November 17, 2011

"Pennsylvania cops say they have no records that support Mike McQueary’s claim that he called police..."

If McQueary's credibility is bad, that undercuts his value of his eyewitness testimony:
McQueary’s testimony is a key in the grand jury’s investigation and the prosecution’s case against Sandusky, and any discrepancies in his testimony and public statements are sure to be used against him by defense lawyers at trial. The New York Times reported Wednesday night on its website that a critical break in the case came in 2010 when investigators spotted a brief mention on an Internet forum about Penn State athletics that a coach, McQueary, might have some information about the long-standing rumors of sex abuse by Sandusky. Investigators set up a meeting and McQueary told his story - a graphic account of the rape he had witnessed. ...

According to New York defense attorney Tom Harvey, who is following the case for The News, McQueary’s email claims are a “defense attorney’s dream.”

“Assuming the email is not a hoax, he’s making statements that are inconsistent with prior statements,” Harvey said.

43 comments:

traditionalguy said...

McQueary's statements are easy to reconcile and are easily both true.

So what a written record was cleansed from the local police files 10 years ago?

In college towns, the local police's first job description rule is to protect the reputation of the College. The second rule is Refer to Rule #1.

It is odd that since the leaked Grand Jury findings,every victim (and McQueary himself) are now convinced that they are in danger if exposed as the witnesses. That sounds like a lawless place without any honest police.

John Bragg said...

We haven't seen McQueary's actual grand jury testimony. Maybe he turned and walked away without saying anything. Maybe he yelled "Hey!" and that was enough to break up the rape. We don't know at this point.

We also haven't seen his actual email, only the AP's edited version with ellipses.

McCreary's email says there were "discussions with police and with the official at the university in charge of the police." The Penn State campus police say there was no police report. Does every "discussion" constitute a "report"?

Jay said...

According to New York defense attorney Tom Harvey, who is following the case for The News, McQueary’s email claims are a “defense attorney’s dream.”


Nice lack of context.

There are going to be 8 accusers testifying against Sandusky in court.

Sandusky's public statements about showering & touching young boys will also be examined and offered as evidence.

Tom Harvey isn't sounding so smart.

Beth said...

This is also more evidence of a poorly functioning prosecutor's office. They should have McQueary on a tight leash, with clear instructions to just shut the hell up until trial.

Thomas said...

He said he had discussions with police, not that he reported it. The New York Times report confirms his claim that he had discussions, but doesn't allow us to draw the inference McQueary wanted us to draw (that the discussions were roughly contemporaneous with the crime instead of 8 years later).

Carol_Herman said...

Who killed the DA?

Gricar (the dead DA), closed out the Sandusky case back in 1998.

Sandusky didn't change. (Pedophiles DON'T!) Pedophiles look for political power ... and in the most adverse renditions. Like the Vatican's vault. Lawyers go for the money.)

Did you know Penn State's Law School just sent out waiver notices to applicants ... that they can apply to Penn State's Law School FREE OF CHARGE?

In the past, every applicant had to come up with $60, which got attached to the application. Whether the school accepted them. Or not.

Penn State can't recruit top talent!

Will there be a new coach from the outside? Sure looks like the Board of Trustees of the school are aiming to clean house!

Now, back to my first question. Whom did the dead DA call ... with information that he had secreted onto his laptop's hard drive. No. He didn't expect that he'd get killed. And, his body would "disappear." He went to someone.

SPANIER?

PATERNO?

The political strength of Paterno, in Hidden Valley, AND at the school, was ABSOLUTE.

What will Patreno do? My guess is he'll do an OJ. He'll spend the rest of his life, looking for the real killer. And, swearing "horseplay" ... is "normal." (He asked his priest.)

Amartel said...

Or maybe the report was "lost" by the local cops. In this case, anything seems possible.

edutcher said...

Because McQueary didn't call the cops doesn't mean his testimony can be easily challenged. All the prosecutor has to do is get him to admit he kept quiet because of his loyalty to The Program.

Michael K said...

I wouldn't be talking about a defense attorney's "dream" with all those accusers.

Jay said...

This NYT article is a good read:

select members of the charity’s board of directors were alarmed to learn recently that when the records facility went to retrieve them, some of those records — from about 2000 to 2003 — were missing.



They are trying to demonstrate Sandusky used charity funds to give these boys gifts and now some of the travel and expense reports can not be found.

themightypuck said...

The vagueness in the email suggests lying unless McQueary is under some legal obligation to keep his mouth shut.

Carol_Herman said...

Emails, released by someone else; claiming to be a "friend." Are just hearsay.

I'm not so sure it would even be allowed into court.

IF there's a day this "goes to court."

The rug the "charity" has is HUGE. There are some very nervous "big time perverts" ... who will use their clout to bury the claims.

What's not to their advantage?

Somehow, the grand jury records that were supposed to be sealed ... got distributed via the Internet. Because of some wrong "button pushing?"

If McQueary thinks he's gonna coach next year, he's wrong!

One new head coach, willing to come in. (And, knowing the GOLD MINE that exists in college sports) ... will bring in all his own staff! He'd never trust Paterno's people! He could get killed and his body would disappear!

I think McQueary, through his friend, was hoping he'd land on his feet coaching elsewhere.

Instead? He could try HELL!

Don't forget the victim is now 24. And, he knows it wasn't "horseplay!"

More witnesses, in fact, are coming forward, because that's also something all this publicity blew in.

Those pedophiles aren't feared as they once were.

Meanwhile, except for the shock of it all. And, the reactions pedophilia breeds ... It didn't breed this among the Greeks or the Romans. Is it true if a kid is butt fucked his life is screwed?

Don't kids do all sorts of sexualized play acting? What does it mean when the governor said the "charity" GROOMED certain kids?

That the butt fucking isn't done randomly.

How come in the old days ... the Greeks and Romans had no trouble at all displaying this perversion?

Did Paterno know about the secrets? Were "keeping secrets" part of his gold mine?

Titus said...

I normally don't like red heads but I would do McQueary.

J Scott said...

The guy is clearly trying to protect his reputation with Clintonian lying. The guy has been pilloried about his non-reaction to witnessing a rape and is trying to confuse the issue to defend himself.

"I did stop it, not physically ... but made sure it was stopped when I left that locker room"

Semantically, this is meaningless.

MayBee said...

Very few reports contain the actual wording of the email, but it's possible he's referring to talking to the official who was in charge of campus police. That's in the grand jury report.

MayBee said...

... you are the first person I have told this ... and I don't know you extremely well ... and I have been told bye officials to not say anything ...

I did stop it, not physically ... but made sure it was stopped when I left that locker room ... I did have discussions with police and with the official at the university in charge of police .... no one can imagine my thoughts or wants to be in my shoes for those 30-45 seconds ... trust me.

Do with this what you want ... but I am getting hammered for handling this the right way ... or what I thought at the time was right ... I had to make tough impacting quick decisions.

This is off record ... again ... I have not and will not say anything to anyone else.


Obviously he wrote this hoping it would get out. He says he "had discussions" with police, which seems more weasley than saying he reported it to the police.

DADvocate said...

You're assuming the police's crediblity and record keeping is impeccable, which is far from the truth. Yes, it weakens mcQuary's testimony, but I wouldn't be surprised is the police made sure there was not record of mcQuery's report when he made it. State College didn't want anything shining a bad light on JoePa.

Delayna said...

(Longer, but more nuancedly ragey comment lost in intertubes accident.)

Hope McQueary hears that kid's cries for the rest of his life. The d-bag should've grabbed a cluebat and sent Sandusky to the hospital. At least. I don't know what I would have done, but "berserker rage" is the general category.

glenn said...

There is a huge establishment trying to protect itself here. Millions of dollars, lofty positions, and grand reputations at stake. Look for information. misinformation, disinformation, lies, distortions, and the occasional nugget of truth. And we haven't even started bashing the victims or throwing the uninvolved under the bus yet. But soon kiddies, soon.

Spread Eagle said...

Who killed the DA?

Gricar (the dead DA), closed out the Sandusky case back in 1998.


He disappeared in 2005. Why 7 years later? Maybe the 2002 shower incident came to his attention and he was preparing to reopen the case. Rank conjecture, but that's the only thing that makes sense.

MadisonMan said...

The d-bag should've grabbed a cluebat and sent Sandusky to the hospital. At least. I don't know what I would have done, but "berserker rage" is the general category.

I've also been under the impression that he did nothing to stop the rape, but that's only because stopping it is not in the GJ report, and it occurs to me that absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. It only says he left immediately. So I may owe him an apology for thinking so little of him -- that he wouldn't stop a rape. That they both saw him was possibly enough.

I still think he failed in the follow-through after reporting what he saw.

Delayna said...

"I still think he failed in the follow-through after reporting what he saw."

Thanks, Madison Man. I agree. It's hard for me to be rational in this discussion. Any news story about someone hurting kids makes me grind my teeth.

WV: nessi. That's what I saw, honest! My camera malfunctioned and the pictures didn't come out.

Unknown said...

In his e-mail McQueary did not say which police department he discussed what he saw. The State College, PA police department has jurisdiction over the town of State College, not the university. PSU has its own police department with jurisdiction over the university.

The newspaper account I saw headlined "Cops say they have no record of coach's call" Near the end of the story the source from the State College PD is quoted as saying that if his department had been notified, it would have referred the caller to the PSU police.

Widely Seen said...

While there will presumably be a legal and orderly process to deal with the accused folks. Clearly, not enough is being done to punish the non-perpetrators in this matter. The frenzy is incomplete until the NCAA steps in and requires expurgation of words and symbols from the set: "Penn[sylvania] State Football Coach Sandusky".
First, the football team uniform colors have to be based on scarlet and sackcloth [home] or ashes [away] with a large scarlet 'P' on the helmets...
Second, the position of 'football coach' will be eliminated and replaced with 'football penitent'.

glenn said...

"He disappeared in 2005. Why 7 years later?"

One explanation might be that in 1998 he thought he had agreements from all concerned that Sandusky would be denied easy access to young boys. And became aware that he had been hustled by Penn State and Second Mile. So he committed suicide. I mean it is pretty clear that the authorities (all of 'em) got hustled. Whether Sandusky did it all on his own or whether he had help from the Penn State/Second Mile establishments or whether the authorities wanted to be hustled because the were part of that establishment, who knows. Or it could be that some case he was investigating in 2005 got him killed.

PaulV said...

Why did prosecuter refuse to charge in 1998 is a bigger question,

Hagar said...

This is not going away at this point, so I would suggest that everybody hold their horses until we get sorted out what happened and who did, or did not, do what, when, why, and how.

MayBee said...

So I may owe him an apology for thinking so little of him -- that he wouldn't stop a rape. That they both saw him was possibly enough.


Perhaps. Although it doesn't say he watched Sandusky leave. So it's possible he just paused the rape. We don't know. Still, better than quietly closing the door.

madAsHell said...

Why was McQueary still coaching at Penn State?

I dunno....I think I would have taken a baseball bat to Sandusky, called police, and then found a new job.

David said...

It just gets worse.

The cops have no record. Ok. Does that mean there was no call? Of course it does not.

So, either (1) McQueary is lying or mistaken, (2) the cops are lying, (3) the cops got a call but did not log it (why?), (4) the call was logged and later deleted from the record (i) in accord with records retention policy or (ii) in violation of records retention policy . . . . etc etc.

The only thing clear here is that one of the prosecution's principal witnesses is now compromised. How badly is not clear.

Who is going to investigate the police, the prosecutors and the trustees in this case?

David said...

I don't get all the McQueary bashing here.

He was 23 years old in 1998.

He saw an incident which he claims he stopped. This was, I believe, fairly late in the evening.

That night he called his Dad because he did not know what to do. A wise and understandable move.

Next day he told Paterno what he had seen. Paterno was his boss, and Paterno told his bosses. (Presumably McQuery knew this, because he then had conversations with other officials.)

We don't know a lot of details and there are some important gaps, but this sounds to me like a young man who tried to do the right thing, and then foolishly trusted others (more senior, more experienced and more powerful) to deal with it properly.

Did he ever ask about how the case was resolved? Was he ever told? Did he question why Sandusky was still around years later? These are all good questions about McQuery's conduct, but we have no idea of what the answers to these questions are.

As for the email, we do not know who the recipient was or what McQuery's motives were, harsh conclusions here to the contrary.

Did McQueary "discuss" the matter with police? A good bet might be that he did and he cops made no record of the conversation.

Final question: were there never any rumors about all of this? No suspicions? No leaks? And were members of the board of trustees just blissfully ignorant of these whispers, if they got whispered.

My policy on this story is to believe no one until more information comes out, preferably under oath. Even then it's going to be hard to determine the truth of the cover up. The truth of Sandusky's guilt or innocence may be easier to discern, but we have been burning witches for many centuries in this country.

mccullough said...

Sandusky's statements to Bob Costas killed any chance of any acquittal.

Sandusky will commit suicide before trial and Paterno will be dead in a year or two and this will be over. This is how they roll in Happy Valley

Carol_Herman said...

Actually, McQueary had a fear that he'd come up dead. Like Gricar.

And, all the records would go missing, too.

The carrot, added to this stick, was that McQueary got an actual coaching slot at Penn State! All he had to do was "stay on the good side of Paterno." Which meant being "nice" to Sandusky.

ABSOLUTE POWER is what Paterno had.

Even though his coaching skills were far behind him. And, even after a Wisconsin player ... broke his left leg. Because Paterno was on the side lines ... DURING PLAY ... And, no longer had the wits ... not the power to move his body. OUT OF THE WAY!

You don't think there's plenty of money, now, gambling that revenge can be taken against the State's governor?

The media, when Bob Costas shows up to interview Sandusky. Or a "friend's email" drops into the bucket at the NY Times ... You don't think it's Paterno's PR skills that are running this interference?

It's only a matter of time before a new coach arrives AND CLEANS HOUSE!

The size of the GOLD MINE, however, will never be disclosed.

And, you just never know ... but between getting arrested. Being charged. Etc. There won't be "someone" willing to spill the beans on where the dead DA's body disappeared to ... Then you're just not counting on "self-preservation" trumping what was once Peterno's "absolute power."

Maybe, ahead there will be movies where the CIA ain't da' bad guys. But it could expose da' bad guys in Happy Valley.

Would you apply to Penn State's Law School this year? Even if they've waived their $60 application fee?

Oh, by the way. The Grand Jury report is 23 pages long. And, I've seen it on the Internet. I even sent friends the link. And, I bookmarked the site.

Carol_Herman said...

The NY Times published the grand juror's report.

I don't know how to create a link. But I copied the "address." So if you haven't seen the grand juror's report, before. You can use this "http" address.

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2011/11/06/sports/ncaafootball/20111106-pennstate-document.html

E.M. Davis said...

Carol:

(a href="URL")Words for people to click.(/a )

Replace ( with < and ) with >.

See here.

E.M. Davis said...

Of course Blogger could make it easier, but they're hell bent on leather keeping this user interface from 2003.

glenn said...

And the worst part of this whole thing is I surf on a 2.5 lb netbook and I don't think it's going to survive the inevitable trip to the wall across the room.

MayBee said...


He was 23 years old in 1998.

He saw an incident which he claims he stopped. This was, I believe, fairly late in the evening.


Hey may have been 23 in 1998, but this incident happened in 2002.

Ralph L said...

He still left a 10 year old with a man who'd just buggered him. That boy didn't testify, so he (and the prosecutors) may not have even learned his name. I hope the boy now has the courage to come forward. What are the chances his identity would remain secret if he did testify at trial?

glenn said...

And Ralph L that's one of the main problems with this case. The tightly interwoven connections between Penn State and Second Mile make it inevitable that massive pressure is going to be applied to every victim not to come forward. Like I said before there are big reputations and big paychecks on the line. Jobs for sportswriters as well. PennLive has a great story detailing the connections and naming the fundraisers/board bembers/contributors. Gotta be some very uncomfortable people around Penn Stata right now. And some reporters who are going to be feeling the heat.

MayBee said...

I understand people who aren't mad at McQueary.

But I do think it's important that we keep it our goal to always do the very most right thing, even when it's hard. If we are too willing to make excuses for others who do too little, we are really just preparing ourselves to do too little if we are ever called to action.

We now have the benefit of learning from McQueary's mistakes. We certainly have the benefit of seeing what his (in)actions wrought.

cassandra lite said...

It's Pennsylvania. Wouldn't put it past the state police or a.g.'s office to sanitize the record. Wouldn't surprise me either if the guy didn't actually call. Nothing would surprise me.

lgv said...

I think we all understand that "no record" doesn't mean it didn't happen. He likely had a discussion with the head of the police department who would take care of it.

I just got back from 3 weeks in Indonesia. The story got a half page in the Jakarta Post.

I've always been ambivalent about Paterno. I spent two of the happiest years of my life there. But, having been a Teaching Assistant, I could tell you the whole academic standards thing is a bit of a sham. I have many funny/tragic stories about Joe's student-athlete failures.

Paterno is so culpable in this whole scenario. When I read of students rioting, I was shocked to learn that it was IN SUPPORT of Paterno. Yes, a man who does great and selfless things 80% of the time can outdone by the 20%.

Paterno will be remembered for this great failure...and he should.