November 22, 2011

"Researchers inserted the human cells into the brains of mice where they successfully integrated themselves into the wiring."

"Then the UW team applied a new technology, using light to stimulate the human cells and watching as they in turn activated mouse brain cells."
In a lab dish, the brain cells or neurons began firing simultaneously "like a power surge lighting up a building," said Jason Weick, an assistant scientist...

Weick said the use of light stimulation, called optogenetics, raises the possibility of modifying transplanted brain cells, in effect turning them up or down like the dimmer control on a light....

In the experiments with live mice, the UW researchers anesthetized the animals, inserted a needle into precise areas of the brain and injected the human neurons. The scientists selected a target for the cells where the brain's architecture is well defined and the cells would have a good chance to integrate into the circuitry: the mouse hippocampus. The hippocampus is the part of the brain in which memories are formed, organized and stored.
Here's what it looked like:



Man, I may need a dimmer switch for my brain... to modulate the fear.

Or... what am I saying? Hooray for the University of Wisconsin, and onward to treating Parkinson's and Lou Gehrig's diseases.

IN THE COMMENTS: Ignorance is Bliss said: "She tried to warn you, but would you listen?"

96 comments:

traditionalguy said...

Isn't that the same theory that Joe Kennedy used on his retarded daughter.

The Frankenstein Clinic is creating new things again.

Aheitman said...

This is very exciting, but we need to temper the applications with about 10-20 more years of research.

Also, we need to remember, this isn't playing God. It's playing by His rules.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

She tried to warn you, but would you listen?

Jay said...

and onward to treating Parkinson's and Lou Gehrig's diseases.

And here I thought ESC research was going to do that.

John Edwards even said so...

Scott M said...

I call bullshit on this unsourced pseudoscience hogwash. They expect us to believe they got an entire hippo into a mouse?

Bullshit.

Scott M said...

On a side note, juicing up mice brains just makes them more likely to fall prey to mouse zombies. Just sayin'...

garage mahal said...

If anyone knows Tommy Thompson's current position on stem cell research you get a prize. We know Scott Walker's position is. And his wife has Type 1 diabetes. Sorry honey!

Don't Tread 2012 said...

Can human cells be inserted into garage's brain?

Just askin'.

Curious George said...

"garage mahal said...
If anyone knows Tommy Thompson's current position on stem cell research you get a prize. We know Scott Walker's position is. And his wife has Type 1 diabetes. Sorry honey!"

Walker is against embryonic stem cell research. I suppose he doesn't want to flush taxpayer money down the toilet or give his wife cancer...which is the two results this research has provided.

Of course, like most lefties, you don't differentiate between adult and embryonic stem cell research. Are you stupid and not know the difference? Or just a liar?

Darleen said...

poor li'l garage ... tries the "stem cell research" meme leaving out "embryonic" ... in order to attack Scott Walker.

Never mind that ESC's have proven a bust while adult stem cells find new uses every day.

It's of a piece with the argument that somehow thinking America has the right to set up rules about immigration and holding those that break those rules accountable makes such a person an "anti-immigrant"

edutcher said...

If only this would work on the Occupation and the Walker Weasels.

DADvocate said...

I've had this overpowering desire to eat cheese, lately.

Scott M said...

If anyone knows Tommy Thompson's current position on stem cell research you get a prize. We know Scott Walker's position is. And his wife has Type 1 diabetes. Sorry honey!

I used to think you were smarter than this, GM. You're giving me very little work with in the way of defending your intellect. Or maybe it's just a typo that caused you to omit the differences between stem cell lines and who's against what.

In any case, your statement as typed is incorrect. I'll leave it up to your smarts, conscience, and typing abilities whether it was a lie or not.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...
We know Scott Walker's position is. And his wife has Type 1 diabetes. Sorry honey!


Um, ESC research isn't going to cure diabetes.

Idiot.

Jerub-Baal said...

I'm surprised that no one has inserted the (obviously not) obligatory "Pinky and the Brain" reference

So Brain, what do you want to do tonight?

sorepaw said...
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Curious George said...

"sorepaw said...
Whether embryonic stem cell research is producing valuable outcomes or not, if you're anti-abortion you're in favor of banning such research.

Right?" Not that easy. There are existing lines that are used for research. I would guess most, like me, would look to banning additional lines being created.

That said, despite what lefties also try to claim, there is no ban on ESC research. I just want to point that out to save garage bullshitting time.

garage mahal said...

Um, ESC research isn't going to cure diabetes.

You're an endocrinologist now too? Just my luck! I have a vested interest in a cure.

So tell why embryonic stem cell research holds no promise, and also tell us specifically what does.

I'm excited to hear your response since this appears to be your field of expertise.

Cedarford said...

Jay said...
garage mahal said...
We know Scott Walker's position is. And his wife has Type 1 diabetes. Sorry honey!

Um, ESC research isn't going to cure diabetes.
Idiot.
============
Jay goes with his usual doctrinaire smugness again.
Truth is we do not know if ESC or some other research pathway will get pancreas Islets cells producing insulin.
And not knowing that, I favor allowing researchers to be free to explore any pathway to reaserch and discovery they wish to try and can get funding for - rather than have government dictate what research is allowable.

=================
I like the basic research because it also goes past "disease cure" into how the brains of respective creatures work, how certain brains function with higher efficiency for their size. How certain animals have incorporated additional senses past our five into brain processing (magnetic fields). And how full brain maturation and learning is very rapid in other species.

These all can have implications for us down the road. What makes a parrot brain so much more efficient for it's size over a human brain. What processes - chemical, otherwise - can cause a more rapid progression into adulthood.
Why do some animals that live a very long time show no analogue to Alzheimers?

Jay said...

I favor allowing researchers to be free to explore any pathway to reaserch and discovery they wish to try and can get funding for - rather than have government dictate what research is allowable.


Of course the government doesn't dictate which research is allowable. In fact, the whole "debate" over ESC was whether or not there would be federal funding of such research.

If it weren't for incoherence and straw men, you'd have nothing to say.

Jay said...

Can human cells be inserted into garage's brain?


Now that's funny.

Alex said...

I love how this topic brings out the fundies all in a lather. Save the fetuses and kill the actual humans!!!

Alex said...

Of course the government doesn't dictate which research is allowable. In fact, the whole "debate" over ESC was whether or not there would be federal funding of such research.

Bullshit. Fundies want all ESC to be outlawed on the grounds that it encourages abortion.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...


So tell why embryonic stem cell research holds no promise, and also tell us specifically what does.

I'm excited to hear your response since this appears to be your field of expertise.


Hilarious.

Mind you, from someone who boils the issue down to: if you're not for funding ESC, you're not for a cure for diabetes.

Your idiot, 6th grade logic is embarrassing. And if I were as stupid as you, I wouldn't be commenting.

garage mahal said...

Your idiot, 6th grade logic is embarrassing. And if I were as stupid as you, I wouldn't be commenting.

You told me ESC research won't cure "diabetes". As an endocrinologist you surely know there are two forms of diabetes. Moving on, I asked why you thought ESC research won't cure diabetes.

Please tell us why not.

Jay said...

I favor allowing researchers to be free to explore any pathway to reaserch and discovery they wish to try and can get funding for - rather than have government dictate what research is allowable.


Actually, you favor sending money (the government does not have) down rat holes. But of course this ill-informed political position does make you feel good inside.

Reality has intruded, however:

The company doing the first government-approved test of embryonic stem cell therapy is discontinuing further stem cell work,

OOPS.

ESC is the "green jobs" of the medical field.

Jay said...

Moving on, I asked why you thought ESC research won't cure diabetes.


Um, because there are zero indications ESC will "cure" anything.

Idiot.

Jay said...

So tell why embryonic stem cell research holds no promise

Whether or not ESC (or any other research) "holds promise" is irrelevant.

But of course you're so dumb you can't possibly understand that.

Curious George said...

"garage mahal said...
Um, ESC research isn't going to cure diabetes.

You're an endocrinologist now too? Just my luck! I have a vested interest in a cure.

So tell why embryonic stem cell research holds no promise, and also tell us specifically what does.

I'm excited to hear your response since this appears to be your field of expertise."

Uh, and endocrinologist would have no idea on what stem cell research might cure diabetes. They deal with the what, no the how.

That said,let's flip this around. You indicated that "stem cell research" would cure diabetes. Which type, embryonic, adult, or both? So tell us what stem cell research holds promise and why. I'm excited to hear your response since this appears to be your field of expertise.

Oh, wait, you are either not smart enough to realize there are both or are just a liar. So nothing you could add will be of value.

Never mind.

garage mahal said...

You indicated that "stem cell research" would cure diabetes.

No I didn't. [and you called ME the liar, douchebag]

I was asking Jay how knew ESC research wouldn't cure diabetes.

Since you appear to be an expert too, I'm sure you have some thoughts as well?

garage mahal said...

*how he knew

Curious George said...

"garage mahal said...
You indicated that "stem cell research" would cure diabetes.

No I didn't. [and you called ME the liar, douchebag]" LOL

Please explain this garage:

We know Scott Walker's position is. And his wife has Type 1 diabetes. Sorry honey!

I'll wait.

garage mahal said...

Whether or not ESC (or any other research) "holds promise" is irrelevant.

It's pretty fucking relevant to someone that has diabetes.

I'll be waiting for your answer as to why ESC research won't cure diabetes. Because you could save quite a few people a lot of time and money. Millions are riding on this Jay! Or maybe you're working on a secret cure on your own and don't want to let anyone know just yet?

Freeman Hunt said...

I read this story back when it was called Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of NIMH.

Freeman Hunt said...

Somewhere there's a mouse remembering what it was like for someone else to drive a car.

Scott M said...

Re: the current pointless debate here about ESC, I give you what is quite possibly the best line from an animated movie in quite some time...

"If you have any poo, fling it now."

That about sums it up for all of you, doesn't it?

Jay said...

It's pretty fucking relevant to someone that has diabetes.


Actually, it isn't.

I'll be waiting for your answer as to why ESC research won't cure diabetes


Um, because there are zero indications ESC will "cure" anything.

Idiot.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...
You indicated that "stem cell research" would cure diabetes.

No I didn't


Um, yes, yes you did. You pathetic little liar.

Jay said...

I'll be waiting for your answer as to why ESC research won't cure diabetes

Your stupidity isn't my problem.

Neither is your ignorance.

Scott M said...

I read this story back when it was called Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of NIMH.

I've heard they are remaking that, although I don't know if Don Bluth is attached to the project. Likewise, the remake of The Dark Crystal is obviously going to have to go ahead without Jim Hensen's help.

Jay said...

It's pretty fucking relevant to someone that has diabetes.


Proving that this is all emotion to you, not fact based or grounded in science.

By the way garbage, this little nugget describes you perfectly:

"To start with, people need a fairy tale," said Ronald D.G. McKay, a stem cell researcher at the National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke. "Maybe that's unfair, but they need a story line that's relatively simple to understand."

Which is why you leave idiotic if you're not for funding ESC, you're not for a cure for diabetes comments on blogs.

madAsHell said...

Flowers for Algernon

garage mahal said...

So finally, Jay googles the topic, and gives us a link to the WaPo that claims ESC "unlikely" to cure Alzheimer's, from 2004. [Earlier he said "it won't cure diabetes].

Too fucking lazy to find anything more recent, or how ESC research pertained to diabetes, or how the ongoing research has been going, or how the clinical trials are going. Nothing. Millions of people are afflicted with this disease, Jay has no idea if ESC will cure or not cure Type 1, the only thing Jay knows is his team is against ESC research.

What a monumental jackass.

Jay said...

Too fucking lazy to find anything more recent

You mean other than this, right?

The company doing the first government-approved test of embryonic stem cell therapy is discontinuing further stem cell work

Or did you skip over that because it doesn't fit your dumbass narrative?

and gives us a link to the WaPo that claims ESC "unlikely" to cure Alzheimer's, from 2004

Um, I was making the point that you need a fairy tale. And every comment you've made on the topic proves that point.
You barely literate jackass.

or how the clinical trials are going.

Considering there are no clinical trials, it isn't going well.

Moron.

Jay said...

Jay has no idea if ESC will cure or not cure Type 1,

Actually, I do know.

It won't. As I've said over & over, there are zero indications ESC will "cure" anything.
That would be anything or can't you grasp that, dipshit?

Jay said...

What a monumental jackass.


Coming from the idiot who claims that if you're not for ESC you're not for a cure for diabetes then says he didn't say it.

I'm sorry you are so stupid and you believe in fairy tales.

Fairy.

rhhardin said...

It's funded by Big Cheese.

Paddy O said...
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Methadras said...

garage mahal said...

If anyone knows Tommy Thompson's current position on stem cell research you get a prize. We know Scott Walker's position is. And his wife has Type 1 diabetes. Sorry honey!


Hey retard, it's not anti-stem cell research. It's embryonic stem cell research that is opposed. Stem cell research derived from any other source besides embryo's is not the issue you fucking mouth breathing trog. Why do you constantly display how fucking utterly stupid you are? Are you a masochist? or just to stupid to even know what that is you stupid fuck.

garage mahal said...

Um, I was making the point that you need a fairy tale. And every comment you've made on the topic proves that point.

I don't need a fairy tale, I need less idiots like you getting in the way of people that aren't idiots so they can do real research. You know absolutely jack fucking shit about the topic, but you pretend to. Why?

Dave said...

So tell why embryonic stem cell research holds no promise, and also tell us specifically what does.

ESC may have some promise - it's impossible to rule it out entirely. However adult stem cell research is more effective and is in use the clinic today (most common use: bone marrow transplant for leukemia). No clinical trial of ESC has been a success here or in Europe, in fact those trial sin the past were disasters. To be fair there have benn very few trials.

Biologically there are several reasons adult stem cells are preferable. First they don't require immune suppressive drugs to prevent rejection (not an issue with some transplants, but certainly important for pancreatic tissue and thus diabetes) Second ESC are less developed than adult stem cells and ESCs may errantly develop growing without constraint because the DNA does not have an adult methylation state (sounds like cancer because it is like cancer). This actually happened in one European clinical trial. Adult stem cells are capable of a more limited cell type production and do not appear to have the unconstrained quality of ES cells. Obviously someday someone might figure out how to fix ESCs but how long if ever that would take is unknowable.

Morally adult stem cells are almost entirely without controversy - even the Pope endorses them. Embryonic stem cells however, because of their origin primarily from abortions, are highly controversial; as they should be. So promoting ESC is promoting a inferior approach and picking a fight all at once.

sorepaw said...
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Dave said...

From the anti-abortion standpoint, the case for banning them applies whether Embryonic Stem Cell research is producing health benefits or not.

I agree with this position. Even if ESC were superior clinically they are morally unacceptable. What I worry about is that the strong temptation of a cure will corrupt many.

garage mahal said...

From the anti-abortion standpoint, the case for banning them applies whether Embryonic Stem Cell research is producing health benefits or not.

That's pretty hard to prove when the approval process with the FDA and the court battles that ensued have prevented any human trials up until Oct 2010.

Curious George said...

"sorepaw said...

From the anti-abortion standpoint, the case for banning them applies whether Embryonic Stem Cell research is producing health benefits or not."

Well I don't think it's that easy. Someone who is anti-abortion could I suppose make a distinction between embryo and fetus. And embryos come from not abortions but unused from fertility treatments I believe.

Cedarford said...

Dave - " Adult stem cells are capable of a more limited cell type production and do not appear to have the unconstrained quality of ES cells. Obviously someday someone might figure out how to fix ESCs but how long if ever that would take is unknowable."

===============
True, but your argument is flawed because you do not want researchers to have ESCs to work with and attempt to solve any problems associated with ESCs through further research.

Also, ESCs are not about just disease cures, but figuring out how DNA works, how things are switched on and off in embryoinc development - which has implications in many areas - from cancer research to understanding basic life functions.

And while adult stem cells offer promising future medical options, by their nature they are not a good application for brain, spine, optic nerve and other CNS applications..

Not that progress would stop if the Fundies in America had their way - research will go on in Europe and Asia...

Dave said...

They come from both sources. But your larger point is accurate. It's true that some will make the distinction and it would split the pro-life side.

Darleen said...

Fundies want all ESC to be outlawed on the grounds that it encourages abortion.

Since the embryos used for ESC are actually created via IVF, this is a specious claim about "fundie" objection.

The objections to ESC come basically two-fold. 1- the deliberate creation of human life as property not as another sovereign human. Analogous to having a kid just so its heart could be donated to a sibling.

2- government funding: related to #1, with such a morally ambiguous act, at the very least taxpayer money should not be funding it. Indeed, considering that nothing has yet panned out in ESC research, is government $ actually being wasted rather then being invested in science that has shown results.

Dave said...

"And while adult stem cells offer promising future medical options, by their nature they are not a good application for brain, spine, optic nerve and other CNS applications.."

Nonsense. This is false adult stem cells can make neurons.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...

I don't need a fairy tale, I need less idiots like you getting in the way of people that aren't idiots so they can do real research. You know absolutely jack fucking shit about the topic, but you pretend to. Why?


Yes, yes you do need a fairy tale. ESC is a fairy tale.

What is even funnier, is that I can reference an article from 2004 that casts doubt on the whole racket and seven years later you can point to no meaningful, tangible results. And that point is lost on you.

Because you're an idiot.

Jay said...

I need less idiots like you getting in the way of people that aren't idiots so they can do real research.

Er, they tried to do the research, and quit.

Want to guess why that is, clown?

You know absolutely jack fucking shit about the topic,

Um, I'm not the one who's "opinion" boils down to if you're not for funding ESC, you're not for a cure for diabetes

I'm also not the one who's opinion is that something "holds promise" which of course is purposely vague, carries no meaning, and has no value.

Why, it is almost as if you're stupid or something.

Curious George said...

" garage mahal said...
From the anti-abortion standpoint, the case for banning them applies whether Embryonic Stem Cell research is producing health benefits or not.

That's pretty hard to prove when the approval process with the FDA and the court battles that ensued have prevented any human trials up until Oct 2010."

Your reply is not even pertinent to the statement. So I'm bringing "stupid" back into the equation.

I'm still waiting to see the tap dance you have to do to say you were't saying stem cells will cure diabetes.

You can blame all the excuses you want but ESCR has so far been proven a bust. With recent breakthroughs in making adult stem cells pluripotent, ESCR is not the pony to invest research in. That sucks for Madison and the UW. Too bad.

It also sucks for liars like you who say someone is against "stem cell research" when they are only against "EMBRYONIC stem cell research."

Scott M said...

See...you could have ended after the "you." and your argument would be just as strong, if not stronger.

garage mahal said...

ESC is a fairy tale.

It may be, but you are the absolute last person on earth that would know, and the last person I would consult about it.

Here is the extent of your knowledge of ESC:

1. What you just googled during this thread.
2. Your team is against ESC research
3. You hate liberals and your position will likely piss them off

That's it.

Jay said...

And while adult stem cells offer promising future medical options, by their nature they are not a good application for brain, spine, optic nerve and other CNS applications

Really?

Where did you get this bullshit talking point, jackass?

Because here is an actual fact:

Macie Morse from Colorado before stem cells had 20/4000 vision in one eye and in the other eye she only had “light perception,” she could only make out light. Also, she could only watch TV with her nose pressed against the glass. After treatment [She received spinal injections of cord blood stem cells each week for six weeks. she had 20/80 vision in one eye and the other is 20/400+. She is now driving her family’s van and enjoying her new driving permit

When will you left wing idiots ever stop making such imbeciles of yourselves?

Scott M said...

@GM

1. You're no more an expert on it than Jay is.
2. Your team likes to waste other people's money in shocking amounts.
3. Your dislike for conservative viewpoints is obvious and your mostly unfunny one-liner digs, are supposed to sound ironically pithy but end up just sounding irrationally pathetic.

Jay said...

It may be, but you are the absolute last person on earth that would know, and the last person I would consult about it.

Who cares, you're an idiot.

Jay said...


Here is the extent of your knowledge of ESC:


Comical.

Coming from:

garage mahal said...

We know Scott Walker's position is. And his wife has Type 1 diabetes. Sorry honey!


Really, do you think your comments have any validity?

Any?

Jay said...

Cedarford said...

And while adult stem cells offer promising future medical options, by their nature they are not a good application for brain, spine, optic nerve and other CNS applications.


The absolute biggest bullshit post on the thread.

You know zero about this topic.

Darleen said...

Dave

This is false adult stem cells can make neurons.

Oh look, there goes one now!

Jay said...

garage mahal said...



It may be, but you are the absolute last person on earth that would know, and the last person I would consult about it.

Here is the extent of your knowledge of ESC:


As opposed to you, who demonstrates the "knowledge" of the topic to be I have diabetes and ESC holds promise.

Hysterical.

Dave said...

Thanks Darleen I'd never heard of that group/company before.

garage mahal said...

That sucks for Madison and the UW. Too bad.

Ah, sometimes the truth does come out. I knew it. You hate Madison liberals, and you will gladly sacrifice the money coming into the UW, and welcome the researchers and biotech firms that will leave the state. What a petty little douchebag you are. What are you like fucking 12 yrs old?

Dave said...

Garage,

If you have Type II diabetes you can do a lot to slow it down. My PhD adviser had it and he was insulin free in his 60s. He put it off my running daily and eating very carefully. It takes discipline but it can be done. Any stem cell therapy is still a long way off, and diabetes is very debilitating, as I'm sure you know.

Take care of your self; this blog would would be an echo chamber without you.

Freeman Hunt said...

Hey, what are you people talking about?

This is a thread about mice with brains that are part human!

Scott M said...

This is a thread about mice with brains that are part human!

Which, of course, as I'm sure you've all wondered, begs the question: would a zombie go after a mouse that's been injected with human brains? I mean, the mouse doesn't really have a prayer...all they would do is jump on that wheel and run...

Freeman Hunt said...

And You May Find Yourself Living In A Lab Mouse Cage
And You May Find Yourself In Another Part Of Wisconsin
And You May Find Yourself in an Assistant Scientist's Skinner Box
And You May Find Yourself In A Research Study, With A Mouse for a
Wife
And You May Ask Yourself-Well...How Did I Get Here?

Letting The Days Go By/Let The Water Hold Me Down
Letting The Days Go By/Water Flowing Underground
Into The Blue Again/After The Money's Gone
Once In A Lifetime/Water Flowing Underground.

And You May Ask Yourself
How Do I Work This?
And You May Ask Yourself
Where Is That Large Automobile?
And You May Tell Yourself
This Is Not My Beautiful House!
And You May Tell Yourself
This Is Not My Beautiful Wife!

garage mahal said...

Dave
Thanks for the concern, although I don't have diabetes, my daughter has Type 1. My dad had Type II though and it cut him short. Sorry, I just hate this fucking disease with every cell in my body. And yes I realize we're more fortunate than many.

Scott M said...

That only works if you're doing the arm thing, Freeman.

(best TH song evah, btw)

Jay said...

Sorry, I just hate this fucking disease with every cell in my body.

And of course that gives you license to make dumb comments, support stupid ideas, and pretend you know anything about the topic.

Curious George said...

"garage mahal said...
That sucks for Madison and the UW. Too bad.

Ah, sometimes the truth does come out. I knew it. You hate Madison liberals, and you will gladly sacrifice the money coming into the UW, and welcome the researchers and biotech firms that will leave the state. What a petty little douchebag you are. What are you like fucking 12 yrs old?"

First you lie about what you said, and now invent what I said. Let me repeat, ESCR is a bust. This is especially true since they are noe able to make adult cells pluripotent (formerly only embryonic cells were). So research dollars, which are not infinite, are better spent on ASCR. That was my stated point.

But I guess you don't care about cures...only dollars for the UW and Madison and your stupid liberal talking points.

And your daughter has Type 1 diabetes. Have you told her "Sorry honey" yet? You should.

cubanbob said...

garage mahal said...
Your idiot, 6th grade logic is embarrassing. And if I were as stupid as you, I wouldn't be commenting.

You told me ESC research won't cure "diabetes". As an endocrinologist you surely know there are two forms of diabetes. Moving on, I asked why you thought ESC research won't cure diabetes.

Please tell us why not.

11/22/11 12:18 PM

First I'm sorry to hear about your family and diabetes. I'm also a diabetic so and have relatives and loved ones with both types.

That said, you are talking out of your ignorance when it comes to type 1 diabetes and stem cells. Type 1 diabetes is an autoimmune disease. The immune system has killed off the beta cells and continues to kill off the new cells the body tries to produce. Even if an ESC transplant were to be done successfully if it worked the odds are the immune system would still attack and destroy the beta cells produced and the patient would have the added risk of cancer.

Until such time as the triggering mechanism that results in the immune system targeting beta cells is resolved and either turned of or suppressed there isn't going to be a cure for type 1 diabetes ESC or adult stem cells notwithstanding.

Now in the interim there is work being done using encapsulated beta cells in a porous medium that enables the cell to function and produce insulin while shielded from attack.

If the underlying triggering mechanism is discovered and either shut off or suppressed then ESCs won't be needed since the pancreas is still capable of producing beta cells and it doesn't take that many to have a blood sugar regulatory effect.

gutless said...

"I love how this topic brings out the fundies all in a lather. Save the fetuses and kill the actual humans!!!"

Er, what exactly is an actual human? If you mean a bigger one, one that we can easily see, I take your point i.e. it is a social but non-scientific distinction. Maybe we can develop a list of other categories of humans that we can kill with impunity. I urge posters to makes nominations.

garage mahal said...

That said, you are talking out of your ignorance when it comes to type 1 diabetes and stem cells. Type 1 diabetes is an autoimmune disease. The immune system has killed off the beta cells and continues to kill off the new cells the body tries to produce.

You may be interested in the joint Brazilian/U.S. Study:

In the first trial of autologous nonmyeloablative hematopoietic stem cell transplantation by a joint Brazilian and American team in 2007, 14 of 15 patients – all recently diagnosed with diabetes – achieved insulin independence for periods ranging from one to 35 months. With AHST, doctors first give the patient high-dose immunosuppressant therapy, then remove the patient’s own stem cells, treat them so that they become insulin-producing beta cells, and return them to the patient. Further tests of this procedure are ongoing

Adult stem cells. Pretty amazing. Hopefully the key to this success in this aggressive therapy wasn't being treated so soon after diagnosis.

My opinion is that is incredibly shortsighted to rule out ESCR, there have been several advances, some notables such as in Spain, Germany, and Israel.


My feeling is a cure won't come from stem cells, but perhaps something like what Diane Foustman is researching. Google her if interested.

garage mahal said...

Let me repeat, ESCR is a bust

Perhaps you didn't read the link. The very first paragraph.

Scientists at the University of Wisconsin-Madison have grown human embryonic stem cells into neurons that appear capable of adapting themselves to the brain's machinery by sending and receiving messages from other cells, raising hopes that medicine may one day use this tool to treat patients with such disorders as Parkinson's and amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, commonly known as Lou Gehrig's disease.

Curious George said...

I read it. They still have the problem of rejection as has been pointed out numerous times here.

"Dear patient: We have a cure for your disease. The one side effect is it will kill you."

And as I have pointed out here, scientists have made breakthroughs in making adult stem cells pluripotent. This eliminates the rejection issue, allowing use of a patients own cells.

Here take a moment away from your "Hate Walker" blogs and read all about it.

ken in sc said...

Freeman's right. This is the plot of 'The Secrets of NIMH'.

Kirk Parker said...

"garage's brain [might] consist of ... ferrite core RAM."

Oooooohhhh, then he can be freeze-dried!

sorepaw said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Alan said...

Michael Crichton woudl have five plot ideas already if he were still with us.

Maybe a cross between Congo and Willard?

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

There goes Ann Althouse's credibility as an advocate for intelligent design.

We should never believe what the scientists tell us! They're just godless taxraisers looking for a handout.

cubanbob said...

Garage;
"In the first trial of autologous nonmyeloablative hematopoietic stem cell transplantation by a joint Brazilian and American team in 2007, 14 of 15 patients – all recently diagnosed with diabetes – achieved insulin independence for periods ranging from one to 35 months. With AHST, doctors first give the patient high-dose immunosuppressant therapy, then remove the patient’s own stem cells, treat them so that they become insulin-producing beta cells, and return them to the patient. Further tests of this procedure are ongoing"

You are mirroring what I said. Immunosuppressant therapy is exactly what organ transplants need to avoid rejection. Can it work for type 1 diabetes? There are trials that do suggest and support that with stem cells and beta cell transplants (rather difficult to do). Unfortunately immunosuppressant therapy has serious side effects among them a heightened risk of cancer along with infections. At best these are treatments (and not to diminish that especially if one is a hard type 1 diabetic) but this is not a cure.

Until the specific triggering mechanism that results in the immune system attacking the beta cells is turned off or shut down or very specifically immunosuppressed then there won't be a cure. if it is possible to do this then ESC won't be needed and indeed the patients own adult stem cells will be what is needed to restore the patient's beta cells.

Dave said...

Garage

Very sorry to hear about your daughter. Type I is much more challenging and illness in a child is very stressful on the parents and their marriage well.

I understand your position, even if I have to disagree. Scientifically ESCR might eventually be useful, no one can reasonably deny the possibility exists. However ESCR will always be a moral failure, so I put my hope in adult stem cell research. When I imagine myself in your place I can easily see the strong temptation toward any possible cure.