September 27, 2012

More debate — at the University of Wisconsin — about affirmative action.

You might remember last September, there was a huge crowd for a debate about affirmative action...
As Meade and I walked home, I called the students "admirable" for not getting out of hand and shouting down the speakers, and Meade made fun of my low standard. I said, "It's Wisconsin. Kudos for not rioting."
Earlier in the day, there was an outbreak of something that either was or was not violence, and students — mostly undergrad, not law students — were passionate but reasonably controlled at the debate later on. (Here's video I shot and edited.)

Tonight's debate, focusing on the pending Supreme Court case Texas v. Fisher, should be a more modest event — at the law school at 6:15. My colleague Larry Church will once again take the pro side on affirmative action, but he's got a different sparring partner, lawprof Rick Esenberg. Last year, the anti-affirmative action side was taken by Roger Clegg, president of the Center for Equal Opportunity, which was mounting an attack on the admissions policies at the University of Wisconsin. Fisher is about undergraduate admissions at the University of Texas.



88 comments:

Shouting Thomas said...

This debate is about racial and sexual quota systems, not affirmative actions.

The term "affirmative action" is in itself a distortion.

There is no "affirmative action," but we are larded down with quota systems.

How can you have an honest debate when you start out with a lie?

Bob Ellison said...

I hope they stream the debate live. That might be technically difficult. They could just record it and put it online. I'd watch the whole thing.

Shouting Thomas said...

I know we're talking about academia, but this is the place where all the lying starts.

I've read various calculations about the costs of the racial and sexual quotas systems. I've encountered it repeatedly in my career. Thankfully, that career is almost over, and I'm just about free of that madness.

I'm going to state the obvious:

The racial and sexual quota system is one of the biggest reasons for the collapse of our economy. The costs and inefficiencies we've imposed on our economy are astronomical. Our international competitors do not impose these costs on themselves.

If you want to see the economy revive, the first corrective I'd suggest is... let businesses hire as they please without the Fed and states trying to force them to hire on a racial and sexual quota system.

Would you hire if somebody else was telling you who to hire?

Richard Dolan said...

Isn't the red face in that poster just a bit, you know, suggestive given the topic? You can imagine what Axelrod (or better yet, Fauxcahontas) would do to anyone taking the anti side if that's how it's advertised.

Inquiring minds want to know: where is the Green Man when he is most needed?

Richard Dolan said...

Isn't the red face in that poster just a bit, you know, suggestive given the topic? You can imagine what Axelrod (or better yet, Fauxcahontas) would do to anyone taking the anti side if that's how it's advertised.

Inquiring minds want to know: where is the Green Man when he is most needed?

Tyrone Slothrop said...

I was a little boy during the Civil Rights era. My tolerant parents raised me to be glad when blacks finally obtained the rights that belonged to them. Silly me, in those days I believed equality meant that no race would ever have legal advantages over another ever again. Real fairness required color blindness. Who could ever have foreseen the twisted perversion of racial equality we are forced to live with now?

Sorun said...

The graphic has two Caucasian males with face paint and hair dye. Strange.

Sorun said...

Diversity is important at UW-Madison.

Shouting Thomas said...

Time to go for a bicycle ride.

I've been working as a contractor for the past 7 years. The reason companies don't hire me full time is because of the racial and sexual quota system.

EEOC bean counters look at the racial and sexual composition of every corporation. Those corps face fines and lawsuits (and bad publicity) if they don't satisfy the bean counters' mandates.

I'm white, hetero and male. If I'm hired full-time, I'm a black mark on the balance sheet. So, I'm hired as a contractor, and I don't appear on the balance sheet at all.

White, hetero men are about 90% of the potential hires in my field. Companies need my skills, but they can't hire me.

In the ultimate slap in the face, Indian H1B visa candidates are preferable to me. They actually count as a positive to the EEOC bean counters!

The racial and sexual quota system doesn't just fuck me over for being white hetero and male. It fucks me over for being a U.S. citizen!

This may seem to be tangential to the academic quota systems, but it is not. It is at the academic level that this shit is justified and codified.

Chuck66 said...

I recall a grad school discussion....a classmate of mine, very nice guy, said he got 50% of his undegrad tuition (at a higher piced private school) for free because he was born in Mexico. His family is fairly comfortable as his dad is a physician assistant (or something like that).

As a Scandanavian-American, my parents and I had to come up with all the money for my state school tuition. Fortunatly the school didn't force me to ride in the back of the bus though.

Joseph said...

A Vulcan medical officer facing a Vulcan security or engineering officer... Hmmm.

Interesting poster.

Chuck66 said...

Shouting Thomas...you should see the quota system and increased costs for large gov't projects. The light rail project in St Paul, and the now deal Kenosha-Milwaukee commuter rail project.

Not only do they pay millions more to higher or buy things from minority or female owned businesses, but they hire a staff to make sure they are doing that. Your tax dollars at work.

Fen said...

It asserts that its use of a holistic admissions process, considering race as one factor for admission, creates a diverse student body that benefits the entire university.

1) Considering race as a factor = racism. You are discriminating on the basis of race.

2) Subjective argument that "a diverse student body benefits anything". Cannot be quantified. Is bunk.

3) Even if #2 were true, there are other ways to create "diversity" without violating the rights of apllicants.

Fen said...

Two white men are going to have a debate about diversity...

Sorun said...

It seems the job of affirmative action debater can't be entrusted to anyone other than white males. Unlike all of the other jobs on the planet.

purplepenquin said...

I said, "It's Wisconsin. Kudos for not rioting."

Just to clarify, when was the last time there were people rioting in Wisconsin?

~~~~~

The reason companies don't hire me full time is because of the racial and sexual quota system.

Must be that. After all your online persona has shown you to be such a nice and knowledgeable fella, so I don't know why anyone wouldn't want to hire you.

*rolls eyes*

Shouting Thomas said...

Must be that. After all your online persona has shown you to be such a nice and knowledgeable fella, so I don't know why anyone wouldn't want to hire you.

You stupid fuck. I have my choice of jobs.

Right now, I'm trying to take time off, and my phone is ringing off with hook with recruiters and job offers.

You are a stupid, vicious fuck.

Curious George said...

I just pray that no black female students are disrespected.

Shouting Thomas said...

You'll notice that this vicious penguin idiot has also internalized the left's other argument...

White men shouldn't even get pissed off at being fucked over!

Yeah, I hear that one all the time.

garage mahal said...

Rick Eisenberg is the guy that agreed to endorse the Republican redistricting maps, without ever seeing the maps.

"Professor Rick Esenberg has agreed to testify next Friday in support of the map," Troupis wrote in an email to the staffers. "He needs a.) the maps; b) the numbers; c) a summary of eq. population, compact /contiguous, minority responsiveness aspects of the map."

"Sure, will do, I'm all in....I just need....the maps, and data and stuff."

I'm sure he'll represent the conservative side well tonight.

Fen said...

Have racial quotas created "diversity" at the University?

SunnyJ said: The fact that a campus as large as UW-Madison has such a dynamic debate question and there is only one side in the audience is a statistical demonstration -

A statistical demonstration that Affirmative Action does NOT create diversity.

Watch the audience. The debate itself will be self-refuting.

Fen said...

PurplePenguin: After all your online persona has shown you to be

Notice what side goes straight to the ad hom. Wouldn't want to stress those delicate "diverse" brain cells, eh Libtard?

Chuck66 said...

When I went to UW-Eau Claire a while back, 100% of the history of political science departments were staffed by Democrats. And some were pretty crappy instructors. Tired old liberals who were more interested in promoting their political causes than actually teaching.

A little diversity would have done that school good. A couple of center-right professors. Or at least a couple more good teachers. For every Dr Pond, there was a Mort Sypress or...I forget his name, but the other hard lefty who just preached his politics.

Chuck66 said...

One of the UWEC professors died last year. Twice in his obituary, they referred to him as "an ardent Democrat". Not a great professor, good author, or anything like that, but just his obsessive political views. I say we need intellectual diversity.

n.n said...

Affirmative Action and similar institutional discriminatory policies persist at the expense of individual dignity. They perpetuate civil and human rights violations, which, ironically, they were intended to overcome. They may have been considered a legitimate solution for a transitional generation, but in their progressive form have become what they intended to resolve. They are a cause of individual, system, and cultural corruption. Not unlike the well-intentioned policies of redistributive change (i.e. involuntary exploitation). They are policies supported by myopic visionaries with a desire to advance their own political, economic, and social standing.

Curious George said...

"purplepenquin said...
I said, "It's Wisconsin. Kudos for not rioting."

Just to clarify, when was the last time there were people rioting in Wisconsin?"

I think when there was a mass break-in at the capitol, breaking doors and windows. But there may have been more since then.

purplepenquin said...

You stupid fuck. I have my choice of jobs.

You just said that companies don't hire you. Did someone hack your account?

Opps, sorry. Let me try and put this in your native language so you can better understand it: You stupid fucking fucker, you just fucking said that fucking stupid companies don't fucking hire your stupid fucked up fuckface, stupid fucker. Did some fucking fucker hack your fucking account, you stupid fuckface?


You are a stupid, vicious fuck.

Well, gee...since you put it that way it is obvious that the only reason you're having trouble getting hired is because of the color of your eyes and nothing-at-all to do with your temper, foul mouth, and boorish behavior.

*rolls eyes*

Quit trying to paint yourself as a victim and take some self-responsibility for a change.

Fen said...

Note that Purple Penguin cannot address the actual topic of the thread.

Further proof that Affirmative Action hasn't worked.

purplepenquin said...

I think when there was a mass break-in at the capitol, breaking doors and windows

I don't want to assume anything about your opinion, so can you please tell me the exact date(s) that you say these riot(s) took place in Wisconsin.

~~~~

Note that Purple Penguin cannot address the actual topic of the thread.

Note that this comment from Fen has nothing-at-all to do with any of the topics being discussed, while I am discussing Tom's perception that Affirmative Action means white males can't get hired full time.

While I understand that the self-appointed Board Police may honestly beleive that has nothing-at-all to do with the topic of a debate being scheduled at the UW, I find it interesting how selective this Cop is with his outrage...after all, most of the comments don't say anything at all about a debate being scheduled at the UW.

And by "interesting", I mean "typical"

MadisonMan said...


I think when there was a mass break-in at the capitol, breaking doors and windows.

Is that the one that caused $7.8 Million to fix?

Dust Bunny Queen said...

You just said that companies don't hire you. Did someone hack your account?

Reading comprehension fail.

He isn't hired because that would screw up the quota system, so instead he is an independent contractor.

X said...

Reading comprehension fail

shhh, he's rolling.

Alex said...

I agree with ST, pp is a stupid vicious fuck.

Fen said...

PurplePenguin: Note that this comment from Fen has nothing-at-all to do with any of the topics being discussed

My first three were, your first was not, it was a retreat into ad hom. No doubt the topic frightens you so much that your only hope is to spike the thread with your usual nastiness.

I challenge you to actually argue the points raised in defense of Affirmative Action. I'll bet you can't. Put aside the fact that you'll get pasted here, I don't even think you can make a arguement.

Alex said...

shorter pp - only disaffected white males don't like affirmative action because it makes them for once have to go to the "back of the bus". HAR HAR HAR!!!!

kensei said...

I started my college education and professional education at what was the "dawn" of "affirmative action" and felt "disadvantaged" about it at the time.
While I perceived that my quest for higher education (grants and financial aid)and an initial job was somewhat hindered by race/sex/ethnicity based preferences,once I got "in the door," the effect of those preferences appeared to disappear. I would be interested in some research into the "outcomes" of the "race/sex/ethnicity" preferences on the beneficiaries. If the "preferences" worked, then perhaps they were worth it. If, however, the granting of preferences did not work in significantly improving the economic situation of the beneficiaries, then it's past "high time" to re-examine and eliminate such preferences.

purplepenquin said...

Reading comprehension fail

So he never said that he isn't getting hired by companies, and I just mis-read his words?

I'll go back and check, but his statement seemed pretty clear.

He isn't hired because...

Wait a sec! You just said that I failed at reading comprehension because I thought he said he wasn't getting hired...but now you're also saying he ain't getting hired?

*sigh*

X said...

I was hoping he'd double down. He's just that smart.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

I was hoping he'd double down. He's just that smart.

Pitiful, isn't it.

Curious George said...

"purplepenquin said...
I think when there was a mass break-in at the capitol, breaking doors and windows

I don't want to assume anything about your opinion, so can you please tell me the exact date(s) that you say these riot(s) took place in Wisconsin." March 10, 2011. It was the night of the Senate vote on Act 10. Doors where damaged, windows were tampered to allow access and in which the protesters used for entry, and protesters pushed past police trying to keep them out.

cubanbob said...

Purple, stop dancing. You are making yourself look foolish And you are not a fool. He (ST) got hired as an independent contractor which means the employer filled a slot they could not fill using an affirmative action (read quota) hire. in practical terms he does the same job as an employee but without the benefits. Cute and saves the employer money and leaves the quota intact. Had ST been black and the same situation were to occur he would have one hell of an employment and discrimination case.

Fen said...

And now a word from our sponsers while PurplePenguin furiously googles "Affirmative Action Talking Points"....

Back in 15.

purplepenquin said...

My first three were,

If the topic is "There is a debate at the UW", then only one of your first three posts were on topic.

your first was not

If the topic is issues that the Professor mentions in her opening post, then my first comment (as well as your first three, but not the last three) were on topic.

Shouting Thomas claimed that Affirmative Action has resulted in him not being able to be hired. Saying "They won't hire me 'cause I'm white!" is no different than saying "They won't hire me 'cause I'm black!"...while it may be true in one or three examples, if that is the reason you're giving for not being able to be hired for over 5 years then I strongly suspect that there is a lot more than just skin-color/gender involved.

I could have been more polite in originally stating that opinion, so I apologize for any hurt feelings.

Fen said...

You're still not getting it.

Public education?

purplepenquin said...

March 10, 2011. It was the night of the Senate vote on Act 10.

Thanks George. I was scolded a while ago for claiming that some of the Althouse-commentators honestly beleive that riots occurred at our State Capitol, so I appreciate having an actual person to use as an example in case it comes up again.

I wonder if our hostess also labels the actions of that particular night a "riot" or if she had other incident(s) in mind.

purplepenquin said...

You're still not getting it.

Oh, I get a lot.

I get that the majority of your posts in this thread have nothing to do with the topics and everything to do with me.

I get that Shouting Thomas flat-out said "The reason companies don't hire me..." but a temper tantrum is being thrown 'cause ya'll think I am totally wrong to say that companies aren't hiring him.

I get that practically everybody (including yourself) is posting on topics that have nothing-at-all to do with a debate being scheduled at the UW, yet you are scolding only me for this behavior.

I get that you're an asshole and a hater.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

You're still not getting it.

Public education?


Purple Penguin: tap tap tappity tap.

Fen said...

So Purple, now that you've had your little rant purge, care to discuss the actual merits of Affirmative Action?

X said...

I get that you're an asshole and a hater


yeah Fen, you stupid fucking fuckfaced fucker.

Rusty said...

purplepenquin said...
March 10, 2011. It was the night of the Senate vote on Act 10.

Thanks George. I was scolded a while ago for claiming that some of the Althouse-commentators honestly beleive that riots occurred at our State Capitol, so I appreciate having an actual person to use as an example in case it comes up again.

I wonder if our hostess also labels the actions of that particular night a "riot" or if she had other incident(s) in mind.


Equivocate much.

Just so we know the next time this comes up, what do you consider a riot?

Chip S. said...

I get that practically everybody (including yourself) is posting on topics that have nothing-at-all to do with a debate being scheduled at the UW...

Discussing an example of the implications of affirmative-action rules on companies decisions to hire full-time employees vs. using independent contractors has nothing to do with the UW debate? Is that your position? Really?

What do you think people should be talking about--the relative merits of the scheduled time and place for the debate? Is that like a pre-debate?

purplepenquin said...

care to discuss the actual merits of Affirmative Action?

That's not really The Topic of this post...rather it is about a debate being scheduled at the UW...but we can continue to talk about Affirmative Action if you want. (Probably much more interesting that your obsession about moi.)

Some people blame Affirmative Action, rather than their own shortcomings, for their inability to get hired. This false perception often times leads to resentment and ill-feelings, and those people may need a wake-up call and told "Hey, maybe the problem is your foul mouth or bad temper rather than the color of your skin."

Baron Zemo said...

Thank the Good Lord for affirmative action.

That is how we got this President.

And most law professors.

Chip S. said...

That's not really The Topic of this post...rather it is about a debate being scheduled at the UW.

No no no! We must stay On Topic.

So, what does everybody think about Room 3260? Too big? Too small? How are the acoustics there, anyway?

Curious George said...

"purplepenquin said...
March 10, 2011. It was the night of the Senate vote on Act 10.

Thanks George. I was scolded a while ago for claiming that some of the Althouse-commentators honestly beleive that riots occurred at our State Capitol, so I appreciate having an actual person to use as an example in case it comes up again.

I wonder if our hostess also labels the actions of that particular night a "riot" or if she had other incident(s) in mind."

I don't recall Althouse ever describing the capitol protests or the these AA protests as rioting, she certainly isn't here, nor is Meade. But both have had an element of it. The March 10 protest, with people breaking doors and altering windows and accessing through both are examples of rioting, or at least close. Civil order certainly broke down.

Chip S. said...

6:15 PM is kind of a weird starting time for the debate, don't you think?

Are people planning to bring sandwiches, or just eat later?

What's the best sandwich to bring to a law-school debate? My guess is baloney.

Alan said...

A Vulcan medical officer facing a Vulcan security or engineering officer... Hmmm.

For some reason, this Trek reference came to mind:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Let_That_Be_Your_Last_Battlefield

Baron Zemo said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
purplepenquin said...

Just so we know the next time this comes up, what do you consider a riot?

Locally? Mifflin St '96 and Halloween '04 are a couple latest examples.

Do you agree with CurioGeo that the events at the Capitol on March 10, 2011 were a riot? Was that the only riot that happened during the protests or do you beleive there were more?

purplepenquin said...

No no no! We must stay On Topic

Well, that is what Fen keeps telling everybody.

Then again, he keeps telling only me and nobody else.

Reckon he has different set of rules for other folks...so ya'll feel free to carry on.

~~~

I don't recall Althouse ever describing the capitol protests or the these AA protests as rioting

Not that I agree with her perception of the events, but I sincerely thought she was referring to the Capitol Protests when she said "It's Wisconsin. Kudos for not rioting."

Do you think she was talking about something else?

Shouting Thomas said...

Just for the record, in the ludicrous hope that it will make any difference to a dumb fuck like penguin, I didn't say that employers won't hire me.

They're quite eager to hire me.

They hire me as a contractor to skirt the quota system. They don't hire me as a full-time employee for the same reason.

Penguin just tried to twist that with a deliberate lie. What can you expect from a moron?

My contract employers pay me a premium which is a little more than what they would pay me as a full time employee with benefits and vacation.

In a way, I don't give a shit. The main disadvantage is that it is almost impossible to schedule a real vacation.

X said...

don't worry about it ST. with Obamacare, 1099 IC's are the future!

purplepenquin said...

I didn't say that employers won't hire me.

Oh, ok. Sorry for thinking that you said companies don't hire you.

They don't hire me

Yeah, that's what I thought you said. But you keep saying you never said that.

Penguin just tried to twist that with a deliberate lie.

I've been saying the same thing you've been saying! Well, except that I mentioned that it might have more to do with you than with your skin color.

Is it really a lie to say there might be other factors involved? It is truly a proven fact that skin color/gender is the only reason you haven't been able to be hired full-time for the past 7 years?

In a way, I don't give a shit.

Of course you don't. That's why you claim that Affirmative Action is one of the biggest reasons for the collapse of our economy.

'cause you don't give a shit about it at all....

Shouting Thomas said...

I said The reason companies don't hire me full time is because of the racial and sexual quota system in my first post.

The words "full time" kind of qualify that statement.

Do you make it a habit to engage in outright lying?

That question answers itself, doesn't it?

You're just a liar, penguin. A bald faced liar.

purplepenquin said...

The words "full time" kind of qualify that statement.

THAT is what you're twisted up about?!

*sigh*

Feel free to put "full time" into all of the statements I said in response to your comment about how Affirmative Action results in you not being hired full time, and they are still just as valid.

Curious George said...

Shouting Thomas said...

Do you make it a habit to engage in outright lying?

That question answers itself, doesn't it?

You're just a liar, penguin. A bald faced liar."

You're a regular here, this is new to you? PP has a history of this...both the outright lie as well as intellectual dishonesty.

Peter said...

Affirmative action seems to be heavily discounted at Amazon.com

That is, one can buy a copy of Jayson Blair's "Burning Down My Master's House: Life at teh New York Times [abridged][audio CD]

Available from these sellers.

24 new from $0.01
18 used from $0.01


http://www.amazon.com/Burning-Down-My-Masters-House/dp/1590075471/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1348770705&sr=8-1&keywords=Burning+Down+My+Masters%27+House%3A+My+Life+at+the+New+York+Times

Shouting Thomas said...

And, penguin, to further elaborate on your propensity to lying, I clearly said that I don't give a shit any more because I'm approaching retirement.

The whole mess will cease to have much to do with me any more. I don't spend much time worrying about things that don't concern me.

A decade ago, I had an entirely different view.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Putrid Penguin has to be one of the dumbest liberal trolls of all time.

Fen said...

Fen: Care to discuss the actual merits of Affirmative Action?

PurplePenguin: That's not really The Topic of this post...

ie. no, you would rather hector Shouting Thomas over something he did not say.

Is it because you can't defend Affirmative Action? Or because you don't know how to?

kentuckyliz said...

I would love to share all the gory details on how this has worked out from what I have seen in my career and industry.

The worst effect is on members of protected classes, because everyone assumes they were hired because of AA preferences. There is a cloud of suspicion and skepticism and doubt. It is a perception that the person has to overcome and prove wrong. It about sets them back worse than if there was no quota system.

Marshal said...

Dust Bunny Queen said...
Putrid Penguin has to be one of the dumbest liberal trolls of all time.


He took a thread that could have been damaging to the left (in the sense that it highlights unpopular leftist ideas) and turned it into a morass of gibberish. So is he stupid? Or did he accomplish exactly what he wanted?

Rusty said...

purplepenquin said...
Just so we know the next time this comes up, what do you consider a riot?

Locally? Mifflin St '96 and Halloween '04 are a couple latest examples.


Lead me to some info? I'm not familiar with Mifflin St, and Halloween '04 doesn't tell me much.


Do you agree with CurioGeo that the events at the Capitol on March 10, 2011 were a riot? Was that the only riot that happened during the protests or do you beleive there were more?


Nice try.
Do YOU consider the tresspassing and damage to public property by a out of control group of people a riot?

Please be specific.


chickelit said...

I should have worn a wire twelve years ago when I was interviewing for faculty positions. I would have recorded things like "We'd hire you but we need to hire a woman."

PurplePenquin doesn't believe such words were ever uttered.

Fen said...

He took a thread that could have been damaging to the left (in the sense that it highlights unpopular leftist ideas) and turned it into a morass of gibberish.

Yup. Its called "spiking the thread", much like you would spike a cannon. Several of Althouse's liberal commenters routinely do this to derail discussion they are uncomfortable with. And she still allows them to post here.

campy said...

Yup. Its called "spiking the thread"

That's reason #1 why it's best to ignore trolls.

Paul Risenhoover said...

I'll just say it doesn't take much courage to support affirmative action in one of the whitest places on Earth.

William said...

I had a friend who went to Stuyvesant HS in NYC. Stuyvesant is a public school, but it's very well funded and extremely difficult to get into. Entrance is by competitive exam only. My friend was Chinese. He came from a poor immigrant family. He became a doctor.....The majority of the students are from Asian backgrounds, and these kids frequently come from impoverished backgrounds. There are some white kids, but for the most part they come from more middle class backgrounds.....The blacks and Latinos are underrepresented in the student population. The NAACP is bringing suit against the elite NYC high schools. The bet here is that they will win it. The kids that get screwed will be poor Asian kids. The black kids that benefit will probably be from much more privileged backgrounds and will probably be the children of West Indian immigrants. The white middle class kids, if their enrollment is even cut at all, will find other paths to college and success...This is patently unfair to the Asian kids, but there will not be single liberal who will make such an observation.....For the record, I'm pretty sure that my own group, ethnic Catholics, are probably underrepresented in enrollment at Stuyvesant, but I don't feel deprived. It's more to my self interest that very bright kids study with other very bright kids and find a way to cure cancer than for my particular ethnic group to be represented proportionally among the bright kids.

whoresoftheinternet said...

Black people have a 1-standard-deviations-lower IQ than the average American.

And no educational environment has been shown to be able erase that IQ gap.

David said...

Esenberg will represent the position well. He's very smart and strong on the issues. He's also decent and fair minded. UW should hire him, but they won't.

DADvocate said...

Affirmative action is the continuing message to minorities and women that "you can't do it on your own." That, in fact, you are inferior to those nasty old (and young) white males.

Then it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. The people affirmative action is intended to help come to believe they can't compete and excel on their own and they demand more and more help. Some even need someone to buy them birth control pills because doing it for themselves is asking too much. Others lie about their heritage and pretend to be Native Americans because they can't compete and succeed on their own merits.

The overall outcome is individuals misplaced or failing in their careers and a deteriorating society.

purplepenquin said...

PurplePenquin doesn't believe such words were ever uttered

*sigh*

Despite your misconception (your lie?) about what I have been saying, I can beleive that those words were uttered once or twice in the past few years. What I have a hard time beleiving is that for over five years a person has been unable to hired for a full-time job just because he is a white male.

And yes, I understand that many of you honestly beleive it is a fact (rather than an opinion) that skincolor/gender is the reason why Tom wasn't able to get hired full time for the past seven years and thus ya'll think it is a total lie for anyone to say there might have been other factors involved with those hiring decisions.

That's the main problem...ya'll think your opinions are cold-hard facts, and anyone who disagrees is a lying liar who lies.

~~~~

Lead me to some info? I'm not familiar with Mifflin St, and Halloween '04 doesn't tell me much.

They both happened in Madison. Wiki has some info, and there are news stories to be found via Google.

Nice try

???

Is that your way of saying that you only ask questions and you won't answer 'em? 'cause I don't understand what ya mean by that reply.

Shouting Thomas said...

Yes, penguin, you are a lying liar who lies.

Deliberately, too.

Low life.

purplepenquin said...

I'm sorry I hurt your feelings Tom, but we're disagreeing about your opinion that the reason why you haven't been able to be hired full time in the last seven years is because of Affirmative Action. I know you don't want to hear it said, but my opinion is that given the long amount of time you said this was happening (seven years) there might be other factors involved.

The way you keep insisting that your opinion on this matter is actually a fact, and thus anyone who disagrees with it must be a liar, speaks volumes.


And since it appears that this is very important to some folks, it should be pointed out that 100% of the posts in this thread by DustBunnyQueen, X and Alex were all "off topic" and consisted only of personal remarks. I wonder why the self-appointed board cop didn't call 'em out on that?

Then again, no need to wonder. The reason why is pretty obvious.

Rusty said...

I thought not.

TosaGuy said...

Meanwhile,

WI taxpayers on the hook for discrimination by Doyle appointee who hired, reassigned and fired people because of the color of their skin.

X said...

The way you keep insisting that your opinion on this matter is actually a fact, and thus anyone who disagrees with it must be a liar, speaks volumes.

DerplePenquin, that's not what he's accusing you of lying about. he's saying you're pretending not to get his point. I disagree. I think you truly don't grok it.

purplepenquin said...

he's saying you're pretending not to get his point.

I ain't pretending.

I truly&honestly beleive that his point is that for the past seven years he has worked as a contractor for various companies because they won't hire him on as a full-time employee, and that the reason they won't hire him on full-time is because of Affirmative Action.

If that ain't what he was saying, then can someone please explain what was meant with the second paragraph of the comments on 9/27/12 10:49 AM?