November 19, 2012

"I’m proud to be the first American president to visit this spectacular country..."

"... and I am very pleased that one of my first stops is to visit with an icon of democracy who has inspired so many people, not just in this country but all around the world."

ADDED: "Obama Repeatedly Mispronounces Aung San Suu Kyi."

204 comments:

1 – 200 of 204   Newer›   Newest»
edutcher said...

Zero loves taking credit, but not responsibility.

cubanbob said...

I would be content paying my soon to become higher taxes if Obama and his merry band of leftist loons would stay in Burma for the next four years incommunicado.

Bryan C said...

Awesome. The President can teach them how to appoint czars and nullify laws with executive orders.

Scott said...

Since when did the Washington Post return to calling Myanmar "Burma"? And why?

(PC talk moves so fast these days you need a scorecard.)

The President should not be playing kissyface there. The country is not ready for the honor. Obama trivializes his office.

chuck said...

Scary thought: maybe he is sincere.

phx said...

Not bad, not bad. Of course the haters don't have much to say about this, except, I suppose, "It's Obama's fault!"

ricpic said...

Still bowing after all these years.

EDH said...

In Moulmein, in lower Burma, I was hated by large numbers of people – the only time in my life that I have been important enough for this to happen to me.

...But at that moment I glanced round at the crowd that had followed me. It was an immense crowd, two thousand at the least and growing every minute. It blocked the road for a long distance on either side. I looked at the sea of yellow faces above the garish clothes-faces all happy and excited over this bit of fun, all certain that the elephant was going to be shot. They were watching me as they would watch a conjurer about to perform a trick. They did not like me, but with the magical rifle in my hands I was momentarily worth watching. And suddenly I realized that I should have to shoot the elephant after all. The people expected it of me and I had got to do it; I could feel their two thousand wills pressing me forward, irresistibly. And it was at this moment, as I stood there with the rifle in my hands, that I first grasped the hollowness, the futility of the white man's dominion in the East. Here was I, the white man with his gun, standing in front of the unarmed native crowd – seemingly the leading actor of the piece; but in reality I was only an absurd puppet pushed to and fro by the will of those yellow faces behind. I perceived in this moment that when the white man turns tyrant it is his own freedom that he destroys. He becomes a sort of hollow, posing dummy, the conventionalized figure of a sahib. For it is the condition of his rule that he shall spend his life in trying to impress the "natives," and so in every crisis he has got to do what the "natives" expect of him. He wears a mask, and his face grows to fit it. I had got to shoot the elephant. I had committed myself to doing it when I sent for the rifle. A sahib has got to act like a sahib; he has got to appear resolute, to know his own mind and do definite things. To come all that way, rifle in hand, with two thousand people marching at my heels, and then to trail feebly away, having done nothing – no, that was impossible. The crowd would laugh at me. And my whole life, every white man's life in the East, was one long struggle not to be laughed at.


George Orwell, "Shooting an Elephant"

Hagar said...

Drudge has pictures with some interesting body language.

Also he apparently repeatedly mispronounced Aung San Suu Kyi's nane.

Triangle Man said...

My grandfather flew in Burma during WWII and commented often on the kindness and generosity of the Burmese people. He would have been happy to see the re-emergence of freedom there.

Triangle Man said...

@Hagar

Did he call her "Sookie Sook?"

phx said...

Also he apparently repeatedly mispronounced Aung San Suu Kyi's nane.

Too too funny! : )

rastajenk said...

Or Snooky?

edutcher said...

Ship me somewhere East of Suez,
Where the best is like the worst,
Where there are no Ten Commandments,



If Choom's there, certainly.

Kipling would understand.

Scott said...

Obama trivializes his office.

You noticed.

Hagar said...

Drudge has pictures with some interesting body language.

Also he apparently repeatedly mispronounced Aung San Suu Kyi's nane.


Ah, yes, another foreign policy coup for Little Zero.

At least the Romster was right.

Molly said...

EDH thanks for the Orwell quote. Thoughtful, and a lesson in writing.

Molly said...

EDH thanks for the Orwell quote. Thoughtful, and a lesson in writing.

phx said...

"Myanmar: Althouse Commenters Blame Obama"

Chuck Currie said...

I pledge that this will be my last comment, here and elsewhere on the web, and in my life in general, on the life and times of President Obama. From this point forth, I will do everything in my power to ignore him.

Cheers

SteveR said...

phx: Althouse commenter

ricpic said...

A measure of our enslavement to PC is that Orwell's observation that yellows hate whites would relegate him to outlaw status today. Other than on some extremely extreme internet sites he would be persona non grata for stating the obvious. Witness the banishment of John Derbyshire from National Review for warning that blacks are powder kegs.

phx said...

I sure am an althouse commenter! I can't believe that little socialist misprounounced that great person's name - whatever it was.

phx said...

You would think he would learn to pronounce the man's name before going to visit him.

So typical of that lazy, shiftless Zero.

McTriumph said...

Why is the President of the USA visiting a country we barely trade with, if at all. Oh! they are the poorest country in SE Asia, wonder what this is going to cost us.

McTriumph said...

Well Burma is ranked in the top five for countries for human trafficking and exporting illicit drugs. Maybe it's a vacation.

Ann Althouse said...

"Since when did the Washington Post return to calling Myanmar "Burma"? And why?"

The U.S. government uses the name Burma.

By the way, do you have any idea how many countries call themselves names that we don't use for them in our newspapers?

Rocketeer said...

You would think he would learn to pronounce the man's name before going to visit him.

So typical of that lazy, shiftless Zero.


Hard to tell if you're trying to be sarcastic, or just showing your ignorance - so often the former is just a mask you put on to try and hide the latter - but just in case: Her. Her name.

mark said...

@phx ...

Sigh. When standing next to a Nobel laureate and person who led a struggle for freedom, and you plan on honoring them ...

At least pretend to care enough to say their name right.

Kind of like when you are about to read Palms on 9/11/2011 at ground zero ... you should read it a couple of times before you go before everyone and screw it up. This just continues to show he is still arrogant and stupid.

dbp said...

Obama changed exactly nothing from the policy set up by the GWB admin. Naturally he will take all the credit for Burma's liberalization. WSJ

SteveR said...

Corpseman

Comanche Voter said...

Yeah I'm glad to be here in Burma away from people asking peskky questions about Benghazi and other bungles. Oh wait--the press doesn't ask questions, and my answer to those who do persist in asking questions is "I won".

Drago said...

If only there a Federal dept responsible for our relations with other nations that could provide briefing BINDERS to the executive branch which would include all relevant information and guidance required for State visits.

Michael K said...

" Blogger phx said...

You would think he would learn to pronounce the man's name before going to visit him.

So typical of that lazy, shiftless Zero. "

So typical that the lazy shiftless althouse commenter would not know the reference was to a woman.

Obama doesn't seem to have a protocol office. In past administrations that office kept presidents from such errors. This one doesn't care.

edutcher said...

You don't understand.

Zero knows this stuff innately.

His awesomeness is so all-encompassing, he can do any job better than anybody else.

edutcher said...

PS Family names come first, so he called the President by his first name without having any acquaintanceship with him.

AJ Lynch said...

"By the way, do you have any idea how many countries call themselves names that we don't use for them in our newspapers?"

ABC's Diane Sawyers would guess the answer is "thousands".

Sorun said...

"Obama Repeatedly Mispronounces Aung San Suu Kyi"

As long as he doesn't misspell "potato" or choke on a pretzel, he's still the smartest guy ever.

Nathan Alexander said...

ARM will be along in a moment to tell us that:
1) Maybe Obama's pronunciation is correct for a minority group within Burma
2) Bush was much worse at pronouncing names, and us stupid wingnuts didn't vote him out of office, so we can't say anything about Obama's mispronunciation, which probably isn't a mispronunciation anyway
3) Anyway, it is Bush's fault that Obama mispronounced it because Bush may have cut the pronunciation office in order to give tax cuts to rich people which were a direct cause of Trillion Dollar Deficits just 7 years later!!!11! ...but it wasn't mispronounced in the first place and only a racist wouldn't praise Obama for his brilliant re-imagining of westernization of South-East Asian name pronunciation.

And garage will be along shortly to say, "But, but, but what about ____?" and promise that Walker's indictment really will be coming any day now, as soon as they finally identify the router.

Rocketeer said...

ABC's Diane Sawyers would guess the answer is "thousands".

I think you mean "souszandsh (hic)"...

Drago said...

Sorun: "As long as he doesn't misspell "potato" or choke on a pretzel, he's still the smartest guy ever."

You mean as long as he doesn't repeat the spelling of the word "potato" that was provided to him (Quayle) on a card by the teacher.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/clinton/frenzy/quayle3.htm

The teacher mispelled the word on the card, but I bet you never heard that part of the story, did you?

Similar to the "story" put forth by the media about HWBush and "scanners".

With modern media that stuff is alot harder to get away with than it used to be.

Think Rather and the Air National Guard memo's.

Just a few years earlier and that ploy would have worked.

Drago said...

Rocketeer: "I think you mean "souszandsh (hic)"..."

Diane does seem to be quite the "saucy" lass.

Triangle Man said...

Sigh. When standing next to a Nobel laureate and person who led a struggle for freedom, and you plan on honoring them ...

She received the same bullshit Nobel that Obama got. It's all good.

Colonel Angus said...

You would think he would learn to pronounce the man's name before going to visit him.

Yes, you would think the President would do that.

rastajenk said...

"You're kind of skinny to be a Kardashian. You on a diet?"

AprilApple said...

"And my trip is only costing the tax payers 1.2 million dollars a day!"

Cedarford said...

It's a good geostrategic move.
China has developed a mentality that Burma is China's.
Burma, like Vietnam, Indonesia, Malaysia...is begging to differ. Burma does not want to be considered a "Tribute Nation" of China, and a visit by Obama helps.
The Philipines, Japan, Australia are also resisting China's moves and the idea of union with China is less popular today with the people of Taiwan.

Far too much American time and effort, blood and treasure - have been spent on the shitty little countries of the MidEast. For 40 years. With little to show for it.

The 21st Century is the Asia-Pacific Century

Cedarford said...

Newspapers love to make it "All About the Dissident".
It isn't.
It's about China and ensuring Burma can join the community of other vibrant Asian nations - and not become another N Korean like "pet" of the Chinese,

EMD said...

She received the same bullshit Nobel that Obama got. It's all good.

If only Obama had to spend 21 years under house arrest ...



McTriumph said...

Expect a NY Times article about "house arrest" being an evil remnant of British Imperialism.

mark said...

@Cedar "It's a good geostrategic move."

Then why couldn't President Obama care enough to not be insulting?

If you are playing "You should like us better then them", it would be best that you act in a way that doesn't reinforce China's talking points. That we don't care about Burma, we don't understand Asia, we will just use them for our own ends, and when it is all said and done Obama is an idiot.

EMD said...

I will give Obama credit for this:
Burma's relaxing stance, such as releasing political prisoners, was influenced in the wake of successful recent diplomatic visits by the US and other democratic governments, urging or encouraging the Burmese towards democratic reform. U.S. President Barack Obama personally advocated for the release of all political prisoners, especially Aung San Suu Kyi, during the US-ASEAN Summit of 2009.

McTriumph said...

"Far too much American time and effort, blood and treasure - have been spent on the shitty little countries of the MidEast. For 40 years. With little to show for it.

The 21st Century is the Asia-Pacific Century."

40 years?

We've never spent blood and treasure in the Asian-Pacific?

The Asian-Pacific century started in the 80s.

DADvocate said...

What fools ye be. The pronounciation Obama used is the correct pronounciation, because he said it. Indeed, Aung San Suu Kyi didn't know the correct pronounciation of her own name until Obama uttered it. Nor did they know the proper manner is which to address President Thein Sein until Obama enlightened them.

Mark Nielsen said...

phx misses the point, as usual.

Whenever Bush (or any republican) got a foreign leader's name wrong, or slipped on some minor point of protocol, much less did something as stupid as saying "corpse-man" three different times in a speech (while expecting to collect honor as CIC of the armed forces), the press made a big deal of it. SNL did skits about it. Leno and Letterman had their material set for weeks. (In Letterman's case, years -- will he ever let go of Palin?)

So if we seem a bit harsh on President Obama (I'll still use the respectful title) when he slips, understand that this particular sore is very raw.

phx said...

It's a good geostrategic move.
China has developed a mentality that Burma is China's.
Burma, like Vietnam, Indonesia, Malaysia...is begging to differ. Burma does not want to be considered a "Tribute Nation" of China, and a visit by Obama helps.
The Philipines, Japan, Australia are also resisting China's moves and the idea of union with China is less popular today with the people of Taiwan.

Far too much American time and effort, blood and treasure - have been spent on the shitty little countries of the MidEast. For 40 years. With little to show for it.

The 21st Century is the Asia-Pacific Century


Stop it Cedarford. You're making the people who think the main story is about Obama's mispronounciation of Suu Kyi's name feel stoopid.

phx said...

Then why couldn't President Obama care enough to not be insulting?

You guys wonder why you don't get taken seriously.

Drago said...

McTriumph: "The Asian-Pacific century started in the 80s"

By the 1880's (yes, 1880's) Japan had already been busy building itself up to take on the Chinese and Russians.

We had the Sino-Japanese war (which Japan won) in the mid/late 1890's and Japanese defeat of the Russians in 1905.

There was that unpleasantness and "slight setback" for the Japanese in 1945, but since then things have been going well for them (except for their last few "lost decades" when they experienced the results of economic and monetary policy which mirrors obama's).

Of course, the Chinese think in terms of millenia, so they are quite confident that the 2900's will totally belong to them.

Drago said...

phx: "Stop it Cedarford. You're making the people who think the main story is about Obama's mispronounciation of Suu Kyi's name feel stoopid."

No one is saying it's the "main story". It's simply a "story".

How do we know it's a story?

Because the left told us over many decades that slip ups like this are a story.

In the same way that the populace thinks obama controls gas prices because for 8 years dems told us that bush controlled gas prices.

It's not really very complicated.

Nathan Alexander said...

@phx
You guys wonder why you don't get taken seriously by fundamentally unserious people.

FIFY

DADvocate said...

I will give Obama credit for this:

I'll give credit to Sylvester Stallone who brought the situation in Burma to national attention in his 2008 Rambo.

phx said...

You guys wonder why you don't get taken seriously by fundamentally unserious people, like voters!.
FIF You!

phx said...

How do we know it's a story?

Because the left told us over many decades that slip ups like this are a story.


Well I don't know you learned it from but you sound like a group of chimpanzees examing a watch. Completely out of your league.

I'd try to be more selective who I took lessons from in the future.

Scott said...

I wrote:

"Since when did the Washington Post return to calling Myanmar "Burma"? And why?"

Althouse responded:

The U.S. government uses the name Burma.

That's not the question. WaPo is calling the country "Burma" but the Associated Press is calling it "Myanmar."

I was assuming they changed their reference, just as you seem to be assuming that the WaPo is calling it "Burma" because the United States government calls it Burma. We don't know. But if WaPo and AP are doing things differently, then WaPo must have at some point in the past decided to diverge from AP style on this. WaPo's online archive doesn't go back much earlier than 2006, so it's hard to spot check when that might have happened.

jimbino said...

Though I try not to listen to Obama, I think I heard him trying to stop the "is is" tic during his latest press conference.

He continues with the "a person...they..." stupidity, however.

McTriumph said...

Drago
Well played!

US-ASEAN is a great strategic move, they have already told the USA to pound salt, all member states in the region will each deal bilaterally with China, USA butt out.

Clyde said...

Didn't see him today, but saw yesterday's press conference in Thailand with Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra. She's a hottie, especially for 45. They say that politics is Hollywood for ugly people, but in her case, that definitely does not apply!

Drago said...

phx: "I'd try to be more selective who I took lessons from in the future."

Well, there is certainly no argument from me that dems are not to be emulated.

I am pleased to see that you agree with that. There is hope for you yet, though dimming.

Unfortunately, I don't control the actions of others.

Drago said...

McTriumph: "US-ASEAN is a great strategic move, they have already told the USA to pound salt, all member states in the region will each deal bilaterally with China, USA butt out."

This.

You can't really blame the key players in each critical region to now "go it alone". They can see quite clearly what obama is up to (or more precisely, not up to).

All the lefty spin in the world isn't going to keep any nation from pursuing it's own interests as they them.

Chuck66 said...

Yup...imagine if George Bush has made these errors.

garage mahal said...

Drago's back!

Fresh off that Nostradamus-esque election prediction.

David said...

Pivot to Asia.

What a crock.

The rest of the country pivoted to Asia several decades ago. Richard Nixon was the Wilt Chamberlin of the Asia pivot, and American commerce has been there big time ever since.

Geopolitically there were the little matters of Admiral Peary, the White Fleet, the Phillipines, that World War II thing, the rebirth of Japan under the occupation, the Korean War, the French Indochina War, the American Vietnam War, maintaining independent Formosa, Nixon to China, huge commercial ties and all the other stuff I left out.

So now we begin a "pivot." And it ends up in Burma?

Well, ok, but the impassion of being cutting edge is a little too much.

Drago said...

garage: "Drago's back!"

I feel an eeyore "Thanks for noticing me...." comment coming on!

LOL

I've been back here and there but since the election I've been buried in work, and most of it is related to helping clients deal with the obvious ramifications of current administration policies.

garage: "Fresh off that Nostradamus-esque election prediction"

Again, my "prediction" was simply a range of possible outcomes which would be determined by which turnout models and data (more obama-optimistic or more Romney-optimistic) would apply.

I did not have access to anyone's raw data nor did I have access to Silvers "black box" algorithm method (which he applies arbitrarily).

I don't really know how many different ways I can say that.

I suppose I can continue to try to explain it to you, but in the end it won't work since I cannot comprehend it for you.

LOL

Sam L. said...

I'm sure I would, but OBAMA? He da Smartest Man In Da Woild!

David said...

Those Republican warmongers under Eisenhower ended the Korean War (refusing to use nuclear weapons as recommended by some) and refused to get involved in France's Indochina War (again refusing to use nuclear weapons). Poor Old Ike, such a nothing President. (Or so it seems to those who know zilch about history.)

Nathan Alexander said...

You guys wonder why you don't get taken seriously by fundamentally unserious people, like voters!.

Further evidence that the left has demonized conservatives to the point of non-existence.

Because even by the most niggardly estimates, Romney garnered 60 million votes, a full 48% of the 2012 voters.

Drago said...

David: "Richard Nixon was the Wilt Chamberlin of the Asia pivot, and American commerce has been there big time ever since."

Ouch.

The Wilt Chamberlain of the Asia pivot?

All too true, but I cannot rid myself of the image of Nixon walking the beach in his dress shoes and thinking, "oooh, is that really gonna help Nixon score with the asian ladies at a Wilt level"?

PoNyman said...

Maybe Obama is a fan of 'Arrested Development'.

David said...

Here's my favorite passage from the WAPO article:

"After meeting with President Thein Sein, the civilian leader who took control of the country from the junta, Obama for the first time referred to the country as “Myanmar,” the name used by the nation’s own leaders. The U.S. government’s policy has been to continue using “Burma” — the English name based on the Burmese colloquial word for the country and the one used by the opposition when speaking English. A year after brutally crushing pro-democracy demonstrations, the junta changed the name of the country in English from the Socialist Republic of the Union of Burma to the Union of Myanmar in 1989."

phx said...

Further evidence that the left has demonized conservatives to the point of non-existence.

Tell it to the Human Rights Commission, suckah!

Drago said...

BTW, I don't care who you are, this is just a whole bucket of fun:

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/video-9-old-football-sensation-samantha-gordon-jukes-173358887--nfl.html

jrberg3 said...

"ADDED: "Obama Repeatedly Mispronounces Aung San Suu Kyi." "

Remembering names is so pre-election!

garage mahal said...

Just razzing you Drago. Couldn't resist. And you're a pretty good sport.

Drago said...

phx: "Tell it to the Human Rights Commission, suckah!"

I'm still waiting to hear the left strongly condemn the murder of homosexuals in muslim countries.

Of course, since the left spends so much time defending the muslims, I suppose it would be unfair to ask the left to point out any negative muslim vs homosexuals activities.

It's almost like the left doesn't actually believe a single thing they lecture us about.

mark said...

(mark said) Then why couldn't President Obama care enough to not be insulting?

(phx said) You guys wonder why you don't get taken seriously.

Yes, because democrats don't understand cultures and the importance of not being stupid like Obama. Take a guess at the "respect" (which seems to be rather important in Asian cultures) felt towards you if the person standing with you can't even bother to know your name. Or how to talk about your position and name correctly.

Imagine the snafu of calling up Nicki Minaj as "Nick Mangy" for her music award. Think she would shrug it off? And she is a nobody.

Obama is supposed to be selling America as the better international partner for the future. And proving that he (and Obama=America when he is there) couldn't give a rats ass about treating them with respect, speaks for how we would treat them as a nation. As beneath contempt.

And considering 51% of our nation agrees with Obama ... maybe China is a better partner for them. Because Jerusalem could be turned to glass and you would still praise the intelligence of Obama.

Drago said...

garage: "Just razzing you Drago. Couldn't resist. And you're a pretty good sport."

Oh yeah?!

Well you can take your comment and sho.......

Huh?

Oh.

Thanks.

Tank said...

Cedarford said...

It's a good geostrategic move.
China has developed a mentality that Burma is China's.
Burma, like Vietnam, Indonesia, Malaysia...is begging to differ. Burma does not want to be considered a "Tribute Nation" of China, and a visit by Obama helps.
The Philipines, Japan, Australia are also resisting China's moves and the idea of union with China is less popular today with the people of Taiwan.

Far too much American time and effort, blood and treasure - have been spent on the shitty little countries of the MidEast. For 40 years. With little to show for it.

The 21st Century is the Asia-Pacific Century


So, C-4 advocates spending the next 40 years of American time and effort, blood and treasure, on the shitty little countries in the Asian-Pacific.

Wrong lesson learned.

phx said...

Drago's a pretty good sport. I don't think he actually dreams of having Obama supporters arrested - and beaten in a basement underneath the stadium. Well maybe.

For some reason he reminds me of that Carl Sandburg quote, "You can fool some of the wingers all of the time, and all of the wingers some of the time, but you can't fool all of the wingers all of the time."

That was Carl Sandburg, right?

Drago said...

phx: "Drago's a pretty good sport. I don't think he actually dreams of having Obama supporters arrested - and beaten in a basement underneath the stadium."

That would be silly! No one could actually SEE you beat them if it's in a basement under the stadium!

To be effective it would have to be right out in the open.

Sheesh. Everybody knows that.


phx: "That was Carl Sandburg, right?"

I'm 76.2167% sure Carl Sandburg was an underachieving second baseman for the Philadelphia A's.

I might be mistaken.

Nonapod said...

Dale Carnegie said that "a person's name is to that person the sweetest and most important sound in any language". As a corollary to that I'd like to point out that getting a persons name wrong can be a greater insult than one might suppose.

At any rate, since I find listening to Obama's blather about as tedious and irritating as waiting in line at the DMV with a full bladder I can't bring myself to actually listen to this speech.

Chip Ahoy said...

would no doubt have sparked peals of outrage

I'm glad to see this locution used because it's confirmation, why, just yesterday I couldn't decide if it was peels or peals.

edutcher said...

Drago said...

Stop it Cedarford. You're making the people who think the main story is about Obama's mispronounciation of Suu Kyi's name feel stoopid.

No one is saying it's the "main story". It's simply a "story".


Sad to say, it's the Neverending Story.

phx said...

Drago's a pretty good sport. I don't think he actually dreams of having Obama supporters arrested - and beaten in a basement underneath the stadium. Well maybe.

No, taken out and shot. That way, they're gone for good.

Nathan Alexander said...

Tell it to the Human Rights Commission, suckah!

I did, but they said they weren't there to protect the rights of conservatives.

phx said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
phx said...

Ouch. I guess you'll have to take the personal responsibility for yourselves.

garage mahal said...

Drago's a pretty good sport. I don't think he actually dreams of having Obama supporters arrested - and beaten in a basement underneath the stadium.

Speaking of which, Christopher in MA seems to have flown the coop.

Also Jay?

phx said...

Or...you could continue to whine whine whine.

F said...

Of course he mispronounces Aung San Suu Kyi. He doesn't speak Burmanian, you know.

phx said...

Speaking of which, Christopher in MA seems to have flown the coop.

Also Jay?


Yeah. You-know-who's the bottom-feeder now.

garage mahal said...

No, taken out and shot. That way, they're gone for good.

Now I know you really don't mean this, edutcher.

phx said...

...speaking of...

rcommal said...

I am currently on hold with the Washington Post, asking them to confirm when they switched back to Burma or if they never switched away. I know they've used Burma for a long time, and I just don't want to rely on my recollection as to whether they ever switched away to Myanmar at all or, if they did, switched back.

I have an article ready to link that specifies when AP and NYT did, for example, when I get off the phone...

rcommal said...

Still on hold, but I do want to note that while most papers use the AP Style Guide (which does change; I own at least 4 editions myself of the print version and one of the broadcast), there are certainly major newspapers that have their own, extensive (even more extensive) ones. NYT (I have a copy somewhere and WaPo (I don't) would be examples.

Comanche Voter said...

Geez mispronunciations? If it had been Bush or Romney the press would have pounced and described this as a diplomatic debacle.

edutcher said...

garage mahal said...

No, taken out and shot. That way, they're gone for good.

Now I know you really don't mean this, edutcher.


How many times did your guys mean it?

Amartel said...

TOTUS doesn't spell out phonetic pronunciations. It's not a Speak and Spell, fergawdsake.
(Silicon Valley brainiacs are feverishly working on that one right now.)

rcommal said...

OK. Just got off the phone.

First: whether they ever switched away to Myanmar at all or, if they did, switched back" should have read whether they ever switched away to Myanmar at all or, if they did, when they switched back.

Second, here's the link to which I referred, followed by a highlighted paragraph from it:

From the AP itself, mentioning some changes to Myanmar, including its own

Australia and the European Union use "Myanmar," although they've otherwise been in lockstep on policy with the U.S. and Britain, which use "Burma." Among rights groups, Amnesty International uses "Myanmar," but Human Rights Watch says "Burma." Among news media, The New York Times has used "Myanmar" since 1989; the main international news agencies including The Associated Press followed suit in 1998, but the BBC still sticks with "Burma." The Financial Times switched to "Myanmar" this January[2012].

Those years for NYT and AP are in line with what I recalled.

As for WaPo, the person I spoke with on the Foreign News desk said she could not recall any switch away from Burma [in the context of my questions and in our conversation, she was referring to prior to the aughts, and she read the entry to me from the WaPo style book, which, to sum up, states the paper's official style choice as "Burma," but with the secondary use of, for example, "(Myanmar)" for clarification.

Yeah, I'm a nerd, but it drove me crazy that I too couldn't get back far/deep enough into the archives to check this. My memory was that WaPo had diverged from other outlets, notably the NYT, on the use of Burma vs. Myanmar, but I sure wouldn't rely on it with regard to something as arguable arcane as this.

Now, I can go back to what I'm supposed to be doing with some peace of mind.


; )

Nathan Alexander said...

Or...you could continue to whine whine whine.

You've got a syntax problem with your verb, there.

For me to continue to whine, I'd have to have already started.

Unless you've redefined "whine" as "pointing out the emperor is not wearing any clothes"...?

Amartel said...

I, me, mine.
Topic #1 is always Himself.
He's used to being the Most Interesting Man in the Room.
In his own mind, that is.

Rusty said...

phx said...
How do we know it's a story?

Because the left told us over many decades that slip ups like this are a story.

Well I don't know you learned it from but you sound like a group of chimpanzees examing a watch. Completely out of your league.

I'd try to be more selective who I took lessons from in the future.

And be sure to inform the other chimps you hang with. Thanks

Rabel said...

Aung YAN Suu Kyi is not a mispronunciation of Aung SAN Suu Kyi.

It's just the wrong name.

phx said...

Further evidence that the left has demonized conservatives to the point of non-existence. = whining.

jimbino said...

Obama was also the first president to take a Black Amerikan family to Yellowstone.

I did, however, manage to count 4 Black faces (no families) among the 4000 I saw last winter in 20 national parks and forests and in state parks, forests and beaches of the West.

rcommal said...

Phonetic spellings can and are used in broadcast scripts and on teleprompters. No way of knowing if that was employed in this case, of course, or how it was done.

I do think that if the President is going to highlight a visit with a famous dissident, he should pronounce the name correctly. OTOH, people and presidents do slip up, and this doesn't seem like THAT big of one, when you listen to how the CNN broadcaster said it, he said it and the demo pronunciations here and here, for example.

I agree that partisans and media outlets made hay out of similar gaffes on the part of Bush II, for example, so in this sense I can understand why folks are jumping on this. Paybacks can be a bitch, and all of that. In both cases, most though not all of the time, I think it's overboard, though, and not particularly useful FWIW (not much, no doubt, and that's fine).

Nathan Alexander said...

Saying that conservative concerns don't resonate with voters when 60 million voted for the GOP candidate, i.e., implying/believing that only liberals count as voters = demonizing the conservative viewpoint to the point of non-existence in your worldview.

Or, to put it another way, pointing out epistemic closure on your part != whining

However, I recognize that the reason liberals post here is to practice their ability to find excuses to ignore anything they don't like. So if you want to categorize anything I say as whining so you don't have to deal with it and can stay cocooned, well, I can't say I'm surprised.

Paul said...

He's just snort'en coke again I bet.

Getting more and more like Biden.

And just about as relevant.

No hope for change.

phx said...

So if you want to categorize anything I say as whining so you don't have to deal with it and can stay cocooned, well, I can't say I'm surprised.

Oh no, no. I'll definitely deal with the whining, too. I've had a lot of experience babysitting.


rhhardin said...

It needed Greek columns.

Unknown said...

my take: C4 is taking the geostrategic view, and an, IMO, an important one. The comments about mispronounciation do speak to an ill prepared state visit, but the main point is to recognize what our strategic interests are.

The fact that Mr Obama is visiting nations in SE will not be lost of the Chinese government. Credit where credit is due. The nations of SE Asia recognize full well their relationship with China, who, as C4 notes, regards them as vassal states.

Rabel said...

A local Burmese view on the pivot:

Bigger issues than pronunciation

garage mahal said...

How many times did your guys mean it?

Don't recall any liberals on this blog ever call for the death of conservatives. I know I have not.

Roger J. said...

Damn-did it again--the 3:07 post is mine--I gotta remember to log on on the right account.

Hagar said...

The State Department has a whole section of people on protocol, and part of their duties is to prepare ambassadors and other luminaries, such as the president, before their appearnces so that things like this won't happen.

However, you can lead a horse to water, but ....

Fritz said...

Impeach TOTUS!

Nathan Alexander said...


Don't recall any liberals on this blog ever call for the death of conservatives. I know I have not.


Right. You prefer the Democrat way of making death threats: personal and credible.

There were plenty of Democrats threatening to riot and/or assassinate Romney if he won. I know there were no conservatives threatening the same if Obama won.

Nathan Alexander said...

Don't get me wrong, I don't support threatening violence or death on anyone.

But to pretend that liberals' hands are clean is laughable on the face of it.

Liberals are cold-hearted murderers.

Big Mike said...

Hagar is right. We don't expect presidents to know everybody's name and how to pronounce it properly, but we do pay experts a great deal of money to know this information and to be ready to convey it to the President, Vice President, Secretary of State, and anyone else who is officially representing the United States at an official event. After some of the huge gaffes that characterized the early days of his administration you'd think Mr. Obama would have learned to avail himself of their expertise.

phx said...

Liberals are cold-hearted murderers.

Oh brother. You really need to join a Republican Party committee. The higher level the better. I would love you on the national Republican Party Committee, but whatever you do, make sure your views get out there.

phx said...

Good to see Roger J, a conservative warrior of some sober consideration. He's going to make me feel bad for having fun with some of you but I don't think it can be helped.

LarsPorsena said...

Unknown said...

my take: C4 is taking the geostrategic view, and an, IMO, an important one. The comments about mispronounciation do speak to an ill prepared state visit, but the main point is to recognize what our strategic interests are.

The fact that Mr Obama is visiting nations in SE will not be lost of the Chinese government. Credit where credit is due. The nations of SE Asia recognize full well their relationship with China, who, as C4 notes, regards them as vassal states.

11/19/12 3:07 PM
________________________________


Agree.

phx said...

And please don't blame RogerJ because I admire him. In no way is he responsible for my monkeyshines.

Baron Zemo said...

Hey does this bird know Chairman Moe?

Baron Zemo said...

Look what's the big deal?

Nobody knows better than Obama that having a Nobel Prize don't mean jack shit. So who cares if he can't say her name.

He is just being his usual arrogrant prick self.

He is the ultimate Ugly American.

garage mahal said...

Liberals are cold-hearted murderers.

And French effeminate metrosexuals!

Balfegor said...

Re: the mispronunciation, yes, Bush II would probably have mispronounced it too, but the man mispronounced English. In Obama's case, well, yes he mispronounces English too (e.g. corpseman), but he's clearly capable of pronouncing foreign words correctly.

I don't know how these state visits work, but my guess is that is aides assumed, incorrectly, that the President, being such an educated man (haha), knew her name and how to pronounce it, and wouldn't need someone to remind him beforehand. And the President himself didn't know what he didn't know. As always. A minor thing, but revealing in its own minor way. At least if you make up a story the way I just did.

Inga said...

WTH?! Edutcher wants to shoot us under some bleachers?

phx said...

WTH?! Edutcher wants to shoot us under some bleachers?

It's okay, Inga. We found him wandering on the road, he was confused, but he's back with his family and resting comfortably. You can visit in a little while but don't stay long.

Cedarford said...

David - Geopolitically there were the little matters of Admiral Peary, the White Fleet, the Phillipines, that World War II thing, the rebirth of Japan under the occupation, the Korean War, the French Indochina War, the American Vietnam War, maintaining independent Formosa, Nixon to China, huge commercial ties and all the other stuff I left out.

So now we begin a "pivot." And it ends up in Burma?


Call it a pivot back, then, if you like.
But since the early 70s. we sort of left the Pacific to obsess about "peace" in several intractable shitty little countries in the ME, devoting far too much money, blood, and diplomatic attention on them. Some had oil, but we are now opening up vast new US reserves. Some had critical geostrategic position in the Cold War with the Soviets - Turkey and Egypt and Iran - but the Soviets are not the menace they once were. Not even with Putin being all KGB revanchist. Even the Russians are starting to mock him.

Since the Suez Canal mainly serves the Europeans, let them fret over it's security for free navigation, same with Bosphorus. The days of free security from a now-broke Uncle Sugar Daddy are ending.
The Panama Canal is more important to us. THe Indonesian Straits to our interests in Indian Ocean/Asian commerce.

Long since time to pivot back to Asia. And unlike the deranged crapholes of the ME or nations there that have no real importance to our vital interests, the Pacific Rim is full of important nations of great resources, military and economic power. And also tractible to change and a peaceful harmony. (with the notable exception of N KOrea, China's deformed little baby).

Keep in mind Pacific Powers also include Russia, Australia-NZ, Chile, Mexico, 7 other Latin nations. Japan and the Asian Little Tigers. (of which Burma may join, along with Vietnam, even Cambodia some time. )

The Middle East? Nations that demand money from us, burn our embassies, meddle in our internal politics. All can teach the French lessons in rudeness and ingratitude. Time to put all of them in the rear view mirror, end all immigration into the US from there and Africa and Haiti.



phx said...

I don't know how these state visits work, but my guess is that is aides assumed, incorrectly, that the President, being such an educated man (haha), knew her name and how to pronounce it, and wouldn't need someone to remind him beforehand. And the President himself didn't know what he didn't know. As always. A minor thing, but revealing in its own minor way.

The President already met with her publicly and privately at the White House in September. My guess is there's more to this pronunciation affair than you knuckleheads think. Folks who wouldn't believe an AP reporter or journalist if he told him the sun rose in the east suddenly believe he's the gospel on pronouncing all things Burmese.

Anyway, whatever. It's one of the happier stories in international affairs in recent years.

phx said...

I mean "knuckleheads" in the most politically correct, respectful and nonpartisan way possible, btw.

Baron Zemo said...

Meanwhile we are about to have another war in the Middle East and the Jug Eared Jesus is off on a jaunt.

Nothing to see here. Just move along.

Baron Zemo said...

Just know that we are going to see many more of these vacatio.....err....State visits as his domestic policy goes in the dumper. Most Presidents do that in their second term.

Barry should be going non-stop.

He will be the first person to visit many new places.

How about Cuba?

Baron Zemo said...

First President that is....not first person.

Baron Zemo said...

I bet he as already been there as a private citizen. Just sayn'

Inga said...

"We" are not about to have another war in the ME.

How many more nation's wars do we need to involve ourselves in? We have a limited number of troops who have already done numerous repeat deployments.

edutcher said...

Interesting how the Lefties get all wound when someone says about them what their own say about anybody they dislike and they just ignore it.

phx said...

WTH?! Edutcher wants to shoot us under some bleachers?

It's okay, Inga. We found him wandering on the road, he was confused, but he's back with his family and resting comfortably. You can visit in a little while but don't stay long.


You have met The Blonde's family.

Have you.

PS Israel's fight is ours; given the tools, they can do the job. Zero wants it the other way around, of course, so all the Moslems see him as the new Caliph, but Israel is our outpost in the Middle East.

They get in trouble, we're in trouble.

Inga said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
exhelodrvr1 said...

THis will be good if they actually follow it up. If they don't, it will backfire. Unfortunately, based on the past four years, the backfire seems more likely. This administration has a tendency to say whatever seems convenient at the time, without thinking ahead.

Balfegor said...

Re: phx:

The President already met with her publicly and privately at the White House in September. My guess is there's more to this pronunciation affair than you knuckleheads think. Folks who wouldn't believe an AP reporter or journalist if he told him the sun rose in the east suddenly believe he's the gospel on pronouncing all things Burmese.

No, I checked the IPA used on Wikipedia.

Because Anonymous People on the Internet >>> Journalists.

Baron Zemo said...

Cedarford and Inga want to abandon Israel to their fate. They are not asking for our troops. Just to be let alone to do the job.

Of course Barack Hussein Obama will not do that. He will cut off re-supply. Intelligence. He will do everything he can to stop Israel from winning the war against Muslim extremism.

It is the Muslims states like Saudi and Kuwait who called for our troops not Israel.

Baron Zemo said...

Of course that does not matter to anti-semtic libtards who are afraid of offending the mindless barbarians who murder our ambassadors with impunity.

Good job Barry!

Baron Zemo said...

Obama is like Cedarford.

gutless said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Inga said...

What's going on with Zemo and Edutcher the last few days? I detect a longing for war, for the spilling of blood, related to a deep dissapoinment that Obama won.

Any diversion that could possibly detract from him as a leader is utmost on their minds. They want it so badly.They cannot rest until their wishes, hopes and desires come to fruition, even of they have to make shit up.

Unknown said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
phx said...

No, I checked the IPA used on Wikipedia.

Because Anonymous People on the Internet >>> Journalists.


All right then, as long as you've done everything you can.

Chip S. said...

Inga,

Israel is a "distraction" from the really important stuff, like Burma?

Speaking of Burma, why are the people there called "Burmese" instead of "Burmans", like "Jamaicans"? Too sexist? When what about "Burmanian", like "Ghanians"? And what are they called under the country's other name, "Myanmarese"? "Myanmaryans" is so much more musical.

These constructs always puzzle me. Why are people from Portugal called "Portugese" while people from Senegal are "Senegalese"?

edutcher said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
edutcher said...

Oop's concern trolling for myself and Troop is touching. but then, so was the NKVD's concern for anyone Uncle Joe didn't like.

Fact is, they've been firing rockets into Israel for how long and the Israelis are finally saying, "Enough, already".

Oop who, in previous episodes, has told us she'd have a hard time sitting in judgment on the gang at Auschwitz because it isn't his/hers/its to pass judgment has no problems watching an old friend of this country go down, as long as it's the Messiah's will.

And the line, "Any diversion that could possibly detract from him as a leader", is risible since we all know Dictator Zero leads from behind, when he isn't voting "present".

PS 1 ess, 2 pees in "disappointment"

Inga said...

Chip,
No Isreal is not a distraction, the distraction is the idea that Obama would not help Isreal, that Obama would cut off resupply, intelligence and favor Muslim nations as Zemo asserts. It's more conspiracy theories.

As for Edutcher, what the fuck are you talking about? Have you really gone insane?

Chip S. said...

Now "Siamese" seems just right. Much better than "Siamian," which looks too much like "Simian".

Too bad they changed it.

Inga said...

And Edutcher , yes we all know that Baron Zemo is Trooper York, you're not telling us anything new and I'm sure he thanks you for continually bringing it up.

Chip S. said...

I wonder if Obama would know how to pronounce "Siam".

Chip S. said...

Baron Zemo is Trooper York

I don't think this is right.

Baron Zemo is a good speller.

Inga said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Inga said...

Chip, well that's only because he has special Baron Zemo powers when he comments in that purple suit.

Chip S. said...

I think "BZ" is really Bob Ellison, acting out his proposal to comment in the style of some other commenter.

Chip S. said...

IIRC, Bob E. went to Harvard, which might be the source of his spelling super-powers.

Lydia said...

These constructs always puzzle me. Why are people from Portugal called "Portugese" while people from Senegal are "Senegalese"?

And how did some people end up speaking Brooklynese?

Chip S. said...

Indeed.

Shoulda been called "Brooklish".

pm317 said...

Chuck Currie said...
--------------

I am coming to that same conclusion.

phx said...

I pledge that this will be my last comment, here and elsewhere on the web, and in my life in general, on the life and times of President Obama. From this point forth, I will do everything in my power to ignore him.

I respect that. That's a fine resolution.

EMD said...

Inga is keepin' it Isreal.

Balfegor said...

Re: Chip S:

Speaking of Burma, why are the people there called "Burmese" instead of "Burmans", like "Jamaicans"? Too sexist? When what about "Burmanian", like "Ghanians"? And what are they called under the country's other name, "Myanmarese"? "Myanmaryans" is so much more musical.

These constructs always puzzle me. Why are people from Portugal called "Portugese" while people from Senegal are "Senegalese"
?

I love adjectival constructions for place names. But they are best in the UK:

Glasgow => Glaswegian
Liverpool => Liverpudlian / Scouse
Manchester => Mancunian
Aberdeen => Aberdonian
Newcastle => Novocastrian / Geordie

There's a few foreign constructions that are similarly fun (e.g. Bombay => Mumbaikar), but nothing as entertaining as Pool => Pudlian.

edutcher said...

Inga said...

And Edutcher , yes we all know that Baron Zemo is Trooper York, you're not telling us anything new and I'm sure he thanks you for continually bringing it up.

If he gets mad, he'll tell me.

Chip S. said...

"Mancunian" is my candidate for best variant.

It's a killer.

Inga said...

Hey, I know it's Israel, I just didn't have my Baron Zemo purple suit on.

yashu said...

"Mancunian" is great. Also fond of "Liverpudlian."

Or how about "Walloon"?

Just learned the word for these: "demonyms." Great word itself. So punnable.

Here's a list of some demonyms.

New favorite from that list: "Smithereen."

Inga said...

Ok Edutcher, let's call him Trooper Zemo then.

Craig said...

Bush couldn't say jamal islamia even though he considered it the number one priority for the Philippine government. He butchered it three times in one speech. His closest approximation was phi slamma jamma.

phx said...

The Smithereens are a favourite of mine, too.

phx said...

Ok Edutcher, let's call him Trooper Zemo then.

We would but edutcher can't pronounce it.

yashu said...

Great band. Also an odd little movie with Richard Hell in it.

So would the denizens of this blog be Althousians? Althousers? Althucks? Alties? Althoos?

Inga said...

Altheimers.

yashu said...

Heh, good one, Inga.

edutcher said...

Althousians is what I always hear on holidays as in, "Merry Christmas to all the Althousians".

YMMV

PS Since the election, phx and Oop think they own the place.

Be hysterical if somebody came along and said, "We have important new evidence. Barack Obama is not the President..."

Eric said...

George Orwell, "Shooting an Elephant"

That's a great essay. My favorite, next to "A Hanging", which takes place in the same land.

Inga said...

Feeling a bit displaced Edutcher? Out of sorts? Well, snap out of it, you're disturbing people here with your talk of shooting them under some bleachers somewhere, you need to cool your jets.

Who owns this blog? Not Edutcher, not Inga, not Phx, Ann Althouse does.

yashu said...

Althousians is what I always hear on holidays as in, "Merry Christmas to all the Althousians".

God bless us, everyone!

phx said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
phx said...

That was a nice sentiment edutcher. Not the one about Inga and me thinking we own the place, of course, but the other one.

Oh, and not the one about shooting us in a basement so we wouldn't make any noise, but the other nice sentiment.

Inga said...

Oh was it in a basement? Here I thought it was under the bleachers.

phx said...

PS Since the election, phx and Oop think they own the place.

Gonna start charging your freeloadin' ass rent, suckah!

phx said...

Yes, God bless us everyone!

Inga said...

Pretty soon it's Turkey Day, when turkey murder is sanctioned. See Sarah Palin turkey slaughter video.

leslyn said...

Hard to believe that Chip S and Lydia are trivializingthe topic of this post. Have they no shame! Next they'll be lobbying to put "nucular" in the OED.

leslyn said...

Why should the President be spending his time on improving foreign relations? Couldn't we send Romney to do that?

wildswan said...

Never mind Senegalese. How about the phrase "in a spray following the bilat," in the story? I thought that someone's iphone was auto-correcting but apparently these words have the approximate meaning "in a photo-op following the meeting between the two". Your brain forms neurons throughout life and each language has its own special section and I think I just got some more neurons but what language section will they be in?

EMD said...

Feeling a bit displaced Edutcher? Out of sorts? Well, snap out of it, you're disturbing people here with your talk of shooting them under some bleachers somewhere, you need to cool your jets.

Like our hostess, Ed is an amateur shutterbug.

EMD said...

Obama should have just watched The Lady on the plane ride over.

EMD said...

See Sarah Palin turkey slaughter video.

Which was fucking awesome.

Chip S. said...

Which was fucking awesome.

So true. We've made watching it a regular part of our Thanksgiving Day celebration.

«Oldest ‹Older   1 – 200 of 204   Newer› Newest»