November 14, 2012

How do you get the position of "social liaison" in the U.S. military?

Well, it's just not actually a position.
It seems that Jill Kelley, the other other woman in the unfolding Petraeus scandal, acquired the honorific via media reports struggling to describe her ambiguous volunteer role as a popular hostess to Central Command’s military elite....
“There’s no such thing,” one officer told us. The made-up title appears to be a polite way of saying “rich Tampa socialite who likes to hang with four-star generals.”
I thought of some other things it would be a polite way of saying, but I won't mention them. I'll just suggest that the officer is only portraying the women in a negative light. What about the generals? The women couldn't have made any progress in the role of "social liaison" if the generals didn't want to be liaised. What the hell are these men doing appropriating the power and prestige of the United States military for the purpose of liaising with women-of-a-certain-type? These are the men who send enlistees into battle, who demand sacrifice from idealistic young Americans. They should not be flaunting whatever pleasures they pursue.

And by the way, how does one get the position called "socialite"? It's not as though that's anything more than a characterization of what someone appears to be doing. Wikipedia says:
A socialite is a slightly pejorative term for a member of a social elite, or someone aspiring to be a member.... A socialite participates in social activities and spends a significant amount of time entertaining and being entertained at fashionable events....

American Members of The Establishment, or an American "Society" based on birth, breeding, education, and economic standing, were originally listed in the Social Register.... Members of true "society" were distinguishable from members of post World-War I "cafe society," from whom are further distanced "socialites," who are considered aspirational members of true "society," but with no substantive social credentials or personal achievements.
You never hear about true "society" anymore. Only the pretenders get any attention now. But what are they pretenders to? To nothing!

I've got another question: Do identical twins tilt their head sideways the same way at the same time? Because that photograph is driving me nuts.

160 comments:

mccullough said...

4-star Groupie might be a better term.

Pragmatist said...

It drives me nuts too...probably for a differant reason. But one seems much more accessorized than the other. I guess some twins are more gaudy than others.

Surfed said...

How so very ...Kardashian.

shiloh said...

"Because that photograph is driving me nuts."

Apparently!

Levi Starks said...

I think groupie is the word I'm searching for.

John said...

Camp follower Levi. Camp follower is the term you are looking for.

YoungHegelian said...

What the hell are these men doing appropriating the power and prestige of the United States military for the purpose of liaising with women-of-a-certain-type?

After 32 years of being in DC, I'm not sure there's any other reason why guys work to acquire power & prestige, except to "liase" with chicks of pretty much any type that are available (pretty faces & boobs preferred, of course).

The other day the female interns at one of my clients were going on about how gorgeous the female interns at the House & Senate are (and these interns aren't slouches themselves). They called the Capital Building "Dream Land for Boys". The male interns just sat there staring at their shoes.

TosaGuy said...

"These are the men who send enlistees into battle, who demand sacrifice from idealistic young Americans. They should not be flaunting whatever pleasures they pursue."

There is alot of rot in the leadership of nearly all organizations in this country and Obama supporters will not rest until that rot is sticken from institutions they don't like.

Rusty said...

I've got another question: Do identical twins tilt their head sideways the same way at the same time? Because that photograph is driving me nuts.

My mother and her sister were identical twins. Yes, they had the same mannerisms and the same handedness. They would finish each others sentences.

Roger J. said...

Move the fucking CENTOCM HQ to Fargo, NOrth Dakota. (there's an air force base there), and "role" of social liason will disappear after the first North Dakota winter.

Palladian said...

Why is the one with the fullback physique wearing anal beads around her neck?

X said...

How do you get the position of "social liaison" in the U.S. military?


the same way Mrs. Patraeus got the "military liason" position at the Consumer Finance Protection Bureau. by keeping your mouth shut.

Cato Renasci said...

'society' still exists, but is very quiet and private now.

these two Khawama women (are they muslims?) are obviously very ambitious social climbers; both appear to have heavyweight Democratic party/fundraising connections.

I think this was clearly a honey trap intended to compromise senior military officers - on whose behalf is unclear - and I think that Broadwell actually had Petraeus' best interests in mind when her instincts told her the Khawama girls were big time trouble.

There is SO much more here than meets the eye!

Strelnikov said...

Patraeus better watch out for the big one. Looks like she has him tightly gripped. And she outweighs him.

mojavehicular said...

"Kim and Khloe Take CENTCOM."

mccullough said...

X,

Very good point. Why did the government give Petraeus wife a high-paying gold-bricking government job. It's ridiculous.

Erika said...

I know it's terrible but I'm confused by how/why Holly Petraeus has persisted in her extreme dowdiness. I've spent quite a lot of time around officers' wives and 95% of them are very careful about appearances and being put together. Cute haircuts with expensive color work, manis and pedis and immaculate makeup, stylish outfits with nice shoes and well-chosen accessories, and perhaps most importantly lots of time at the gym. Mrs. P must have stuck out like a sore thumb at these parties with her grandma hair and extra sixty pounds.

YoungHegelian said...

@Cato,

There is SO much more here than meets the eye!

And the Khawama sisters were (are) in need of cash, too. Now, what has been the primary reason for the past fifty years that people spy for foreign powers on US soil? Money. Principle!? Pshaw! Do those two ladies look like the Lebanese version of the Rosenbergs to you?

This really does seem to be a classic honeypot operation.

SteveR said...

I am sure no one is making a concious decision to make these "social" activities happen. In the military, they just do. It would take a dramatic and difficult effort to change it. The easy path to avoid problems is the well worn one.

Chip S. said...

Well, it's just not actually a position.

Oh, I think it's a position, for sure.

Underling.

Chip S. said...

Why is the one with the fullback physique wearing anal beads around her neck?

Cuz she just pulled her head out of her ass for the pic?

Tank said...

What the hell are these men doing appropriating the power and prestige of the United States military for the purpose of liaising with women-of-a-certain-type? These are the men who send enlistees into battle, who demand sacrifice from idealistic young Americans. They should not be flaunting whatever pleasures they pursue.

Oh, for Christ's sake, ask Meade to explain this to you.

Or was it rhetorical? Aha.

phx said...

I know it's terrible but I'm confused by how/why Holly Petraeus has persisted in her extreme dowdiness. I've spent quite a lot of time around officers' wives and 95% of them are very careful about appearances and being put together. Cute haircuts with expensive color work, manis and pedis and immaculate makeup, stylish outfits with nice shoes and well-chosen accessories, and perhaps most importantly lots of time at the gym. Mrs. P must have stuck out like a sore thumb at these parties with her grandma hair and extra sixty pounds.

It's Holly's fault.

Pogo said...

Unlike most cases, here we know what these women are and their price.

David said...

What the hell are these men doing appropriating the power and prestige of the United States military for the purpose of liaising with women-of-a-certain-type? These are the men who send enlistees into battle, who demand sacrifice from idealistic young Americans. They should not be flaunting whatever pleasures they pursue.

Or to assist them in a custody fight? What is with this entire social group? Broadwell I get. It's part of the publicity machine, and she was sexy, military and had her own actually legitimate agenda for the book. But these third rate social climbers have nothing to offer. They aren't even rich--broke and near broke is more like it. They dress like tarts, make up titles for themselves, gush over being invited to a fund raiser and generally act like the fools they are. Plus beyond the big tits, big eyes and big hair, they are not all that good looking.

Whatever this tells us about top military brass--and I'm not sure exactly what it is--the message is not a good one for their subordinates or for the country.

SomeoneHasToSayIt said...

Why shouldn't Alpha males have pick of willing females?

If anything is wired into our genes, it's that.

Get over it.

David said...

Palladian my guess is that the beads are from Gaspariilla Day. It's Tampa-St. Pete's imitation of Mardi Gras.

Pogo said...

"It's Holly's fault."

More correctly, it's that beautiful supportive noncompetitive rainbow of sisterly love, other women.

Hagar said...

They are not quite identical, and in most other photographs they incline their heads toward each other so that they look symmetrical.

And I think that most likely there is ;ess here than meets the eye. "Socials" at command headquarters are not a new thing in any man's army!

Sorun said...

"I know it's terrible but I'm confused by how/why Holly Petraeus has persisted in her extreme dowdiness."

I saw of photo of the couple when he graduated from West Point. They were Mr. & Mrs. Nerd. There's no glamour potential there.

David said...

SomeoneHasToSayIt said...
"Why shouldn't Alpha males have pick of willing females?

If anything is wired into our genes, it's that."

If they have their pick, why choose these tramps? I guess because some guys like tramps. There were plenty of beautiful, discreet women in Washington would would have dallied with Bill Clinton and never breathed a word of it--at least not while he was still President. Petraeus probably though Paula was one of those. She was, but either they were unlucky (also stupid) or there's a deep conspiracy here.

madAsHell said...

Plus beyond the big tits, big eyes and big hair, they are not all that good looking.

Beyond!?!?!

William said...

In my view any decent sex scandal should involve porn stars. On a risk/reward basis these women were simply not worth the investment of time, energy, and precious bodily fluids. I will give the Kelly girls credit for a being twins. Twins are worth bonus prurience points.....The guess here is that women who compete in triathlons cultivater obsessions more readily than friendships.

Chip S. said...

Let's take a closer look at those breasts.

William said...

In my view any decent sex scandal should involve porn stars. On a risk/reward basis these women were simply not worth the investment of time, energy, and precious bodily fluids. I will give the Kelly girls credit for a being twins. Twins are worth bonus prurience points.....The guess here is that women who compete in triathlons cultivater obsessions more readily than friendships.

Chip S. said...

There were plenty of beautiful, discreet women in Washington...

What makes you think they're not getting in on the fun, too?

Tank said...

Should be a poll on whether any of these "ladies" has their original unenhanced titties.

Best poll ever.

Rabel said...

"These are the men who send enlistees into battle, who demand sacrifice from idealistic young Americans. They should not be flaunting whatever pleasures they pursue."

Why not. They have a tough job. Signing those death notices can't be easy.

Since election day:

Pfc. Brandon L. Buttry, 19
Spc. Daniel L. Carlson, 21
Staff Sgt. Kenneth W. Bennett, 26
Capt. James D. Nehl, 37
Sgt. Matthew H. Stiltz, 26

Emil Blatz said...

A. You just make it up.

I took the FL Bar exam in July 2010 in Tampa, and didn't make hotel reservations until late. I ended up at the Doubletree which is near MacDill AFB. Although I was focused on other things, I couldn't help but notice the blur of guests and visitors, this unusual mix of women in high style (somewhat flashy) and men in combat fatigues. There may be more to this interaction that even appears in the unfolding Petraeus scandal. During the cold war, the Soviets sure used women as blackmail agents.

Aside from the titillating parts of this, I am amazed and aghast that a fellow who was atop the CIA was completely ignorant of cyber-security. Anyone who could have operated that way (using gmail, drop boxes, etc.) should never have been in that position. I wonder how ignortant some of the senior military and intelligence folks are about this.

Remember John Deutch, CIA director under Clinton? He had classified CIA information in his unsecured home PC. That was about 17 years ago, but it is not clear that folks have learned much in the intervening time. It makes me fear that the Chinese are eating our lunch in the intelligence field.

David said...

Meanwhile, Israel mounts major attack on Hamas as CIA is distracted and leaderless.

Chip S. said...

Tank, that poll would get Philadelphia-style results.

Now, "Landing Strip or Brazilian?" might split the vote 80/20 or so.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

How do you get the position of "social liaison" in the U.S. military?

I think the usual way of phrasing the question is Who do you have to sleep with to get the position of "social liaison"

Jypsea Rose said...

MIss Althouse,

My husband was in Iraq. He is a very thoughtful man, practically a Jedi Knight in his calm, rational demeanor. But last night I saw him become very passionate and inflamed in a way that I can count on one hand in the many years of our marriage. His point? ...I'm paraphrasing here...

How DARE Petraeus devote time, energy, assets, and access of himself or his staff to Paula Broadwell in theatre while soldiers were dying and he was responsible for writing letters home to wives and parents for those who were killed. How dare he. Over a book about what a great, strong leader...possibly future President of the United States...his dedication, high level of integrity, single minded in his drive to perfection...that was nothing more than a myth.

He had F-15s, forces, technology that is out of this world at his fingertips and he got his ass handed to him in Afghanistan by goat herders. Goat Herders. How dare he carry on an extramarital affair with this floozy while young men were dying.

It dawned on me about P4. THIS.

Ann Althouse said...

"I know it's terrible but I'm confused by how/why Holly Petraeus has persisted in her extreme dowdiness. I've spent quite a lot of time around officers' wives and 95% of them are very careful about appearances and being put together. Cute haircuts with expensive color work, manis and pedis and immaculate makeup, stylish outfits with nice shoes and well-chosen accessories, and perhaps most importantly lots of time at the gym. Mrs. P must have stuck out like a sore thumb at these parties with her grandma hair and extra sixty pounds."

Reminds me of Barbara Bush. But I'm not sure what it means. Possibly very high self-esteem.

Remember Holly was the big general's daughter when Petraeus was a West Point guy deciding to marry her. She had something of an upper hand.

By the way, Holly is short for Hollister.

Another thing I notice is that Holly is short next to Petraeus, but those other women are tall. The other women may be more attractive than Holly -- in the conventional style of these Kardashian days -- but they are also quite masculine (if you overlook the sizable breasts).

All of this simply raises questions about Petraeus, who defines himself as he chooses and relates to women.

David said...

madAsHell said...
Plus beyond the big tits, big eyes and big hair, they are not all that good looking.

Beyond!?!?!


Ok, we know your standards, MAH. I imagine you are stuck with them.

Bob said...

I would be most interested in AA's analysis of this picture of Jill, her hubby, and Mrs. P. (Also, looks like Jill's twin sis in the background).

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/ap-source-target-emails-petraeus-paramour-state-department-military-liaison-article-1.1200299


In particular, and in juxtaposition with the attire of the others, what is it that Jill is wearing here?

Erika said...

I was not thinking about how it's Mrs. P's fault for being unsexy. I was actually feeling sorry for her because she exists in a social world that prizes outward appearances and that I'm surprised that she didn't put more effort in, because it's expected in those circles. That has to have been awkward for her.

Ann Althouse said...

"Plus beyond the big tits, big eyes and big hair, they are not all that good looking."

Reminds me of the way Bill Clinton found Paula Jones inviting.

It may be specifically these signals of seeming availability on a less-than-naturally-pretty woman that makes the man feel that he will be accepted.

TosaGuy said...

"Since election day:

Pfc. Brandon L. Buttry, 19
Spc. Daniel L. Carlson, 21
Staff Sgt. Kenneth W. Bennett, 26
Capt. James D. Nehl, 37
Sgt. Matthew H. Stiltz, 26"

and

"Meanwhile, Israel mounts major attack on Hamas as CIA is distracted and leaderless."

Those who voted for Obama are not interested in these items for a variety of reasons.....although they held extreme interest in the first before January 2009.

Roger J. said...

Rabel--thank you for keeping your eye on the ball--no decent commander ever wants to loose a trooper--we take it very hard. Thank you for memorializing these valiant troopers.

Ann Althouse said...

"I was not thinking about how it's Mrs. P's fault for being unsexy. I was actually feeling sorry for her because she exists in a social world that prizes outward appearances and that I'm surprised that she didn't put more effort in, because it's expected in those circles. That has to have been awkward for her."

I say not necessarily. Read about her upbringing and her independent success in her career. I think it's quite possible that she feels superior to them.

It would be so easy to get a good haircut, color her hair, and put in contact lenses. She declines. That's her statement. Knowing what I know about her I would not assume she is making that statement from a lack of self esteem.

Erika said...

Or maybe as Althouse suggests she accepts her unglamorous self as she is and assumed her husband had enough character to see through the shallow women he encountered throughout his career.

Chip S. said...

Maybe she likes 3-somes.

The Drill SGT said...

The women couldn't have made any progress in the role of "social liaison" if the generals didn't want to be liaised.

My experience has been that MRS Colonel (or General) led the way in social Liaison. I was in fact the Liaison (but not social) between our HQ and a German partner Bde (35th Panzer). Beynd a joint dinner for the officers and wives of both units (wurst and kraut) served on wood plates cut by the German Engr Platoon, it was pretty much being a road warrior carrying plans between the two field locations...

In the old Army, the General's wife was in charge of all things military social within 50 miles of the flagpole. Just as we had our staff officers, Mrs General had a circle of 5-6 Colonels wives to coordinate activities. We had uniforms, they had uniforms.

The Class A uniform was a sleeveless black dress with a single strand of pearls, and pearl earrings :)

chickelit said...

Do identical twins tilt their head sideways the same way at the same time? Because that photograph is driving me nuts.

Spooky action-at-a-distance head cocking!

Ann Althouse said...

"I would be most interested in AA's analysis of this picture of Jill, her hubby, and Mrs. P. (Also, looks like Jill's twin sis in the background). http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/ap-source-target-emails-petraeus-paramour-state-department-military-liaison-article-1.1200299 In particular, and in juxtaposition with the attire of the others, what is it that Jill is wearing here?"

Based on what the others are wearing, I'd say the dress code that day was: casual. Jill Kelley is wearing something that looks like what we used to call baby-doll pajamas, though baby-doll pajamas had little matching puffy panties underneath. I don't know what Kelley's got on underneath, but it's impossible for whatever it is not to show, so it's quite perplexing.

Anyway, it's a horrible minidress that makes her look fat. She doesn't seem shy about displaying her arms, which are distinctly chubby.

I find it odd that she's successful in the social liaison game if she dresses like that. It's too in-your-face sexy without any compensating flattery.

If that's working on the generals, then... time to get generals with better judgment.

Carol said...

but they are also quite masculine (if you overlook the sizable breasts).

Broadwell's arms are de trop but I guess I'm out of step on that. Do her veins stick out too?

Roger J. said...

Drill--as usual you are correct
Alas, apparently that day has come and gone.

Inga said...

"I know it's terrible but I'm confused by how/why Holly Petraeus has persisted in her extreme dowdiness."

"I saw of photo of the couple when he graduated from West Point. They were Mr. & Mrs. Nerd. There's no glamour potential there."

11/14/12 11:37 AM

I disagree, Mrs.Petraeus was quite pretty in a fresh clean way when she was young and slender. But age demands more attention to weight and skin and hair, she alas, didn't keep up and I think Althouse is right. I think she was very secure in her own person. Good for her and bad for her. I feel terrible for her and their children, what an embarrassment, though not her fault.

Levi Starks said...

"not a position" ? Nonsense, a quick google search list's over a hundred of them.

Inga said...

The twins are not extraordinarily pretty, I agree, thick waisted. They seem to have developed a hobby, collecting powerful men and playing with them.

EMD said...

In the immortal words of the Joker:

"This town needs an enema!"

Surfed said...

Attack of the Manjaws!
http://heartiste.wordpress.com/2010/04/08/attack-of-the-manjaws/

SomeoneHasToSayIt said...

As long as they don't have thin lips or toe thumbs (yup, Megan Fox, it's a deal-breaker), I, and most men, if they are honest, could talk myself into hitting it, perhaps with just a bit of beer goggles.

Them's the facts, ladies, no matter how much 'civilization' veneer you put on it.

Were it not for your near irresistible lady parts, you'd be in line behind the weaker males, who could still best the best of you.

Hagar said...

Catfight!

And Professor, I am disappointed in you. Paula Broadwell is clearly guilty of speaking out of turn about highly classified matters, but the Khawam sisters are not (so far) guilty of anything more than unexpectedly finding themselves within the field of fire.
Being a military "groupie" is not yet a crime.

miss j said...

"What about the generals? ...What the hell are these men doing appropriating the power and prestige of the United States military... These are the men who send enlistees into battle, who demand sacrifice from idealistic young Americans. They should not be flaunting whatever pleasures they pursue."

THIS.

McTriumph said...

Jypsea Rose
With all due respect, tell your Jedi knight to cool his jets. The woman's book was originally to be about the war, but morphed in to a biography through her manipulations. I don't know if she was qualified to write a war history or biography, but she was educated at the Academy and Harvard.
All this hand ringing over general officers' perks, how about officers' perks in general over enlisted men and women?


Chip S. said...

You say "The twins are masculine; thick-waisted."

I say, they're secure in their superior blowjob skills.

garage mahal said...

Some of us like curvy women. I hate hate hate skinny chicks.

john said...

And what the hell is with you Erika? Ann?

Complaining that Holly Petreaus is unsexy, dowdy, 60 pounds overweight?

And what her looks say about her husband?

And that you are sorry for her?

You two really have your claws out. What a bunch of catty, slutty comments.

SomeoneHasToSayIt said...

Chip S. said...

I say, they're secure in their superior blowjob skills.


Yes. Exactly my point.

Crunchy Frog said...

Meanwhile, Israel mounts major attack on Hamas as CIA is distracted and leaderless.

That's a feature, not a bug. I've always wondered at what lengths the Israelis would go to if we weren't constantly on their backs to play nice to the Palis. Nothing like a good old fashioned sex scandal to provide a handy distraction.

In fact it wouldn't surprise me if we eventually found out the twins were working for Israel.

Renee said...

"It would be so easy to get a good haircut, color her hair, and put in contact lenses."

My mother in her early 60s, does none of these either. It doesn't bother her, no offense ladies, but it doesn't make you look younger. It just makes you look like you had a good hair cut, colored your hair, and have contacts. Same thing with Botox, you don't look better, you just look like you had Botox.

I'm in my 30s and I don't color my hair or wear contact lenses or have a hair cut that needs to be styled. I don't look older, I just look my age.

I'm also short, so I'm defensive as well.

Scott M said...

" The made-up title appears to be a polite way of saying “rich Tampa socialite who likes to hang with four-star generals.”

I thought of some other things it would be a polite way of saying, but I won't mention them. I'll just suggest that the officer is only portraying the women in a negative light. What about the generals?


Their title is "general".

These are the men who send enlistees into battle, who demand sacrifice from idealistic young Americans.

Who, probably to a man, would enjoy being liased and laud the Old Man for getting his.

Scott said...

What Petraeus needs to do to get his reputation back is to start hosting the annual Muscular Dystrophy Telethon.

Craig said...

My third cousin lives in Tampa. Our common ancestors are my immigrant great great grandfather from Wisconsin who died in the Civil War and his widow. She's descended from my great grandfather's older brother by way of the 1st Congregational Church in Kenosha, Wisconsin and a Missouri Synod bakery in Findlay, Ohio. Her people settled in Tampa after the Spanish-American War and before WWI.

Renee said...

Holly's Engagement photo from 1974.

Tank said...

beer goggles

Said someone.

Duh.

McTriumph said...

Ann
You can't compare Petraeus to Clinton, Clinton is a predator. Predators don't give a shit whether the woman says no, they just keep moving on till they find one that says yes. Petraeus is a sheep caught in a weak moment by a ambitious manipulator.

Scott said...

What every Petraeus babe needs.

Kansas City said...

I made a comment along these lines in a prior post. Doesn't this story demonstrate weaknesses typically associated with gender?

Men using their power to advance their sexual desires or at least their desire to be around younger more attractive women who flatter them?

Women using their bodies and feminine wiles [sp?] for advancement and becoming upset over stupid, minor things - such as Broadwell's obsession with Kelley's flirtatious behavior and Kelley's apparent interest in being around powerful military men.

It also seems that if these modestly attractive 40ish women are the best that very powerful military men can score with, the pool of available women must be relatively small (Broadwell does seem smart, while Kelley seems like an airhead - calling 911 to claim "diplomatic invioliability" in response to some trespassing by the media.

chickelit said...

garage mahal said...
Some of us like curvy women. I hate hate hate skinny chicks.

What a waist of hatred.

Chip S. said...

chicklit, garage is simply adapting his preferences to his feasible choice set.

Ruth Anne Adams said...

My identical twin daughters are mirrors of each other...one is a lefty, the other a rightie.

So NO! Identical twins do not all tilt their heads sideways the same way at the same time.

~~~

Back in my day, when I was an Army Officer and an Army Officer's wife, I took a course on how to be a Company Commander's wife, taught by the Brigade Commander's wife and some of the senior staff wives.

Military spouse is an unpaid position [the joke is 'if the Army wanted you to have a wife, they would have issued you a wife'] but it is recognized and exploited. The wives want their men to succeed when in command and the Army would love to have all that free labor. There even used to be a place on the official fitness evaluations for family and spousal involvement.

And this was during peace-time. I cannot imagine how strong the spousely cosa nostra has become since then.

Clyde said...

If generals played guitars, then women like Kelley would be called "groupies."

I Callahan said...

Some of us like curvy women. I hate hate hate skinny chicks.

THIS TIMES 10!!

We may not agree on much, garage, but we're brothers in arms on this.

garage mahal said...

chicklit, garage is simply adapting his preferences to his feasible choice set.

Curvy big breasted women are my choice set.

deborah said...

When asked why she didn't color her hair, Mrs. Bush replied, 'because George never asked me to.'

But let's try another angle on this story. Back in the day when Obama went with the COIN strategy in Afghanistan, it was speculated by some that he was strong-armed by the military into that decision. Is this a way to clean house and get a more compliant military brass?

Chip S. said...

Curvy big breasted women are my choice set.

What I said.

Emphasis on "feasible".

BarrySanders20 said...

"Some of us like curvy women. I hate hate hate skinny chicks"

Reminds me of a story from college. Dale invariably hooked up with a heavy girl after parties. One morning, we asked him:

"Dale, why do you like the heavy girls?

Dale replied:

"It's not so much that I like heavy girls. It's more that the heavy girls like me."

Garage, fit women can still have curves.

Trashhauler said...

It used to be that a senior officer's wife was an official partner in his career. She not only served as hostess at the many, many official and semi-official functions, she was also expected to assist in running the officer's wives organizations, from the wives' club, to the thrift shop, child care, and family casualty assistance. She also helped the junior wives adjust to the demands of military life.

All that has slowly eroded away as wives stuck to building their own careers. It is no wonder that senior commanders will allow a rich volunteer serve as hostess at some events. Better than putting an additional burden on your CINC-house.

It doesn't mean they are actually cheating with such women. Most of the formal entertaining is the dry as dust, can't wait to leave sort of thing. Everyone is very careful in public. The time when military parties were fun is long past.

garage mahal said...

Emphasis on "feasible"

You're confused about the meaning of the word "feasible".

Eclecticity said...

What bugs me, if the "alleged" "20,000 to 30,000" email pages that Allen sent to said socialite, while he was in a very very senior position in our military is true, how in the F&*K is that possible? When did he do his job. I'd love to know what time of day and/or night both the Four-Stars were sending emails to their lady friends. How about a FOIA Request to let the public see what these high level military brass were doing on our time and our dime. Let's go. E.

McTriumph said...

Ruth Ann Adams
You are right. Most civilians and non-career military don't understand the military culture.
I grew up on military bases. We were taught that everything you did reflects on your father and family. You always left the house in a presentable fashion. You were polite and always respected the hierarchies.
Somehow everyone seems to think it's wrong that generals hang out with "high society". University presidents don't? Corporate leaders don't? Union leaders don't? The President of the US doesn't?

Chip S. said...

You're confused about the meaning of the word "feasible".

Whatever, dude.

chickelit said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Oso Negro said...

Rank and skank.

Oso Negro said...

Rank and skank.

Hagar said...

The 2-30,000 pages of e-mails are also referred to as "a couple of hundred" e-mails. Over a 2-year or so period, that is not much.

Nomennovum said...

"There were plenty of beautiful, discreet women in Washington would would have dallied with Bill Clinton and never breathed a word of it--at least not while he was still President."

Ah, that qualifier at the end of the sentence saved you from being labled a naive schmuck.

There are no discreet women. At least not in the country, though I doubt anywhere.

traditionalguy said...

The social expert in an area is usually the woman who knows everybody and is liked by everybody, except a few others running another circle of socially connected important people.

Getting introduced around to the right people and warned about the wrong people's tricks is a great service that theses ladies render to new comers who are outsiders starting at the top jobs in a new area.

It is politics with a feminine touch. What is to hate about that?

traditionalguy said...

The social expert in an area is usually the woman who knows everybody and is liked by everybody, except a few others running another circle of socially connected important people.

Getting introduced around to the right people and warned about the wrong people's tricks is a great service that theses ladies render to new comers who are outsiders starting at the top jobs in a new area.

It is politics with a feminine touch. What is to hate about that?

Cedarford said...

Jpsea Rose -

How DARE Petraeus devote time, energy, assets, and access of himself or his staff to Paula Broadwell in theatre while soldiers were dying and he was responsible for writing letters home to wives and parents for those who were killed. How dare he.

Yeah, yeah, we have all heard it before:

How dare George Bush go to Crawford on vacation while HERO TROOPS are dying!
How DARE Pelosi go on vacations too.
How dare Fobbits have money spent on base R&R facilities when they should be soldiers 24/7/365 - and only eating, sleeping, and shitting out of necessity. And hopefully discussing their war winning job performances over meals and cleaning their rifles while shitting.
And Obama - with the golf and celebs - how DARE he!
How DARE Boehner smoke while HEROES are dying!
How dare Generals recreate when off duty? They should all be in monastic cells wearing hair shirts and suffering like the Front Line Heroes are!
And how DARE any of us ordinary proles try enjoying life in the dismal Bush-Obama economy when HEROES are in harms way trying to give freedom to Noble Muslim Democracy-hungry Freedom-Lovers!!

You hear that strident phony outrage from both extremes.

acm said...

I hate that Holly Petraeus is being criticized for her "grandma hair". Isn't she, in fact, a grandma? The general looks like a grandpa, and like a damned fool hanging around a 37-year-old who dresses as though she's at least 15 years younger and four degrees hotter than she actually is.

Maybe Mrs. Petraeus likes being in her sixties, likes her body type and likes being a grandma and doesn't feel like she needs to present herself as anything she's not? Shocking, I know...

Darrell said...

This never happened when they used salt peter in hot dogs and baloney.

Kirk Parker said...

Garage, chicklit: curvy is good, but it does need to include curving in at the waist, doesn't it?

Kirk Parker said...

"Somehow everyone seems to think it's wrong that generals hang out with 'high society'."

No, the question is how do this skanky individuals get themselves into the position of being considered 'high society'?

Sam L. said...

The one on the left looks a tad more tilted, to me.

edutcher said...

I think in the old pre-Pearl Harbor Regular Army (and Navy), the social liaison was General (or Colonel) So-and-so's extoverted wife who had a socially prominent family.

the wife of one of Armstrong Custer's troop commanders, Annie Yates, organized the picnics and stuff for the 7th Cavalry.

Cato Renasci said...

I think this was clearly a honey trap intended to compromise senior military officers - on whose behalf is unclear - and I think that Broadwell actually had Petraeus' best interests in mind when her instincts told her the Khawama girls were big time trouble.

I agree with the trap part. One of the Lefties' wet dreams since 'Nam is to cut the Army to 8 divisions and the Marines (listen for the scream) to 2 (yes, I know about the Public Law) and all this negative hype would help immensely.

As I say, it also is to discredit anything Petraeus says that could be damaging to Choom and Co.

edutcher said...

PS Also agree with garage wrt curves.

(toldja he was a mensch)

But Kirk is right about the waist.

Hourglass is perfection incarnate.

Darrell said...

Send me all the skinny women--particularly those who are tall. We will form our own Nation, free from the slings and arrows of those who are always saying negative things about them. They are God's gift to mankind. When they want a ham sandwich, they eat one--if they are hungry. Small breasts are a feauture, not a bug. Sleek, elegant--like a supersonic jet or an Italian sports car. The only sad thing in life is that some men chase them and marry them when they don't appreciate them. Breast implants are like 500 pounds of Bondo slapped on the side of a Ferrari. A crime against God and aesthetics.

chickelit said...

You misread my unstated preference garage. I merely wanted to point out that your "hate hate hate skinny" was walkering over a line in my book. Why not love all types?

Jypsea Rose said...

How dare George Bush go to Crawford on vacation while HERO TROOPS are dying!
How DARE Pelosi go on vacations too.
How dare Fobbits have money spent on base R&R facilities when they should be soldiers 24/7/365 - and only eating, sleeping, and shitting out of necessity. And hopefully discussing their war winning job performances over meals and cleaning their rifles while shitting.
And Obama - with the golf and celebs - how DARE he!
How DARE Boehner smoke while HEROES are dying!
How dare Generals recreate when off duty? They should all be in monastic cells wearing hair shirts and suffering like the Front Line Heroes are!
And how DARE any of us ordinary proles try enjoying life in the dismal Bush-Obama economy when HEROES are in harms way trying to give freedom to Noble Muslim Democracy-hungry Freedom-Lovers!!

You hear that strident phony outrage from both extremes.




Wow. Just wow. I have no words. There is a world of difference between the examples you've listed and the top officer...IN THEATRE...personally rsponsible for combat operations of the war diverting his attention for sex under a desk.

If you can't see that, well, we'll just agree to disagree. Perhaps all the "strident phony outrage" has desensitized you.

Sam L. said...

Roger, no base at Fargo. Grand Forks and Minot, yes.

Why not Minot? Freezin's the reason!

Don't know any similar saying for
El Forko Grande.

Erika said...

Geez louise guys, calm down, I think, good on Mrs. P to not try to look 35 when she's in her 60s and to have more to offer the world than looking pretty next to a chest full of ribbons. I'm just pointing out that she doesn't fit the visual mold of what the wives of the brass often look like; and I wonder if she was actually friends with these clowns like her husband seems to have been.

Erika said...

*by clowns I mean the quote unquote social liason dopes

Jypsea Rose said...

Cont.

While she was writing an indepth biography highlighting what a brilliant, strong, military leader, all full of integrity...that certainly would have been used should he had pursued a presidential run.

Sure, sure...downtime. But Petraeus was rewarded handsomely as a 4 star when he was running the war. Not an ice cream stand, the war, with a huge portion of that pay being tax-exempted for being in a combat zone.

While he was getting his ass kicked by goat herders...

But yeah...exactly the same thing as Obama and celebs. Can hardly tell the difference.

edutcher said...

PPS Agree with Darrel on implants/

PPPS Put Centcom HQ in theater. Helmand Province would be best.

(did MacArthur command the SWPA from Sunset Boulevard?)

EMD said...

Social liaison = Fuck Buddy.

30yearProf said...

In my almost 30 years connected with the US military, this sort of community "liaison" occurs everywhere.

BUT it seldom results in adultery. I know that officers are disciplined for indiscreet adultery because I co-represented a Colonel charged with it.

In many respects the services encourage socializing because they do not want community "leaders" to see the base as an armed camp of sex-starved 18-25 year-olds (which it is) ready to prey on their daughters (and now sons). Base commanders can extend Officer's Club privileges to Mayors and other big shots. In some localities that is a highly prized treat. Officer's Wives clubs coordinate charity events with the Junior League, etc. It is officially desirable that the base be seen as part of the community not a parasite.

In the long run, reducing the natural isolation of military members and their families from the nearby civilian population is a good thing. Notwithstanding this unfortunate incident, it should continue to be encouraged.

Methadras said...

The head tilt thing is so weird. I know why they do it, it's a reflex action to thinking they are trying to get their head into the frame of the photo when they don't need to and instead they come off looking like those weird real estate agent photos. By the way, which one is the nut?

EMD said...

With apologies to Falco:

Er war Vier Star
Er war populär
Er war so exaltiert
Because er hatte Schwall
Er war ein Virtuose
War ein KreigIdol
Und alles rief:
Come on and rock me Dave Petraeus

Dave Petraeus Dave Petraeus, Dave Petraeus
Dave Petraeus Dave Petraeus, Dave Petraeus
Dave Petraeus Dave Petraeus, oh oh oh Dave Petraeus!

Come and rock me Dave Petraeus...


Sorry I didn't have time to translate it from Austrian to English.

john said...

Methadras -

The nut is the one with the tittie beads.

Coketown said...

I am SO MAD Althouse didn't ask "How to you get into the position of 'social liaison' in the US military."

Because the obvious answer is: on your back with your legs flung behind you head.

But without the important "into," it just doesn't work.

Shouting Thomas said...

Because the obvious answer is: on your back with your legs flung behind you head.

Those ladies look a little old and fat to comfortably assume that position, Coketown.

But I think you are speaking (or writing) metaphorically. Metaphorically, I probably agree with you.

Apparently the standards for beauty are somewhat low in the "socialite" end of the business. You'd think those generals could do better!

Blair said...

So what he's sayint is that, if it is an official position, it's only one in the same sense as "cowgirl", "doggy" and "missionary"...?

Freeman Hunt said...

Obama needs a Firing Wand. Whoever he taps on the head with it is fired. That way he can do a lot of firing in a short amount of time. Take the wand and go clean out these government enclave cathouse circuses.

Freeman Hunt said...

This whole thing is so disgraceful and pathetic.

Even the FBI agent was sending shirtless photos--what is wrong with these bureaucrats? Rein it in, wonks.

John said...

For the neanderthals on both sides of the gender line... It is the brain that makes women sexy. Without that they are merely objects.

Hagar said...

Freeman,
Sigh,
The FBI agent was a friend to whom she mentioned the stalking e-mails, and the photos were sent sometime before this thing started. Nothing more being specified, they may also have been of him at the beach in swimming trunks, or of him barbequing hamburgers with his family in the backyard.

This hubbub in the media is a lot of innuendo and fudging timelines!

Scott M said...

Without that they are merely objects.

Objects can be sexy. I give you Megan Fox.

Patrick said...

Because that photograph is driving me nuts.

The General (who looks terrible in a casual sweat suit) looks like he has an earring in his right ear.

Coketown said...

Apparently the standards for beauty are somewhat low in the "socialite" end of the business. You'd think those generals could do better!

I think they've all seen enough spy movies to know that buxom, bombshell femmes fatale (is that the correct plural?) always lead to trouble.

Stick with AKC-registered flousies. They know they're lucky to be smoking a four-star pole and probably won't tell anyone. It only comes out in the open when other bitches in heat start snooping and become jealous.

Coketown said...

That last comment makes me regret my decision not to pursue a career as a poet.

bandmeeting said...

It would be so easy to get a good haircut, color her hair, and put in contact lenses.

I'll not argue with you about the hair color or contact lenses but, "good haircut"? I think that is something that should be required--it's not vanity. You might as well add "take a bath" to your list.

terry josiah said...

How do you get the "position" as "social liason"?
Knee pads and knee pads and elbow pads.

terry josiah said...

How do you get the "position" as "social liason"?
Knee pads, more knee pads and elbow pads.

James Pawlak said...

IT IS A "POSITION"; Usually on the back with legs spread.

deborah said...

"One of the Lefties' wet dreams since 'Nam is to cut the Army to 8 divisions and the Marines (listen for the scream) to 2 (yes, I know about the Public Law) and all this negative hype would help immensely."


With the sequestration negotiations coming up, this sort of thing was already on the table, but re the AirSea Battle/Pivot to Asia, it's convenient that Patreaus and Allen are Army and Marines.

chickelit said...

With the sequestration negotiations coming up, this sort of thing was already on the table, but re the AirSea Battle/Pivot to Asia, it's convenient that Patreaus and Allen are Army and Marines.

I wonder if he thinks he can cut ROTC scholarships and the like too. You ought to see the junior ROTC cadets at my son's HS--half female and mostly hispanic.

deborah said...

Don't know, chick, but I expect we'll still need officers regardless of military make-up. I don't think there's going to be the tremendous decrease Ed mentions, but definite streamlining. And if ROTC is especially attractive to Latinos, it will factor in.

kcom said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
kcom said...

Two women in Petraeus sex scandal lose security clearance

Here's an article from CBS. I guess we're supposed to just ignore the factual inaccuracy in the headline, what with all those layers of editors and fact checkers. Reading the story, you'll see that Paula Broadwell had an actual security clearance that was revoked. Jill Kelley didn't and so it wasn't. She had a base pass for MacDill AFB that allowed her on the base without signing in at the visitors' center (which has been temporarily suspended). Hardly the same thing.

Oh, and check out this purple prose from the story:

Petraeus, and other top military brass, have been guests of the couples own lavish parties hosted at their own Tampa home.

Threatened by news van camped outside her stately home since the scandal broke, she tried to use her credentials to get diplomatic protection. In a phone call to 911, she complained that media had descended on her two-story, five-bedroom brick home overlooking Tampa Bay, which was purchased in 2004 for $1.5 million.


I doubt you'll find her including those details in the 911 transcript. What's with the breathlessness from CBS about her house? How many times are they going to beat that horse in two paragraphs?

Beau said...

Poor Holly, having to hang out with women who appear so very different from her...and with weird necks to boot.

What is it that makes women hold their heads like this when being photographed. it makes them look quite crazy.

Rockport Conservative said...

I am an identical twin. I just checked. We had a group picture with our other sisters today, and as far as I can tell in none of them are we tilted in the same way. We are more apt to be tilted towards one another, if there is a tilt. It is on Facebook but I don't think I will send the link here.

Rockport Conservative said...

I am an identical twin. I just checked. We had a group picture with our other sisters today, and as far as I can tell in none of them are we tilted in the same way. We are more apt to be tilted towards one another, if there is a tilt. It is on Facebook but I don't think I will send the link here.

chuck said...

But what are they pretenders to?

Pamela Harriman?

Titus said...

LOVE the photo.

tits.

The Drill SGT said...

kcom said...
Two women in Petraeus sex scandal lose security clearance

Here's an article from CBS. I guess we're supposed to just ignore the factual inaccuracy in the headline, what with all those layers of editors and fact checkers. Reading the story, you'll see that Paula Broadwell had an actual security clearance that was revoked.


I think that Major Broadwell, MI USAR, had her clearance revoked/suspended pending an investigation of a security lapse (doc uments, not sex). Ms Paula Broadwell isn't guilty of anything yet.

However, the FBI will need to charge her with something to justify its peeping tom act. I submit it will be, "making a fase statement to a Federal officer", (18 U.S.C. § 1001)

Beau said...

LOVE the photo.

tits.


Watch that space....shirtless incoming.

Michael said...

Holly appears to me as a lady who has jumped the fence.

Michael said...

Holly appears to me as a lady who has jumped the fence.

MrCharlie2 said...

the Monica twins

Mary Beth said...

Craig said...

My third cousin lives in Tampa. Our common ancestors are my immigrant great great grandfather from Wisconsin who died in the Civil War and his widow. She's descended from my great grandfather's older brother by way of the 1st Congregational Church in Kenosha, Wisconsin and a Missouri Synod bakery in Findlay, Ohio. Her people settled in Tampa after the Spanish-American War and before WWI.


So, this is a comment to encourage friendship...I hope this comment was a reference to that letter. If not, I'm sorry I laughed.

gadfly said...

Do identical twins tilt their head sideways the same way at the same time? Because that photograph is driving me nuts.

As an identical twin, I can tell you that more than external appearance happens when you share the same egg. That is why I am not surprised that both Natalie and Jill are in deep financial problems and why both appear to be (as a minimum) flirts and flakes. If Natalie is "unstable" - I would bet that Jill is also.

JAL said...

"socialite" = bimbo but the MSM can't use that word.

(But somebody above probably already mentioned that.)

JAL said...

@ Ruth Anne and others -- When my family member was in Iraq first time around (before and during the surge) -- he was company commander and his wife *was* responsible for keeping the other wives informed and keeping touch with them.

So yes it is still part of the culture and expectation.

Dante said...

The women couldn't have made any progress in the role of "social liaison" if the generals didn't want to be liaised.

Men are all dogs, don't you know. Yes, the system is asymmetrical. There are simple biological reasons why.

In the animal kingdom, the guy expends tremendous energy trying to get laid. The chicks are all coy. Sometimes they select their mates as the strongest, which often means the biggest horns, fights that lead to death, etc.

Once they finally give in, it's great for the guys. A few minutes of pumping, and they have transmitted their genes. The chicks, with very few exceptions, take on the role of gestating and raising the brats. It's a massive undertaking, requiring massive KCals of energy. But they do it, and dote on their offspring. The guys mostly are nowhere to be found.

Now, you got humans, they have a brain. But the guys still have this amazingly strong desire to impregnate. It's natural, because if that impulse weren't so strong, why risk a big fight to the death.

So they see a long legged beauty, and right away, there is this thought. Or heck, the damn thing walks and talks.

So the humans came up with this idea, called marriage. And it goes like this. You have to compromise. All this fighting and stuff isn't good. Each guy gets a gal, and each gal gets a guy. The gals worry the guy is going to leave her, and the guy worries he is going to end up supporting some other guy's kid.

It's hard, because the guys still want to boff everything with two legs, but they deal with it as they can. And the chicks, they still want the all powerful dude, but don't want to risk the support. That's what marriage is about: setting up the foundation for kids and the next generation.

Now, government has a role here too. An arrogated, disgusting role, but that's a discussion for another day.

DEEBEE said...

Started seeing 24 on Netflix recently. Stopped at the 4th season since it was too much to keep seeing corrupt A**holes at every level of the Govt.
Started seeing it since IMO it is preferable to have corrupt, self-aware, individual than clueless ones as Betrayus shows.

Tarzan said...

Those girls are both very tall an are probably in the habit of tilting their heads a bit in an attempt to down it down and get their eyes on everyone else's level.

Cut them some slack for f***'s sake.