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Mayor Nutter's speech is a good start, but it's a deep hole to get out of.
Until black men start marrying black women and raising their black children to differentiate between right and wrong, nothing will change.Thinking that it takes a village is utter bullshit.
Excellent and brave stance by Nutter. The vernacular looses a bit, doesn't it, when in print? I suppose that's true for anyone's vernacular though.It will be interesting to watch what other black leaders make of all this, in particular the usual suspects ("SUSPECTS"??? YOU BIGOT).WV - "couns" I shit you not.
Mayor Nutter is quality (as Trump would say). He was a strong supporter of Hillary in 2008 until the very end. He was not overly impressed with Obama. I wonder why (sarcasm alert).
A very illuminating conversation in which the two highly educated men embrace victimhood. Couple of suggestions, gentlemen. 1. To lower the incarceration of millions of black men raise your black boys to respect the law. 2. Join with Mayor Nutter in condemning racist violence instead of suggesting that it is justified. These rationalizations for criminality have lost their power in the society at large and the average person is aware that if flash mobs of white people joined to attack blacks we would be having an entirely different conversation. These two are the problem.
Oh, and if the police presence in the black "community" offends because they nab people for things that people in a white "community" would not be nabbed for then send the police our way. I would be happy to have enough police to give citations to assholes riding bikes on the sidewalk, Glenn. Get over it. If you want chaos in your "community" Glenn then perhaps trying it out with no police at all. I think the good citizens of your "community" might feel differently because they are the ones getting daily abuse from the slime.
Random groups of blacks cluster together and beat up whites. This is because white cops treat blacks as potential criminals. Until such time as white cops treat blacks as citizens and not as criminals, blacks should continue to break the law......The good professor lives in a predominantly white neighborhood because he knows that if the criminals pull him over they will ask for more than just his ID. The maid for DSK lived in a country where it was not uncommon for citizens to be gang raped by members of their army. Whatever is the cause of the variance between black and white crime rates, it is not racism. To claim it is is, in fact, racism.
Who decided to call this stuff "flash mobs"? When people here flash mob, they mostly think of a bunch of people riverdancing in train stations, not beating people to death.
Liberals have devoted half a century to excusing the most abhorrent behavior and never the fault if the perpetrator. It's always someone else's fault, society, poverty, Daddy was mean to him etc. We have generations of people who have grown up under that mentality and now we act shocked, shocked! that our youths are running amok.
Clearly what is needed is more Federal funding, universal health care and more subsidized housing because that model has worked so well in places like England.
Great speech, but this has been building since the federal government green lighted permanent income for unwed mothers 45+ years ago. Moynihan blew the whistle on this in his seminal "Defining Deviancy Down" in 1993 (although many recognized this long before '93). So, it's too late. At the leading edge of Western Liberal thought, civilization begins to crumble. These problems now transcend race, and what was isolated in the Black community has spread to all lower income groups. Liberals have so much to be proud of, eh?
Interesting conversation.Instead of blaming the real cause: 4 generations of liberal policies which have created a welfare dependent society, destroyed the nuclear family, created a culture of victims in order to keep them voting for liberals, produced generations of illiterate unemployable people and glorified drugs and crime.....They focus on the police, perhaps not unjustifiably, and wallow some more in victimhood.How, can we fix this problem without bloodshed, when these two intelligent and thoughtful men still want to dance around the obvious?
"He is a disgrace to his race"I hate that phrase as much as I hate:"He is a credit to his race"If a white person said it we would be appropriately outraged.If a fair haired person said: "She is a credit to her hair color" we'd say "WTF!"The statement presupposes assigned qualities to one's skin color. It is absurd; its it wrong; (dare I say it though the word has lost its meaning)it is racist(PS: Formatting from the Carol_Herman School of Blog Commentary.)
Nutter is viewed negatively here in Negadelphia aka the Philly area. But I give him credit for doing this. And now I am waiting for a big mouth like Charles Barkley to speak out.
What AllenS and Michael said.The irony is that Philadelphia had a mayor like that who would not have tolerated it for a second.His name was Frank Rizzo.And many hear remember what the Lefties thought of him.But that's what's needed now.Phil 3:14 said...(PS: Formatting from the Carol_Herman School of Blog Commentary.)Classes available online or in a convenient location near you.
In many respects, African-Americans suffer from the same kind of false leadership that Arabs suffer from.(I speak of the African-Americans that the main stream media have anointed as "leaders." Folks like Sharpton and Jackson.)The leaders profit greatly from their positions, and keep their constituents mollified by feeding them a constant stream of grievances and excuses and blame of others. And so we have whole groups of African-Americans that are ill equipped to live and prosper in today's society. But they sure know who to blame (and it isn't themselves.)Just as you have whole nations of Arabs that can't seem to economically rise in the 21st century economy.
This extremely well-written article about the riots in the U.K. sums up the motives and root causes of these flash mobs. It also gives some hints on how to turn it around. How did we travel so far from common sense? Listen to the Children (Whoot! My first hyperlink)
The first step to Obama's slide downhill, came when he said "the cop in Cambridge Acted Stupidly."Blacks aren't going to get sympathy for their gang-banging teenagers. And, yes. The Black community has "outliers" who are intelligent. And, some really dumb black kids. Usually don't make it to 20. Because they're killed by other black kids. It's not the cops.It's not that Loury got arrested just going from his building with his bicycle ... "only to the curb." Among other things, he probably had ID on him that he could have shown to the cop. And, after the citation ... he could have brought lots of weight down on the cop's head.We saw the same thing when Officer Calhoun JUST MADE UP WISCONSIN LAW ... and got caught on tape saying to Chris Althouse, that he could be arrested for BEING THE VICTIM OF A CRIME. Only he didn't phrase it that way.I love McWorter. I know how bright he is. Because I've read his books.I also know the black yoot prey on their own folk. The older they are, the better. Stealing is a game with them.And, the jail statistics prove you're picking up problems from the inhabitants "of the village." Just as you are from the Religion of Peace.Meanwhile, Muhammad Ali visited Africa. When he was the world's greatest heavy weight champ. And, when he got back to America he aid "I'm sure glad my grand-pappy got on dat boat."Oh, in November 2012, whom do you think America's black communities go and vote for? Give a percentage. Meanwhile, I always thought if you found a black violent yoot with a cell phone, the first call the cops make is to social services. And, the family checks STOP! (Ditto, if they're in $125 pairs of Nike's.) STOP THE MONEY.NO FREE MONEY!Let the churches get the money ... to feed their flock. They'll cull.
If you want to meet a community that really hates the blacks, you should just listen to the Hispanics!I can even remember to one conversation (at Pasadena Community College) ... where a Hispanic kid was telling me how stupid the Blacks are. And, he used as his example a drug deal.Blacks get caught with it. Hispanics? NOPE. They only give you a location ... where you, yourself, have to go, and retrieve the envelope.So, go ahead. Blame whites. But Blacks aren't making it even into the Religion of Peace.When riots break out (like they did in London?) You get white kids joining in BECAUSE IT IS FUN!Then, in England. They posted the pictures of the looters. One was a gal who had been chosen to represent the Olympics. Another, was the daughter of a "Lord" or a "Duke." With aristocratic credentials.While the police across America have their hands full.Putting the testosterone "yoots" in prison till they pass the age of 25, actually makes the streets safer in the ghettos!And, some of the judges are Black women, too. They're not shy of incarcerating the ANIMALS.
Nothing will change until a black child who yearns to read and write is not an object of scorn and derision, and can walk the streets proudly, instead of afraid for his life.
Yes, their framework for analysis is victimhood, and I don't think that's valid any more. At least McW admitted that the mobbers are not political in the least.Re the bicycle: I live in a white neighborhood, and recently for 3 days I watched the police ticket people right and left for minor infractions. One squad car parked down a side street and swooped out every five minutes to ticket someone who didn't stop long enough at a stop sign. I got a $109 fine for crossing the street too slowly!Glenn, how much was your ticket? The police were doing what all police are doing now--making money to prop up city and pension finances by fining people who look respectable and won't fight back.
The heroin overdose.Back when I was working at Kings County Hospital. There was a black guy who ran the candy franchise in the psychiatric building. Nobody wanted to deal with him. Because they thought they'd get killed, if he got angry.Then, one day, I go to work. And, I hear about the overdosed kid. Brought in the night before. 18. His dad was this guy. And, the kid was "just home from college."The emergency room staff knew the kid was dead ... but they kept working on him for an extra half hour ... because they were terrified the dad would "lose his cool."I remember going to the funeral. (Mid 1970's).Here's my point: Some Black kids with every opportunity in the world, come home for a school break ... and load up on heroin ... to get through the "visit!"Man. I was shocked then. But I'm shocked no more.
WV: "GRACI"Why, yes. Thank you.
The police were doing what all police are doing now--making money to prop up city and pension finances by fining people who look respectable and won't fight back. Seriously. What does he think "seatbelt tickets" are for? I got stopped in the B&N parking lot one day after I stopped at a spot where there was no stop sign because the cop was just sitting in the middle of the road doing nothing. Then when I realized he wasn't actually driving, I pulled out. On came the lights. Him: "Do you knwo why I pulled you over?"Me: "No clue"Him: "I thought if I wasn't there you wouldn't have stopped"Me: "Well, as there was no stop sign, if no one was coming no I would not have stopped. Am I supposed to stop when there is no stop sign and no one coming?"Him: "You should be nicer to cops"Me: Head explodes. Needless to say, I did not get a ticket, but sometimes cops are jerks. It's not just to black folks.
Wait a minute.The guys name is Nutter?
In the middle of the conversation is the phrase, "I'm gonna fuck me up some white people." And they chuckle a bit.This is followed by blaming white cops in the neighborhood, harassing them.What else is there to say?They cannot see what is right in front of them.They cannot see what it is they just said.As Obama's economy tanks further, this is going to get really really ugly.
As Obama's economy tanks further, this is going to get really really ugly.Maybe I'm skittish, but I agree. This could get real ugly real fast.
I'm sick of hearing the phrase "African-American." Until black men start marrying black women and raising their black children to differentiate between right and wrong, nothing will change.Segregation now! Segregation forever! That's always the answer for some people,...I'm sick of America and race altogether. Fuck all y'all.
I enjoy John & Glenn diavlogs, and I've sometimes scoured the old ones for things they've observed about academia, their ongoing trepidations about Obama's flaws, etc. I watched this whole spisode yesterday, and I had some disappointment. Glenn has a sharp and pessimistic eye for the things in society that a conservative critic should relish. At the same time, he wants to double-down on old fashioned liberalism. I take it he had some kind of mid-life conversion to the Left, which is really weird. They've both made their share of remonstrances in the past over contemporary urban black youth behavior and attitudes, but in this one they didn't hold the fort exactly. Glenn prophesies a crackdown here if there's London-style chaos, but then backs off condemning perps for bringing it on themselves. John seems to think you can reason with some of these hardcore sociopaths, and doesn't ask the vital question: what's Deshon gonna say to *him*? Probably something pretty nasty, possibly adding battery.
I am with Crack. Fuck y'all. Especially those of you who are good looking women!
Crack: I was right there in the late 1960s when a choice was made to follow the easy path of Malcolm versus the hard path of Martin. Malcolm said fuck that integration stuff you have a culture that is wonderful on its own, you don't have to emulate the man, you don't have to talk like the man. Martin saw something else. The choice was made, the hyphen inserted, the die cast. You can whine all you want about the way you would like it to be. We all can. But the choice was made forty years ago. This is the result of that choice. Live with it, dude.
How about running out of the store and locking the doors and calling the cops? Save time and trouble in rounding up the mod. Call it a Flash Booking.
Chris Rock is a Back comedian.He lived in the ghetto. And, he talked about coming out his front door. And, to both the left and right of him, the "upkeep" of property was rather low.He didn't blame anyone sitting in his audience. Instead, he just made them laugh.Not all Black "yoots" are gang-bangers, or gang-members, either. Just the most stupid ones.It's like assorting the IQ levels of those within the ghetto.And, most of the people who call the ghetto home ... are very much aware of being targets of their lunatic fringe.Eventually, the testosterone levels off. What's really happening, meanwhile, is that lots of those teenagers are unemployed.Because they're unemployable by most standards.Illiteracy doesn't help.Their schools are for the birds.
I'm sick of America and race altogether. Fuck all y'all.Crack, has NOT been a credit to his race today.
Fuckin' a, man. I'm sick of people who are sick of America.
Racism is the nail and most Blacks think like hammers."I'm gonna fuck me up some white people." would be a winning campaign slogan in my district.
This is nothing new. I remember vividly when Mayor Dinkins held back the police response so the “community” could “vent.” Lemrick Nelson. Yankel Rosenbaum. This is nothing new. We are just lucky nobody got killed. Yet.
I usually enjoy listening to those guys and this was no exception. But John has got what Glenn misses. I think Glenn fell prey to a little "blame whitey" opium. It is SO tempting, but not at ALL helpful.The best predictor of incarceration is coming from a single parent home with no dad. The next best one is having siblings from other fathers who are also not involved.The government's involvement in that problem is deep, certainly, they are complicit in supporting and subsidizing single parent homes. And that is kill America in general and the black population in particular.Whitey can't fix that. Only self control and wise choices will fix that. Sadly, the topic is taboo, so there is no cultural impetus in that direction. But John is close!Trey
T Mink: The big "predictor" of incarceration is criminal behavior displayed repeatedly before finally being caught. This is all just so fucking sad.
"Who decided to call this stuff 'flash mobs'? When people here flash mob, they mostly think of a bunch of people riverdancing in train stations, not beating people to death."Flash crowd vs. flash mob.
I want to go up to D'Shawn Gordon and punch him right in the face. That guy pisses me off.
Michael,The choice was made, the hyphen inserted, the die cast.MLK never gave no hyphen speech, you fucking idiot.I'm as American as you are - no hyphen needed - you let me know when that can get through that thick skull of yours and then, and only then, will MLK's dream be fulfilled.Gawd, you people can be either struck dumb, or willing to twist yourselves into pretzels, over MY skin color. It's fucking sick.
Crack,When you finally realize that nobody cares what your skin color is, is when you, oh, fuck it, you'll never understand.
Until black men start marrying black women and raising their black children,....No, Allen, you're not concerned with it at all,...
Concentrate on this:nobody cares what your skin color isI wasn't talking about you. But, you were the one pointing out your skin color.When this post started, this conversation wasn't about you.YOU made it about you.You don't seem very comfortable with your own skin.That's your problem, not mine.
AllenS said... Concentrate on this:nobody cares what your skin color isI wasn't talking about you. But, you were the one pointing out your skin color.I WAS TALKING ABOUT YOU!
Ok, I think I got this all figured out. If white people were to say that black kids should form big mobs and attack whites, the black kids would then choose to stay home and behave themselves.
First off, how many Black kids were involved in the "flash mob?" If they're doing the "flash mob" in their own neighborhood ... then it's the neighborhood kids ... Who gather together on hot summer nights. They don't need telephones to gather together, either.Now, if this "flash mob" needs a point outside of the usual ghetto ... how do the teenagers get there? Not on bicycles. Not in cars. And, even if they're using buses ... How many can get on one bus at one bus stop?It boggles the mind that this even has anything to do with cell phones!I can remember reading someplace ... that the black kids in DC ... are cooped into because there's a freeway that cuts out one exit point. And, then? DC is designed in a circle. Black kids couldn't even find the White House! Or the Mall with its monuments!Sure, I was surprised to read that.Because DC has its tourist attractions. (Which get well policed. And, so the ghetto kids are probably terrified to go there. Where they'd get harassed. Plus, they wouldn't even know where to run. Because the streets are designed in circles.)Now.Here's another truth: Black women would love to wear wedding dresses!And, there's higher attendance in Black neighborhood churches than anywhere else in America ... That's why the Mayor of Philly was addressing his own congregation! Most other places ... if anyone gets up to talk ... you gets lots of echo. Plus, the doors of some churches lock, because of the homeless.You don't have to be Black to be homeless!Man, I love McWorter. He hardly got a word in edgewise. Loury is full of horse shit, though. (Reminds me of the "Scholar Gates.")
I wasn't talking about youYeah, like I'm not black. Fuck you, Allen, you're full of shit. And stop talking to me. I've had it with you.Hey, Ann, why don't you make a rule that for now on all white people on this blog will be referred to, specifically, as "white people" or "European-Americans" and never as individual Americans where their color will just be taken for granted. No more posts about AllenS, but only about "AllenS, the shit-eating white man," will do. Or "a conversation with an imagined old white shit-eater." Everyone will start to think you're insane.But to go on and on, day after motherfucking day about blacks this and African-American that is supposedly perfectly normal.You're all full of shit. That's my take on it. You've got race on the brain, as deeply ingrained as any Klansman, and, just like they do, you use it to tickle your fancy. Just because it's accepted to do so doesn't make it right.
I was just reading the Weinstein book, Perjury, about the Alger Hiss trials. At the first trial, Adlai Stevenson, two Supreme Court Justices, and a number of other Democratic Party luminaries took the stand to testify as a character witness for Hiss. There was overwhelming evidence against him, but they took the stand to establish that he was a man of the highest character. It came back to bite them in the ass. In future elections, the public remembered their support of Hiss. Their unwillingness to put distance between themselves and this spy contributed mightily to much of anti-Communism hysteria. If the Democrats had publicly denounced Hiss it would have allayed some of the electorate's worst fears.....I think there is a parallel here with the wilding teens. I don't think these punks are representative of blacks, but the failure of responsible blacks to speak out against such behavior is worrying......New Deal Democrats had a special responsibility to speak out against internal Communists. White southerners have a special obligation to speak out against the KKK and other forms of white bigotry. Like it or not, blacks who do not speak forthrightly against such behavior are perceived as tolerating or even supporting it.
Crack. You might take reading lessons along with anger management. And by the way, what you wish were the case with racial matters is not the case. And you dont have the final word on race issues because you are black either so fuck off telling me where the hyphen came from. People cut you way too much slack asshole simply because you are black.
No more posts about AllenS, but only about "AllenS, the shit-eating white man"Bummer. You have issues.
Hey Crack. I wouldn't mind if you called me "Trooper the fat pasty faced white guy."O'Tay?
Glenn Loury said "I want to advocate the idea that there is collective responsibility in the wrongful acts of individual persons. I want to say that if you create conditions in society and allow them to persist that marginalize and dehumanize people, it is to be expected, not necessarily to be deplored, that those people will act out in ways that are inconsistent with the civility and peace, and perhaps if there is no justice there ought not to be any peace.
I want to advocate the idea that the concept of collective responsibility is a reason certain groups are considered easy targets.
I like Glenn a lot but in many ways he's stuck in the 60s. Like a lot of boomers - black and white - its always 1968.Later in DV he complains about the NYC police hassling him for riding a bike on the sidewalk - and him a Liberal Arts Professor. They never would do that to Norm Chomsky, only a Black Professor. Its Watts '65 all over again.JM seems more in tune with the 21st Century on some issues.
Send some Mexicans in. That'll take care of that.
Michael,You dont have the final word on race issues because you are black either so fuck off telling me where the hyphen came from.That fucking hyphen came from that other paragon of brilliance, Jesse Jackson, you numbskull, so don't go trying to tell me what a wonderful addition it is to American life when it's just another stupid idea, by a stupid man, adopted by stupid people to achieve stupid ends, that no one intelligent ever conceived of. I am NOT an African-American. I was born and raised in Los Angeles, California. I am an American.And the fact I have to make this obvious point - along with all the other obvious "groupthink" points I make around here - is a fucking tragedy. It's just further proof this nation is run by morons. You arrogantly try to shove the most obnoxious ideas down my throat, because you have superior numbers, when you know I don't give a damn about such things:Wrong is wrong, and the fact a majority of you bow to it will never make it right.
Crack. Take it up with Jesse. Take it up with Glenn. Take it up with whoever you like but be advised that white people are just tryibg to be nice by going along with whatever fucking name your race has demanded to be called. But dont wail on me about it. I spent four years of my life in a deep south college that deemed itself an historically black college for reasons that were apparent. This was in the late 60s. I wont be lectured to by some dipshit from California on racial mstters so quit trying.
Michael, I wont be lectured to by some dipshit from California on racial mstters so quit trying.Oh yes, you will. All being from California means is I wasn't raised in the hot house mental ward that you losers think is the beginning and the end of the conversation. You don't win no brownie points for going to school in the south. Shit, it seems like all you got from the experience is how NOT to think outside of the racial box:There is absolutely no reason for any American to be using a hyphen, and I don't have to consult with anybody to know or say it. And I don't give a fuck if you're "trying to be" nice - use your fucking head, asshole, that would not only actually "be" nice but it would also "be" a welcome change. Sixty, you've just become Allen's buttboy, so I'm done talking to you, too. Got shoot some "blacks" and hang them on your wall for your Kenyan relatives to admire, O.K.?
Crack. I didnt go to school in the south, i taught school in the south. Your south LA Compton looks like Beverly Hills, dude compared to where i was and where my students grew up. The hyphen comes from a "community" of people who have willingly detatched themselves from the rest of the country because they have been led to believe and have accepted that they cannot compete on an equal basis. This wasnt the white mans choice it was, and is, the choice of the black "community.". Go fix it if you are so bent out of shape by it. Pop over to Oakland and give them a piece of your mind. And any "racism" you experienced growing up in California would compare to Glenn's bicycle riding on the sidewalk while black as a form of hideous racist fascist behavior. Bullshit. When and where i grew up a black woman could not go to the zoo unless she was accompanied by a white child. You might avail yourself of the history of that period and note that there is no such literature on the horrors of the California ghetto.
Michael,Crack. I didnt go to school in the south, i taught school in the south. Your south LA Compton looks like Beverly Hills, dude compared to where i was and where my students grew up.I know, dumbshit, that was *the point* of leaving,...
The hyphen comes from a "community" of people who have willingly detatched themselves from the rest of the country because they have been led to believe and have accepted that they cannot compete on an equal basis. This wasnt the white mans choice it was, and is, the choice of the black "community.". Go fix it if you are so bent out of shape by it. Pop over to Oakland and give them a piece of your mind.Hey, genius educator, if you know "the hyphen comes from a "community" of people who have willingly detatched themselves from the rest of the country" then what the fuck are you arguing with me for? Jesus, you're stupider than I thought, and that's saying a lot.
And any "racism" you experienced growing up in California would compare to Glenn's bicycle riding on the sidewalk while black as a form of hideous racist fascist behavior. Bullshit. When and where i grew up a black woman could not go to the zoo unless she was accompanied by a white child.You dummy, I'm the guy always saying to shut up about the shit. Again - who do you think you're talking to?
You might avail yourself of the history of that period and note that there is no such literature on the horrors of the California ghetto.I don't have to, douchebag, I was raised by a group of former slaves and sharecroppers. I went to sleep to stories of slavery and woke to a workload, based on that past, that would make many white kids gasp. Dude, save your attempts to one-up me because you can't - I'm black and you're not. None of this is academic to me. You can say "When and where i grew up a black woman could not go to the zoo unless she was accompanied by a white child." but that black woman was probably a relative of mine, who told me about it long before your dumb ass came along, so shut-the-fuck-up. As far as the California ghetto's history, look up the Crips an Bloods, dummy. There's a lot of history you're too stupid to understand.
Sixty, for the last time, we're done.I no longer answer your questions.I no longer address your posts.This is it.We're done.
I was raised by wolves. Who were you raised by, Sixty, sandpaper?
Crack: You could use some help dude. You have a pretty thin skin whatever its color. Name calling in every paragraph is silly, especially when you are dealing with someone more educated than you, who has puked up more whiskey than you have ever drunk and who is bored shitless with your stupid theories on new ageism, your crap music and thoughtless rants. I quit teaching decades ago because of dumb asses like you.
Michael,I quit teaching decades ago because of dumb asses like you.And I'm grateful on behalf of what would've been your potential students. You know, those people who know ""the hyphen comes from a "community" of people who have willingly detatched themselves from the rest of the country" but - when they say they are determined to reverse that nonsense - your brilliant ass decides to shout them down.Yes indeed, I'm glad you're as far away from them as possible.
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