last night in his victory speech he promised to create a Federal works program that will employ millions. Look at the transcript.

Ignorance is Bliss said...
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tim in vermont said...

Call us all Hillbillies one more time, Once! Just to help us gin up turnout for 2018.

320Busdriver said...

Just give the people the opportunity to purchase a plan they want, not one full of shit they can't afford.

MaxedOutMama said...

Obamacare's being repealed by market forces in way too many areas. How can anyone say that what's on offer in rural counties in Minnesota, GA or AZ is acceptable???

I assume the Medicaid expansion will remain alive, and the rest of it will have to have some legislative fix. From here on it does not get better on its own, and that reality wouldn't change if Hillary became president.

Curious George said...

Democrats have 23 seats up in 2018, and ten are in states Trump carried. Getting repeal through the Senate will not be a problem.

tim in vermont said...

. Last night in his victory speech he promised to create a Federal works program that will employ millions.

You know what would put a lot of people to work? Approve Keystone. Won't cost the government a dime.

Once written, twice... said...

You are hillbillies who just bought a pig-in-the-poke.

The joke is going to be as much on you (if you are a small government conservative) as everyone else in the country.

Chuck said...

James Taranto, the conservative WSJ columnist and fan of the Althouse blog, wrote way back in 2010-11 how he thought that Obamacare could never be repealed even by a Republican majority/Republican president. Entitlements are really, really hard to mess with. States have already committed (or not) to federalized Medicaid programs in their budgets.

Trump won't even deal with the obvious entitlement reform which is Social Security.

Senators from both parties are reluctant to blow up filibuster rules, because they know that the Senate's institutional power depends in part on the filibuster.

Curious George said...

"320Busdriver said...
But that is the first black Presidents signature legislation.

What about his legacy?"

Better look quick.quick

Ignorance is Bliss said...

David said...

What tax benefits? Basically there are none.

If an employer purchases health insurance for their employee, that is compensation that the employee gets which is not part of their taxable income. I would change that so that the value of the non-catastrophic coverage would be treated as taxable income.

Seeing Red said...

Get rid of 29 hours is full time. Get rid of free birth control and breast pumps. Gut it line by line. Extend Medicaid. Cut back on vanity cosmetic plastic surgery for medicare seniors, let them pay for eye tucks out of pocket.

tim in vermont said...

when Obama had a trillion dollars to "stimulate the economy," he chose to spend it on favored constituencies. Drive though the DC area and see how superior the infrastructure there is to the rest of the US. Just sayin'. Trump is no small government conservative, but he will appoint Justices ready to limit the power of government.

320Busdriver said...

The one big parallel I can draw from this to whats happened in WI over the last 6 years is that the Democrats keep putting up horrible candidates.

rehajm said...

LOL Ryan's job as Speaker is in serious Jeopardy...mostly because he went against Trump and was seen as capitulating to the left. There is no way he is going to negotiate with Obama, and no way the rank and file members will either. This is truly moronic.

First, fuck you and your name calling. Second, The Trump administration will be off to a very bad start if that happens. When every new member of Congress arrives they end up in Ryan's office for the master class on how Congress works. Nobody left there has Ryan's depth of the place, and both sides know it.



Once written, twice... said...

Do you think Trump is a small government conservative? He never acknowledges or credits Reagan. He never sings the virtues of smaller government. He is going to expand the reach of government in ways that we have not seen since the 1960s. He will seek bipartisan (Democrat) support to do so. That was the whole point of his post election pivot last night.

I will be here to rub it in your faces.

tim in vermont said...

I think Once, that you could probably google up Althouse comments of mine to the effect that Trump was a pig in a poke. We know it. We also knew that the Clintons have corrupted everything they touched, from the Justice Department, the IRS, the State Department, the FEC, to the DNC.

It is just in your mind that you think that most Althouse commenters have some deep faith in DJT. Mick was a sock puppet. You don't see him here gloating over his prescient comments, because they were meant to be ridiculous and laughable.

Drago said...

Once written, twice: "You are hillbillies who just bought a pig-in-the-poke.
The joke is going to be as much on you (if you are a small government conservative) as everyone else in the country."

LOL

That's all you have left, isn't it?

#sad

320Busdriver said...

Trump won't even deal with the obvious entitlement reform which is Social Security.

Thats actually the easier fix as compared to the Medicare situation.

You might be right. How much debt is too much. Will we have to find out?

tim in vermont said...

If she calls a huge tranche of voters deplorable hillbillies enough time, they will go away and die.

Bruce Hayden said...

Most anything would be a help with health care over ObamaCare. It has been a runaway train headed for disaster since the day it was enacted. The concepts behind it are ludicrous. It depends on young people substantially supporting older ones, without really any teeth to enforce it. And, a one-size-fits-all mentality, when many, if not most, only need catastrophic coverage. Of course, the one-size-fits-all structure was intentional, in order to force the deplorables to pay for abortions and the like. Of course, they pretended during the Congressional debates that abortions wouldn't be covered, but then gave Obama free rein on deciding what was to be covered. The Republicans all predicted this outcome, and the chickens have come home to roost with the Dems, with premiums exploding this year, and a Republican President and Congress, something will be done this coming Session. (Though, I expect some regulatory relief fairly quickly, rolling back some of the most ridiculous of the regulations - but that will take time to work its way through the APA process).

The first thing to abolish are mandatory coverages. Or, if they are going to retain them a bit, leave just catastrophic coverage as mandatory. Health Care savings accounts are a far better way to control health care costs that are provided by the PPACA. And, kill electronic medical records - health care providers are spending way too much time and effort getting everything in the electronic records just the way that the bureaucrats want, and that means too little time with patients (ignoring how many physicians have been leaving the practice).

The basic problem with selling policies across state lines is that different states have different requirements, and, yes, costs. Overhead, salaries, etc., are far higher in NYC than in rural MT. So medical costs are higher. But, so are salaries. How do you handle the problem if different costs of living, and, thus, medical costs, in different states? Plus, red states in particular have enacted various policy requirements that drive up costs. How do you handle those situations? Is it a race to the bottom with mandatory coverages? Or do out-of-state companies have to comply with the policy requirements of the states they are selling policies into?

Once written, twice... said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Drago said...

Once written, twice: "Do you think Trump is a small government conservative? He never acknowledges or credits Reagan. He never sings the virtues of smaller government."

Lefties suddenly very concerned about Burkean principles!

Hey, the conservatives gave the US the "moderate, clean up after yourself, maybe we are spending way beyond our means, I'd like to keep my doctor, perhaps the executive is going to far, why is the IRS targeting conservatives?" group.

They were the Tea Party.

Which was promptly labeled every name in the book followed up by no knock raids on conservative donors, Social Justice Warriors gone mad, etc.

So, now you get what you get.

Next time you might ponder tamping down your far left Marxist crazies.

If you don't I guarantee you won't like what comes next.

Rick said...

The smart "repeal" is to leave it in place. Remove the regulations, mandates, and subsidies but leave the exchange platform workable and allow people to buy through it if they wish. It becomes nothing but an ehealthinsurance.com clone with very expensive plans.

Call the plan sensible reform and deride anyone who claims this is repeal as an extremist.

Drago said...

Once written, twice: "Caesars like to spend state money to that care of their citizens."

Yes.

An American leftist actually wrote that on Nov 9, 2016.

And non-ironically.

Beyond caricature.

320Busdriver said...

I will be here to rub it in your faces.

11/9/16, 10:11 AM

Tough mornin huh?

protestmanager said...

1: Dems already showed us how to ditch the Filibuster with 51 votes. That' horse has left the barn.
2: Termination of the illegal insurance bailouts will kill ObamaCare all by itself.

This is an awesome lesson: you try to shove your plan down the throats of the American people, and assume your media monopoly will make us like it?

You lose.

tim in vermont said...

Trump is the American caesar

"We came! We saw! He died!" - HRC

Once written, twice... said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
tim in vermont said...

The difference of course is that Hillary ordered bombings of Africans from a distance, and Ceasar led his forces through Europe himself.

Drago said...

Once written, twice: "You elected a blowhard Caesar."

LOL

The "seas will recede" crowd would like to take a moment to lecture on hubris!

Only 8 years late!!

Thanks moron.

tim in vermont said...

Your tears are sweet. Tell me again about how Hillary didn't use her position to get really really rich.

320Busdriver said...

Blogger Once written, twice... said...
Caesars like to spend state money to that care of their citizens. Trump is the American caesar and all he talks about is how he is personally going to improve the lives of the people.

11/9/16, 10:16 AM

Maybe put up a better candidate next time, oh, and purge your side of the deplorables.

Chuck said...

320 -

I agree; the Social Security fix would be easier than health care. Ryan, I think, would like to do the Social Security fix. The health care fix, with millions of people getting expanded Medicaid and subsidized Marketplace plans, would be unimaginably ugly.

The real healthcare fix requires a true conservative visionary to control costs through market forces. We'd need to decouple health insurance from employment. Trump gets some of that, but he's the opposite of any conservative visionary.

tim in vermont said...

I thought Google and the high IQ silicon valley people had a lock on this election, Once, what happened?

Oh, that's right, the people are stupid. Well, that is inarguably true, just not as stupid as Hillary thought!

Ooooh, oooh! I have been waiting for this, Hillary's Checkers speech!

Bruce Hayden said...

Trump won't even deal with the obvious entitlement reform which is Social Security.

Except that the big difference between ObamaCare and Social Security is how many people are covered. We have maybe a bit more than 10 million with individual ObamaCare coverage, many of whom get subsidies. We have hundreds of millions with some investment in Social Security, and over 50 million receiving benefits. As one of them - we vote, because we contributed for our entire working lives (almost 50 years for me).

Senators from both parties are reluctant to blow up filibuster rules, because they know that the Senate's institutional power depends in part on the filibuster.

Dems should have thought of that when they were blowing up filibusters under the management of Dingy Harry Reid. And, when they were passing ObamaCare through reconciliation. Most of the damage is already done. Dems, of course, want the Senate to go back to before they got a majority there in 2006.

Drago said...

The most corrupt candidate ever nominated (and loved for it by the lefties) has just lost the Presidency.

And what does Once Bitten offer up? A critique of Trumps questionable conservative bona fides.

Well.

tim in vermont said...

John Podesta looks like he should eat big plate of bacon and eggs once in a while.

tim in vermont said...

The "Hillary's in trouble" tag, does it get replace by "Hillary is toast"?

Rick said...

David said...
You can't just repeal it. It has to be replaced by something. It will be.


Freedom. Scary scary freedom.

Once written, twice... said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Alex said...

Repeal and replace. Americans will not tolerate poor people not getting minimum preventive + emergency care. But we need to deal with spiraling medical costs.

320Busdriver said...

Chuck

Agreed, if Trump can resist the temptation to buy large sectors of voters and begin telling us some of the inconvenient truths he will truly put himself on the path to becoming a great leader. We will find out soon.

walter said...

Well Once, the lesser of two evils is the standard to judge this binary election on. We shall see. Conservative ideals have a better chance of moving forward than it seemed just a short while ago.
But I admire your creativity in trying to flip the script.
Enjoy.

Chuck said...

Dems should have thought of that when they were blowing up filibusters under the management of Dingy Harry Reid. And, when they were passing ObamaCare through reconciliation. Most of the damage is already done. Dems, of course, want the Senate to go back to before they got a majority there in 2006.


I won't argue with your history, Bruce.

I'd add; the Senate-Democrat hypocrisy will be even worse, on the matter of Trump's Article III judicial nominations.

Drago said...

Once written, twice: "We are going to dislike the American Caesar for different reasons -- but you are going to hate him even more"

Uh huh.

I'll bet obambi's overreach on executive orders isn't looking so cool to you this morning now is it?

BTW, why are you hear? Don't you have a few final families to ruin with your healthcare law weapon before the clock runs out? Perhaps organize a rally to gather up toilet paper and basic foodstuffs to send to the Venezuelans in their socialist paradise?

Rusty said...

nce written, twice... said...
"
You elected a blowhard Caesar. He will be at war with small government conservatives more than tax and spend liberals."

What surprised me the most last night was that you lot, occupy democrats, the coffee party, 99% etc. didn't take to the streets for a punch up or riot. After all that's what you guys do when you don't get your way.
What gives?

Drago said...

Kaine talking about empowerment of families.

Those would be the families that had their taxes raised, their health care yanked, etc.

Thanks Tim!

MayBee said...

Why can't you just suspend the regulations?

Drago said...

Rusty: "What surprised me the most last night was that you lot, occupy democrats, the coffee party, 99% etc. didn't take to the streets for a punch up or riot. After all that's what you guys do when you don't get your way.
What gives?"

There were a few.

Drago said...

Tim Kaine is destined for the dustbin.

Drago said...

Oh good. Boring personal anecdotes from Tim!

That's what America needs right now!

Chuck said...

320Busdriver said...
Chuck

Agreed, if Trump can resist the temptation to buy large sectors of voters and begin telling us some of the inconvenient truths he will truly put himself on the path to becoming a great leader. We will find out soon.

Trump has convinced me; he's a dealmaker, and not an ideologue. I think he just might make deals with Democrats, to do something like "build the wall."

I worry, frankly, that Trump might do something like pick a compromise candidate for SCOTUS, in order to get Democrat votes on a Mexican wall. Or that he'd make pro-union deals on trade protectionism, to get Democrat support for an import tax on foreign auto parts.

Et cetera, et cetera.

Drago said...

Hillary: "Rule of Law"

These dems are unbelievable.

Chuck said...

Alex said...
Repeal and replace. Americans will not tolerate poor people not getting minimum preventive + emergency care. But we need to deal with spiraling medical costs.


EMTALA has covered emergency care since the late 1980's.

Listening to Donald Trump, I always thought that Trump believed that indigent emergency care was something new in Obamacare.

Whatever. Donald Trump's thimbleful of healthcare knowledge won't matter because Congressional Republicans will write a new bill.

Drago said...

"lifelong republican" Chuck: "Listening to Donald Trump, I always thought that Trump believed that indigent emergency care was something new in Obamacare."

And you would be wrong.

I'm sure you're used to that.

Rick said...

I worry, frankly, that Trump might do something like pick a compromise candidate for SCOTUS, in order to get Democrat votes on a Mexican wall.

Consider Trump's comment that he could shoot someone and not lose support. Then consider his branding as a dealmaker. The danger with Trump is that he must have a deal to match his branding, but it doesn't much matter what it is because he can convince his supporters it's great regardless of content.

I would not be surprised if he makes a deal on immigration which includes a path to citizenship.

Chuck said...

Rick; wow, that is an interesting comment. I won't disagree. But then, the trial of Ann Coulter for the assassination of President Trump would be even more interesting.

320Busdriver said...

Was this her concussion speech?

rhhardin said...

Social Security is child's play to fix. Just raise the retirement age for benefits so that the number of retirees matches the number of workers necessary to willingly support them, instead of being too low. Higher retirement age = more workers, fewer retirees. It always works.

If you want to retire earlier than the benefit age, bridge the gap on your own dime.

What you win is insurance against outliving your savings, which is what SS is.

Dan Hossley said...

Two words. Nuclear option.

Bruce Hayden said...

Why can't you just suspend the regulations?

That may be possible by Executive order. Definitely cannot replace them though without going through the APA Notice and Comment process.

Drago said...

You know chuck, as a "lifelong republican" here's a chance for you to actually offer some actual, sustained, substantive criticism of Hillary for the first time as she heads out the door.

Of course, we all know that most "lifelong republicans" direct all of their fire at incoming republican President-Elects in order to avoid any messy criticism of dem candidates who are the most corrupt candidates ever nominated.

I fully anticipate a response from you along the lines of: what's the point, she's already lost.

Which will be dutifully filed next to your other excuse:
Pre-Nomination: I can't criticize Hillary because we are in the midst of the republican nomination process

Post-Nomination/Pre-election: I can't criticize Hillary because Trump is such a disaster that he will take down the whole party.

LOL

h said...

I'm intrigued with the possibility of Trump using the same executive-activism techniques that Obama has used/escalated. "Traditional" Republicans wouldn't use those techniques (at least to such a degree) because they saw the techniques as probably unconstitutional, and certainly undemocratic. I think it is likely that Trump won't be so similarly self-restrained. So we could certainly see regulatory rewrites (without new legislation) that would effectively gut, and possibly radically reform the affordable care act. And we could see Trump (using prosecutorial discretion) to refuse to file any suits under title IX. And rewriting EPA rules, and increasing speed of deportations. These kinds of actions would force many people who were enthusiastic about the Obama means because they suppported the Obama ends to face up to the fact adminstrative activism is a two edged sword.

Drago said...

h:"I'm intrigued with the possibility of Trump using the same executive-activism techniques that Obama has used/escalated."

If Trump just "undoes" the obambi exec actions (which will lead to the death of Obamacare), de-weaponizes the federal gov't and gives us a conservative supreme court it will be huge win.

Everything else is gravy.

Chuck said...

Oh fuck off, Drago. I voted for Trump. What the fuck do you want from me? Whatever it is, I don't care. I said all along that Hillary was the worst candidate that Dems had nominated since Al Smith. She just proved it. I was worried that as bad as she was, Trump would still lose to her. I am relieved -- not happy -- that I was wrong in that regard.

In fact, Drago, I will probably be ramping up my criticism of Trump in the near future. If, that is, President Trump tries to do stuff that conservative Republicans won't like.

Drago said...

Chuck: " I said all along that Hillary was the worst candidate that Dems had nominated since Al Smith."

Feel free to expound on that. Include specifics about her policies, demeanor, tone, horrific attacks on the victims of her husbands sexual abuse, etc.

Not that you will. After all, all "lifelong republicans", such as yourself, always studiously avoid any detailed criticism of dem candidates who also just happen to operate at Emperor Nero levels of corruption.


Chuck said...

You see the next fight coming, Drago? You don't like me, and the feeling is mutual. I don't think there's any love lost between Paul Ryan and Trump, or Mitch McConnell and Trump. We have a whole new class of Senators, newly elected to six-year terms (two years beyond the Trump term), who were "anti-Trump Republicans." Rob Portman; Marco Rubio; Ron Johnson; Pat Toomey; Rand Paul; Richard Burr; John McCain; John Thune.

A Trump presidency is better than the alternative. But it isn't going to be representative of the federal government in action.

Real American said...

Just declare that the individual mandate is not a tax. Constitutional authority disappears and it's gone.

GRW3 said...

A lot of Obamacare misery was enabled by Kathleen Sibelius because the legislation said, basically, the Secretary will decide how things work. Make Rick Santorum Secretary and his positions will drive the left nuts and they will demand the end of the foul bill.

William Chadwick said...

I wasn't that excited by the prospect of a Trump presidency until Il Dufe said,"If you elect Trump, he'll undo everything I did!" That, more than anything else, got me on the Trump bandwagon.

Hammond X. Gritzkofe said...

What is done with the Afraudable Care Act will be a good earlier indicator of the direction the Trump Administration will take.

Another hoped for initiative - at the State level, in GOP states at least - will be moves to tighten up the registered voter lists. CA, OR, WA, NY, MA are lost causes anyhow, but I'd like to see some serious work to clean out all the dead voters.

rightguy2 said...

I would like to have repeal legislation written as quickly as possible, with a replacement by a competitive market model (sell across state lines, etc). Put it to a vote, and if the dems filibuster it at first, then so be it. Rinse and repeat. 28 dem senator seats are up next cycle and they will either see the light or they will have to explain this horrendous and unpopular law to their constituents.

Matt said...

Why couldn't it be repealed via reconciliation?

Douglas said...

Matt nailed it - Obamacare was birthed by reconciliation and will be buried by reconciliation.

Original Mike said...

Blogger rehajm said..."First, fuck you and your name calling. Second, The Trump administration will be off to a very bad start if that happens. When every new member of Congress arrives they end up in Ryan's office for the master class on how Congress works. Nobody left there has Ryan's depth of the place, and both sides know it."

Amen to both your points.

This sounds good to me.

Joe said...

Take out the individual and corporate mandates and the whole thing collapses, especially the requirement that "if you buy health insurance it has to, at minimum, provide this" (followed by a list of dozens of items.)

google is evil said...

Repeals is EASY. Just void the Executive Agreement that exempts Congress in violation of the law, and Congress will come begging for repeal in a few weeks.

Saint Croix said...

I am very sorry the Democrat party did not find a guy like Dr. Ben Carson to be the first African-American president. What a sweet man Dr. Carson is! He's obviously a powerful Christian. I imagine Dr. Carson as the first African-American president, and we would all be happy. We wouldn't have Carsoncare, and this idiotic attempt to socialize health care. We wouldn't have race riots and tense and angry warring tribes. No doubt a president Carson would have made other mistakes and made enemies in other ways. But what he would not have done is socialized medicine and racial agitation.

Barack Obama's two legacies for us, socialized medicine and racial agitation, suck. They suck mightily. Yes, we got an African-American in the white house! So enjoy the symbolism of it. But his actual eight years resulted in a bad economy, and (I forgot this one) a nuclear Iran.

Obama gives the illusion of a nice man. And he is a nice man, if he likes you! He's nice to his wife and nice to his kids. And he's very nice to his side of the aisle. But boy oh boy oh boy, he was very shitty to white Republicans. Very suspicious and angry and mad. While he loves Chavez and Castro and various shits around the world. It took him eight years to figure out Putin was an asshole. Hey, white Republicans have been calling him an asshole for years! I'm pretty sure Mitt Romney said some sweet Mormon shit about what an asshole Putin is. Probably didn't use the word "asshole."

Imagine Barack Obama assuming Chavez is good! "He's Marxist and he's got brown skin just like me, he's read all the right books, he's going to do great things in Venezuela. Party on, Chavez!" And when Venezuela turned into a war zone, a hell on earth, what does Obama do? Ignores it. Learns no lessons. Pays no attention to it. "Not sure what happened there. He had brown skin and a Marxist education. Probably too many white Republicans in Venezuela I guess. Maybe Exxon Mobile secretly destroyed the Venezuela economy. That's probably what happened. No need for me to pay any attention to that, though. I've got more serious issues with the polar ice caps melting."

Anyway, President Carson would have been awesome. Or at least a hell of a lot better than Barack Hussein Obama.

On the other hand, Dr. Carson apparently did not have the confidence to seek out the White House in 2008. So that's one reason we can cheer President Obama, despite all his fuck ups and the crappy economy and the shitty eight years. He blazed a path. And now we can hope and cheer that the next African-American president will be Tim Scott or somebody like that.