July 18, 2011

"If Pawlenty was deeply annoyed to have to talk about Bachmann, a back-bencher in the state Senate when he was elected governor in 2002, who could really blame him?"

From "The Tragedy of Tim Pawlenty":
“Pawlenty has always been the establishment in Minnesota and Bachmann has always been the renegade,” says University of Minnesota political scientist Larry Jacobs. “Pawlenty thought that she was kind of a crackpot. He would roll his eyes when her name came up.” Democrat Roger Moe — the former longtime majority leader of the state Senate who lost the 2002 gubernatorial race to Pawlenty — describes his rival as “the kind of guy you can have a beer with” despite their political differences. But Moe cannot resist chuckling: “I can just tell you — I know for sure on the inside of him—that Tim Pawlenty is just seething over Bachmann. I bet they have to lock him in a room some days when he reads about her.”
Those stray quotes could be complete garbage, or, if not garbage, totally about the 2 individuals Pawlenty and Bachmann, but I can't help hearing the eternal theme of male reacting to female: The woman does not know her place. When she speaks, I hear crazy.

191 comments:

ndspinelli said...

The template is pretty obvious regarding Republican women. They're either stupid or crazy.

TosaGuy said...

Roger Moe is also about as partisan as they come.....same vein as former WI Dem state senator Chuck Cvala.

TosaGuy said...

Chvala!

Chase said...

The woman does not know her place. When she speaks, I hear crazy.

The truth: The Feminist woman does not know her place. When she speaks, evil happens.

Luther said...

"The woman does not know her place."

I'd be willing to bet that is not the case in that I doubt gender has anything to do with it. Though if it were could it be religious based, knowing nothing of Pawlentys' beliefs in that regard.

Curious George said...

ndspinelli said...
The template is pretty obvious regarding Republican women. They're either stupid or crazy.

Or c*nts

Trapper Townshend said...

Immediately jumping to assume it's about gender. This is not like you. You usually snidely point out when others do this (usually liberals).

If you have some evidence that this is a gender thing, provide it.

Mark O said...

You left out Tom Dooley and the eternal triangle.

Fred4Pres said...

I like that she is tiny. That must annoy him too.

Of course this is all presss silliness. They wanta to make a fight personal so they can run with tha story that people care about. Because Pawlenty is not that compelling on his own.

Pawlenty is not a bad politican. Arguably he might be the best candidate in the field right now to take on Obama. Pawlenty needs to sell himself. Bachmann is not the issue. Pawlenty is the issue.

bearing said...

Agreed that the gender template doesn't fit here. The two individuals have very different public personalities.

As a Minnesota conservative with much sympathy towards many so-called Tea Party objectives, I would still much rather have Pawlenty be the face of MN conservative politics than Bachmann.

TosaGuy said...

Agree with Fred.

If you want to be president, go win it. Don't complain about the other person and how it's unfair.

Leaders make things happen.

MarkG said...

The woman does not know her place. When she speaks, I hear crazy.

You speak of him as if, by default, he has attitudes of a generation older than yours. In fact, he's 10 years younger that you.

If the "woman does not know her place" is a natural male attitude, then we should accept it as such and listen to it. Nature knows best.

Shanna said...

The woman does not know her place. When she speaks, I hear crazy.

Assuming this story is true, which is probably a rather large assumption, there are many other ways to interpret it than the one you chose. I don't know what to make of Bachmann, but so what if Pawlenty found her kind of annoying. That's not really a big deal.

MayBee said...

I do think she often sounds like a bit of a crackpot. So does Dennis Kucinich.
Is that a gender thing? Or a kind of crackpot thing?

Condi Rice never sounded like a crackpot.

garage mahal said...

When she speaks, I hear crazy.

When Bachmann is asked a question, she goes into a trance and answers the question she wished she was asked.

Greg Toombs said...

The template is pretty obvious regarding Republican women. @ndspinelli

Male Republican candidates fail to realize this is what Democrats and the MSM (BIRM) say about them every election cycle. So when they say this about Bachmann or Palin or whomever is next, they help their enemy's meme gain strength.

Terry said...

I very much doubt that any Minnesota GOP person cares much about what Jab's thinks:

Lawrence R. Jacobs is the Walter F. and Joan Mondale Chair for Political Studies and Director of the Center for the Study of Politics and Governance in the Hubert H. Humphrey Institute and Department of Political Science at the University of Minnesota. He received his Ph.D. from Columbia University and B.A. from Oberlin College.
Lawrence R. Jacobs research examines political representation – the nature and formation of public opinion, whether and how government responds to the public’s policy preferences and other evaluations, and the adaptation of government policy to the changing conditions and circumstances facing Americans. In 12 books and dozens of scholarly articles, Dr. Jacobs has investigated public deliberation and public attitudes toward inequality and social welfare policy; the disconnect of government officials from public policy preference and their efforts to compensate by crafting personality-based appeals; policy making by American presidents (including Barack Obama) and the impacts of institutional and political forces on their decisions; and the formulation and development of health care policy in the United States and other countries.
His articles have been published in such outlets as the American Political Science Review, World Politics, Comparative Politics, and the New England Journal of Medicine. He recently co-led (with Theda Skocpol) a comprehensive review of the Obama administration’s policy record, Reaching for the New Deal: President Obama's Agenda and the Dynamics of U.S. Politics. His most recent books include Health Reform and American Politics (with Theda Skocpol, New York: Oxford University Press, 2010); Class War? What Americans Really Think about Economic Inequality (with Benjamin Page, Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 2009); The Unsustainable State (with Desmond King, Oxford University Press, 2009); Talking Together: Public Deliberation in America and the Search for Community (with Fay Lomax Cook and Michael Delli Carpini,University of Chicago Press, 2009); The Private Abuse of the Public Interest (with Lawrence Brown, University of Chicago Press, 2008).

jacksonjay said...

The (black) guy does not know his place. When he speaks I hear crazy. Hillary was the junior U.S. Senator from the most progressive state in the Union when Barry was voting present in Illinois. I guess it is all a matter of perspective!

Robert said...

I would also suggest that there's an element of exasperation for Pawlenty. He chose the right-wing social agenda to co-opt the Republican primary vote in 2002, and yet Bachman is out-winging the wing man because she is a true believer. Pawlenty was very much a centrist legislator under Governor Carlson. (For example, he voted to add gays to the protections of the Minnesota Human Rights Act after Carlson lobbied him, and he voted for tax increases.) And this is how he gets repaid for his "loyalty" to the base??? More info at the link:
http://www.minnpost.com/community_voices/2011/06/28/29522/tim_pawlenty_the_manufactured_candidate

Rick said...

Greg: What makes you think that male candidates "fail to realize . . ."?

traditionalguy said...

It is well known that:
1) being a GOP conservative makes one into a dangerous and stupid hater of the poor and minorities, and
2)being a woman makes one into an emotionally driven servant that cannot think past her feelings to make executive decisions, unless a man who has a good mind helps her.

Add those two together and what do you get?

Femalezilla, driven insane by her inner contradictions.

This is well known.

Too bad that Pawlenty has no plan, no personality and no donors.

Shouting Thomas said...

Jesus, Althouse, when are you going to get it?

Most of us weren't born to upper middle class suburban status like you were.

The rest of us come from rock solid poverty.

The place of every man, woman and child in my family, prior to my parents' generation, was a shotgun shack in the middle of the cornfield.

Phil 3:14 said...

Did TNR do a similar story 4 years ago regarding Joe Biden and Barack Obama?

And with the same sense of "disappointment" at Joe and quiet contempt for Barack?

lyssalovelyredhead said...

The woman does not know her place. When she speaks, I hear crazy.

I have zero doubt that that attitude is part of a lot of the criticism against Bachmann (and Palin, and Herman Cain, if you sub race for sex). But I don't think that anything in that article really was enough for me to attribute that attitude to Pawlenty.

- Lyssa

Thorley Winston said...

Assuming this story is true, which is probably a rather large assumption, there are many other ways to interpret it than the one you chose. I don't know what to make of Bachmann, but so what if Pawlenty found her kind of annoying. That's not really a big deal.


I’m curious why so many people are responding to this story as if it has any basis in fact. Roger Moe and Tim Pawlenty pretty much locked horns over every major policy issue when they were the leaders of the Minnesota Senate and House respectively during the Ventura administration before they ran against each other for governor. I’d think that they’d be the last two people in the State to say “let me tell you what I really think” about another member of their own party. The story rings as false as a wedding invitation from a Frey.

G Joubert said...

Pawlenty doesn't stand a chance. Way, way, WAY too milquetoasty. You see the pussified way he "went after" Romney and Romneycare in the debate? What a wimp! He doesn't inspire anybody. He doesn't have the personality to be inspirational.

Michelle meanwhile is the real deal. That's what everybody left of center including a lot of Rinos are scared of.

Tim said...

It's only "the eternal theme of blah, blah, blah" because of the eternal reflexive need to examine events through the lens of gender.

Think, rather than feel, for yourself.

Thorley Winston said...

I would also suggest that there's an element of exasperation for Pawlenty. He chose the right-wing social agenda to co-opt the Republican primary vote in 2002

Utter nonsense. For one thing there was no Republican primary (other than a token fringe candidate who runs every four years) because Pawlenty won the endorsement at the convention and his main rival, Brian Sullivan, conceded and endorsed Tim Pawlenty. I was there for all thirteen ballots and the most socially conservative voters were pretty much for Brian Sullivan. During the convention, the only mention of social issues was a flier put out by Sullivan supporters blasting Pawlenty for his position on abortion (against it except in cases of rape, incest and to protect the life and health of the mother) which ended up backfiring when delegates realized that Pawlenty had the most palatable prolife position and Sullivan’s (against it even in cases of rape and incest) would make him unelectable in the general election.

Pawlenty ran pretty much on bread and butter economic issues as he’s doing now by going after government spending, calling for the repeal of unaffordable energy subsidies (including ethanol in Iowa), pushing for entitlement reform, supporting market-based health care reform and pushing for pro-growth economic policies.

Michael E. Lopez said...

What was said was merely that she was a backbencher.

But, fair or not, what I heard was an unspoken word in the air: You're a backbencher, girl.

Really, Professor, let's not get all Dowdy. It wasn't credible when she did it, and it doesn't get credible merely because you're smarter and more reasonable.

Greg Toombs said...

Rick - I could be wrong (!) but why would they repeatedly add fuel to the same fire that burns them?

Thorley Winston said...

As a Minnesota conservative with much sympathy towards many so-called Tea Party objectives, I would still much rather have Pawlenty be the face of MN conservative politics than Bachmann.

As would I. My doubts about Bachmann have as much to do with her lack of any executive experience and ability to sway people to adopt her agenda as her electability. The last time we elected a legislator with no executive experience or actual legislative accomplishments to the White House on the basis of their ability to appeal to their party’s base with speeches, we got the current president. I’d rather not repeat history and look for a candidate who has demonstrated their actual ability to govern.

edutcher said...

Pawlenty may or may not be a born-again Conservative. And he may or may not hate Michele Bachmann (I suspect he doesn't).

But he's definitely the poster child for "No guts, no glory". And that's nobody's fault but his.

Phil 3:14 said...

I don't go for flash in my candidates so I'm ok with Pawlenty's blandness. However, I was very disappointing in his debate performance where he backed away from his "ObamneyCare" statements.

Stick to your guns! Its a fair point. Don't come across as a candidate who will talk about "clinging to guns and religion" to a closed group and be all "lets hold hands" in a public forum

Oligonicella said...

garage mahal --

"When Bachmann is asked a question, she goes into a trance and answers the question she wished she was asked."

Kind of like the 'facts' you provide as argument?

jrd1 said...

My problem with Bachmann is that she has no executive experience. She is just as much of a crackpot as Obama to think that we should entrust running the government to someone with such a thin resume.
I believe that we must show a united front to win. I liked Bachmann partnering with Congressman Steve King to bring the Tea Party agenda front and center. I believe that was her strength. She abandoned the Tea Party for her own political gain. That's an opportunist. And, she has lost my respect and any future financial contributions.
I was never a Pawlenty fan but I would be upset with Bachmann's power play. She is not qualified. I am not a hypocrite. How can I defend Bachmann if I had the same objections to Obama.

Carol said...

Probably every state legislature has its right-wing back benchers, who speak out, make a lot of noise, and carry one right-wingy bill after another written by the various lobbyists, if their their district is safe. The bills don't have a chance in hell, but it doesn't matter. The left does the same thing. Our legislature barey functioned this year, due to all the wingy bills.

The leaders all know the game and get tired of it, I'm sure. More often than not, the back bencher is better known than the moderates who ask for little. It takes all types.

Shanna said...

I don't go for flash in my candidates so I'm ok with Pawlenty's blandness.

I am ok with blandness so long as he is firm on what’s important. You don’t have to pound the table to make the right decisions. The question is can he make himself interesting enough to get elected. I think it’s still too soon to tell.

Bachmann on the other hand seems rather green to be running for President.

William said...

This isn't a male narrative. It's a liberal one. Palin put on seven league boots and went from the kitchen table to the governor's mansion to the national stage with a speed and dexterityis that associated more with rock stars than politicians. Point out the feminist who celebrates her rise and success and independence in making her own choices. Bachmann is a woman of considerable achievement, not just professionally, but in her personal life. Point out the feminist who celebrates her virtues. If Bachmann were a liberal married to a professor with barely concealed Marxist inclinations and who had had twenty three abortions while working her way through college as a stripper, Gloria Steinhem et al. would be telling us of her grit and determination......Successful, independent women can only be successful and independent if they are liberal. Hillary Clinton is considered the apogee of feminist success, and Michele Bachmann is a flake. By their works shall you know them.

Oligonicella said...

"I can't help hearing the eternal theme"

That's been obvious for a while.

I'm a Shaaaaark said...

When I hear Bachmann speak, I think "Hmmm... Me... the meat in the Bachmann/Palin sandwich..."

rhhardin said...

Bachmann is going to have to lose the eyeshadow.

garage mahal said...

Kind of like the facts you provide as argument?

Sure. What's wrong with facts?

Scott M said...

Bachmann is going to have to lose the eyeshadow.

Negative. She needs to crank up The Cure, add MORE eyeshadow, and go all Brandon Lee on their asses.

James said...

When you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail I guess. Maybe give it a rest?

G Joubert said...

Bachmann on the other hand seems rather green to be running for President.

Bachmann versus Obama, and Bachmann is the one who gets chided for being "green."

Hagar said...

Fundamentally, Pawlenty is not a person to tell you what he really thinks about anything controversial, and Bachmann is.

So they are not compatible personalities, but both are trying to make themselves appear less like opposites; Pawlenty that yes, he has principles and won't automatically go to dealmaking, and Bachmann that yes, she might consider making deals, at least sometimes.

Mike said...

Ann I'm going to get in trouble with you. When Sheila Jackson Lee, Cynthia McKinney, or Nancy Pelosi speak, I hear crazy. Nothing to do with them being female, but a lot to do with them being way round the bend bonkers.

edutcher said...

Mike, they are crazy. Even a Lefty can make some sense once in a while, but when you have someone like SJL who once demanded of NOAA that they start naming hurricanes with "black" names (Latifah, etc.) or Debbie Wasserman Schultz ("we own this economy"), these women got elected because of their plumbing and pigmentation, and, in the case of Pelosi Galore, hubby and Daddy's money.

Shouting Thomas said...

Jesus, Althouse, when are you going to get it?

Most of us weren't born to upper middle class suburban status like you were.

The rest of us come from rock solid poverty.


No, most of us came from blue collar or lower white collar backgrounds. Mom and Dad worked their way up the ladder, but I don't think many of us came up from "rock solid poverty", so I don't think we really resent Althouse all that much.

NYTNewYorker said...

To my eye, Pawlenty is trying to project a little bit of tough guy swagger that I'd never seen before his run and I find a little off putting now.

Mary Beth said...

All the emphasis on her being a back-bencher makes me think of the back-bencher who became Prime Minister.

Hoosier Daddy said...

"...She is not qualified. I am not a hypocrite. How can I defend Bachmann if I had the same objections to Obama...."

Well in fairness, Bachmann at least had a job.

Paddy O said...

I don't think Pawlenty has fire in his belly.

That's the narrative used against good Republican male candidates.

Old Dad said...

The TNR article is crap. The author admits that he was trolling for a headline. He invented the antiBachmann spin out of thin air. As part of a spirited defense of his antiestablishment credentials, Pawlently simply commented that she was an "outsider." The supposed antiBachmann crap comes secondhand.

The MSM will spin Bachmann as crazy homophobic, blah, blah. They'll spin Pawlenty as a snoozefest, and if they can gin up some fake controversey among the conteders, they'll do that' too. Pawlenty hates Bachmann's guts, he called her a backbencher, he's jealous of her press, blah, blah.

It's all part of the elect O show.

Scott M said...

That's the narrative used against good Republican male candidates.

Don't forget ample mentions of gravitas or heaping helpings of albatross.

WV - lol - "prestink"

Mike said...

Comparing resume's of Bachmann and Obama is pretty easy. She worked as a tax attorney (actually putting that law degree to work) and she and her husband have run their own small business. Being a community agitator and autobiographer (two volumes before you're 50 and you haven't done squat? Really?) is mighty thin, but his public pre-presidential record was even thinner, being a guy who voted "present" more often than not. That puts her head and shoulders above the experience-challenged Current Occupant of the WH.
Personally, I like Michelle's instincts. She stands for freedom and liberty by default. Obama's instincts are 180 degrees out of phase with the history and traditions of this country.

Hoosier Daddy said...

"...and, in the case of Pelosi Galore, hubby and Daddy's money..."

No doubt there. Pelosi has to be one of the dumbest people I ever heard speak. I mean dumb as a chair and actually became Speaker. May as well have had Heidi Montag up there for the eye candy factor.

Titus said...

Maybe if his wife was real dykish and acted and spoke and danced like a man?

phx said...

Some people pile on because of gender, or race, or ethnicity. And some people try to insulate themselves from opposition by playing the gender or race card.

Even when you are victim though, people don't look good playing the victim - unless they really are defenseless. And if they're that defenseless they're not fit for higher office.

I haven't seen Bachmann do this but Palin seems to have come close.

traditionalguy said...

Pawlenty was a Cap and Trade disciple back when no one knew the massive fraud that was designed to be.

Now he wants to be seen as the perfect candidate.
That doesn't work for the GOP voters who tend to be angry at the massive frauds of Bush and Obama

Bachmann is a gutsy fighter who is far from perfect.

But she is not Tim Pawlenty. That is her claim to fame.

Bachmann is also not Romney and not Huntsman, as additional credentials.

Only the seasoned Palin can beat the newcomer Bachmann. The Perry on again, off again candidacy will not happen until Palin announces that she is not running, which will not happen, so Perry won't run.


That sure as heck must annoy the perfect professional politicians like Pawlenty.

lyssalovelyredhead said...

Bachmann versus Obama, and Bachmann is the one who gets chided for being "green."

It's not Bachmann verses Obama yet. As compared to her opponents in the primary, she's definitely green.

sorepaw said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Scott M said...

Even when you are victim though, people don't look good playing the victim

The Dali Lama might disagree. You know, that guy the White House snuck out the back by the garbage so the Chinese wouldn't get all huffy...

garage mahal said...

Pelosi has to be one of the dumbest people I ever heard speak

The right must destroy Pelosi because they are deathly afraid of her!

SunnyJ said...

It is not a man/woman issue...it is a conservative women/everyone else issue, and today that everyone is Pawlenty.

The feminist movement and Hillary's handelers would like you to think they are the supporters of women, that exists on one issue and one issue only: if you believe abortion is the answer.

Reality check: There are more conservative women in congress than Dems, Repub women drove and supported the ERA, not Dems; and the public beating of Palin and now Bachmann is driven by the far left feminists.

Conservative women like Palin/Bachmann have it all...and that just pisses off those lefty feminists (except Camille Paglia)that wanted to frame the women's rights issues as "against" men, pro abortion as the only smart choice, and neautering the sexes.

The amazing independent conservative women elected across our country and those working for conservative candidates is the number one reason there is a Tea Party and the 2010 election.

Scott M said...

The right must destroy Pelosi because they are deathly afraid of her!

Garage, I have no idea how intelligent this woman actually is. Book-smart or street-smart, no clue. I would venture to say that nobody reaches that level of power without having something on the ball, but...damn...her unguarded comments simply do not bear out intelligence. She has made some seriously stupid statements over the past couple of years and, frankly, I don't want to destroy her, I just want someone less apparently stupid at the levers.

Hoosier Daddy said...

"...The right must destroy Pelosi because they are deathly afraid of her!.."

Pointing out a fact isn't destroying.

Robin said...

mahal, if you think anyone is afraid of Pelosi, you really are not living in reality. She's a comically incompetent Democratic leader and the GOP loves to put her face on Democratic policies.

phx said...

The Dali Lama might disagree. You know, that guy the White House snuck out the back by the garbage so the Chinese wouldn't get all huffy...

Buddhists are really good at not playing the victim card (or they should be).

As I recall Reagan very publicly wouldn't even meet with the Dalai Lama.

The Dalai Lama has a hard row to hoe. I'll bet he's not very often sorry for himself, no matter how badly he's treated. I think he probably has a very deep sorrow for others though. Of course I don't know that for sure.

chickenlittle said...

garage mahal wrote: The right must destroy Pelosi because they are deathly afraid of her!

Naw, she doing an great job at withering and self-destructing on her own. No push or shove is necessary.

In 10 or 15 years there will only be a vague memory. There will be no carrillon tower erected in DC in her honor, though she might buy a stained glass window at some Baltimore church.

Hoosier Daddy said...

"....I would venture to say that nobody reaches that level of power without having something on the ball,..."

Having a few million in the bank compensates for a lot of stupidity.

Scott M said...

though she might buy a stained glass window at some Baltimore church.

It would have to be one of those "reformed" Catholic churches. You know, one run a Doctor of the Church that isn't sure about the whole life beginning at conception thing.

garage mahal said...

mahal, if you think anyone is afraid of Pelosi, you really are not living in reality. She's a comically incompetent Democratic leader and the GOP loves to put her face on Democratic policies.

Really? She didn't lose one fight as Speaker that I recall. The reason the right hates her is because she kicks Republicans in the balls without apology.

Anyways just wanted to show how nauseatingly stupid that claim sounds whenever Palin or Bachmann names come up.

Old Dad said...

Pelosi: We have to pass it (Obamacare) so that we can find out what's in it.

And Bachmann is crazy?

Scott M said...

It's extremely tough (and I have a exceptional imagination, mind you) to envision a man that's a fan of Nancy Pelosi. Oh, I know they exist, I just can't get my head around it.

Old Dad said...

Garage said:

"Really? She didn't lose one fight as Speaker that I recall."

Well, there were those pesky 2010 elections.

Hagar said...

Pelosi was a very competent party leader in the House; Speaker of the House, not so much.

Paddy O said...

"because she kicks Republicans in the balls without apology"

A divider, not a uniter.

Unfortunately, Obama promised hope and change. But, we always knew that was just rhetoric. Most of us did, anyhow.

Oh, and that stuff about violent rhetoric being out of bounds. That also only applies to Republicans.

Kick 'em in the balls! That's what Democrats stand for!

chickenlittle said...

Really? She didn't lose one fight as Speaker that I recall.

She only lost the one that really matter...the one keeping her as speaker. Her foisted policy undid her. She tried to do as much damage as possible given what time she had. That's why you laud her, I suppose. But she's a has-been now. Harry Reid will follow her example.

David said...

But what if she is crazy?

Some are.

David said...

By the way this comment is coming from a Democrat.

He may like to drink beer with Pawlenty, but politically he does not wish either of them well.

Consider the source.

Scott M said...

Garage,

Do you consider it a mark of Pelosi's intelligence and leadership that she was able to secure so many Obamacare wavers for her district?

rocketeer67 said...

Really? She didn't lose one fight as Speaker that I recall.

I mean, except for that really big one in November 2010.

Other than that though, brilliant! In fact, as a Republican let me say it loudly: More Nancy!

Shanna said...

Bachmann versus Obama, and Bachmann is the one who gets chided for being "green."

I chided Obama for being green as well. It didn’t exactly work out well. I don't see why we should jump in with another person of limited experience unless we have a damn good reason.

I haven’t made up my mind on Bachmann yet, but as with Palin, I would be a lot happier with her as a candidate if she had “two time governor” behind her name. (At least Palin has some executive experience.) I also get the impression that she's rather socially conservative, which isn't really my bag. I'm more concerned about fiscal issues.

Clyde said...

@ Thorley Winston

"The story rings as false as a wedding invitation from a Frey."

That may be too obscure for many here, who may not have read George R. R. Martin's A Storm of Swords...

(BTW, I'm almost 900 pages into A Dance With Dragons.)

Dust Bunny Queen said...

"The woman does not know her place. When she speaks, I hear crazy. "

THIS IS TRUTH.

I can't begin to tell you how many times I've been in meetings while I was a stockbroker/financial advisor or in a group of mostly men and when I made a comment or suggestion it was either ignored or dismissed...YET in the next breath when the very same words I used were said by one of the 'guys'.....suddenly it was an inspirational idea or statement.

W.T.F.?!?!? I just said that!

The men do not want to hear from the women in a business or political setting and in the case of Bachman, Palin etc., they marginalize the women. Stupid, crazy, fringe. They become misogynistic calling the women vile names. They become sexist making comments about body parts and making crude passes and statements. They try to infantilize the woman and treat her like a retarded child.

All if these reactions are out of fear. Fear of losing control and fear that the woman may actually be better at some things than the man.

Of course, not all men are this way. My husband certainly is not.

However, when there is a power situation or struggle in status, like in the workplace or politics, the gloves come off and the misogyny is palpable.

All the men who deny that this exists are fooling themselves and have never been on the receiving end of such treatment.

Scott M said...

@Clyde

Then explain to me why Jon sends Sam away with Gilly and Aeron AGAIN when he already did it in book 4.

garage mahal said...

A divider, not a uniter.

Oh please. Even if it were her job to unite the other side of the aisle, these aren't your father's Republicans we're talking about here. Where would you start with people that want to see Obama's birth certificate?

phx said...

It's the socially conservative areas where people of either party are more likely to "hear crazy." Doesn't matter what gender.

virgil xenophon said...

test

Carol_Herman said...

Funny, if you go back in time to the Nixon "turis" ... you'd see Nixon, who didn't want Nelson Rockefeller as his veep ... went shopping.

In the House, he found Gerry Ford. And, the "struck a deal." Gerry was NOT supposed to run, himself. But something about being IN the office changed his mind.

And, remember, you are dealing with the stupid party!

Came 1976 ... and, out came the peanut farmer. Unknown to most Americans. But very appealing to the religous zealots. SWEPT IN!

And, gave us a miserable four years ... Just like now.

Back then, in 1974, the inside putz's in the stupid party (with their leader being the elder minor bush) ... thought if they manuevered around Reagan ... HA HA HA ... he'd be too old to run in 1980.

Reagan was never showcased!

All Reagan did ... is what you see Sarah Palin doing now. BUCKING THE TREND. Reaching out to small pockets of people ... And, introducing herself.

Reagan had his movies.

Sarah has one now!

And, the hard part to get around is that the elite repubicans know they don't have a star among them!

Yeah. Mittens and Paws.

Going nowhere.

traditionalguy said...

If Dust Bunny Queen wasn't a woman, then what she wrote would be right.

Maybe she needs to be kept out of sight writing analysis and recommendations that men submit as their own work.

See, it all works that way.

Mr. D said...

Just so you know. . . .

Moe is an old-line Northern Minnesota DFLer. Not very bright, either. Chvala is more impressive, which is really damning with faint praise.

Jacobs shares the "rent-a-pundit" stage with three other Minnesota academic types: David Schultz of Hamline, Stephen Schier of Carleton and Kathryn Pearson of the U. of M. The next original thought any of them offers will be the first one. You could find equally dull profs in the faculty lounges at, say, Carroll, Lawrence and UW-Milwaukee. Of the four, Jacobs has the best beard, which is how you can tell him from the others.

Bachmann is a controversial figure in Minnesota because she's really the only Republican politician that's ever had much success here without at least nodding to the conventional wisdom. She couldn't care less what the Star Tribune or the Twin Cities television stations say about her. That's her strength.

The DFL hates T-Paw for different reasons. He faced some really hostile legislatures during his second term and he stared them down. They'll never forgive him for that.

Thorley Winston said...

@ Clyde

That may be too obscure for many here, who may not have read George R. R. Martin's A Storm of Swords...

Last week I noticed more than a few people dropping ASOIAF references and I through I’d throw one out to see who’d bite. I did the same at work referring to “words are wind” and “winter is coming” in reference to the debt ceiling negotiations but no one seems to catch on ;)

(BTW, I'm almost 900 pages into A Dance With Dragons.)

I picked up the audio book last week for my commute/cardio workout/insomnia and I’m about 23 hours into (about half-way). It’s pretty good except for the Bran perspective chapters (too Harry Potterish for my tastes).

Shanna said...

BTW, I'm almost 900 pages into A Dance With Dragons

I read the first three but haven't started number four yet. I was a bit burned out (man those books are long!) and the 4th book had pretty bad reviews on Amazon. What did you think of that one?

I guess I'll have to read it eventually to catch up to the most recent one.

HDHouse said...

the question might be who is the mental midget...just curious and passing through.

or the hack and hack extraordinaire

Chuck66 said...

As TosaGuy said, Roger Moe is a partison hack, so don't take his word on what Republicans think.

Also, almost all Minnesota Democrats have this insane hatred of Congresswoman Bachmann, so of course they are going to portray her in a bad light. And I say this as a T-Paw fan.

Amelia said...

I don't know how to twist myself into your mold Ann. When Michelle Bachmann speaks, I roll my eyes too. I'm a woman,a Minnesotan and a conservative - guess I have to add sexist to that list?

Shanna said...

almost all Minnesota Democrats have this insane hatred of Congresswoman Bachmann

Why do you think this is the case?

Chuck66 said...

I've heard Congresswoman Bachmann speak 2 or 3 times. She is very different in person than Big Media portrays her at.

Best speach by her was at the Stand With Israel rally in Mpls a year ago. She speaks without notes and is quite good.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

BTW, I'm almost 900 pages into A Dance With Dragons

I read the first three but haven't started number four yet. I was a bit burned out (man those books are long!) and the 4th book had pretty bad reviews on Amazon. What did you think of that one?

Me too. However, I became very annoyed that he didn't write this latest installment for years and YEARS. I was afraid that he had run out of steam and was going to leave us hanging.

I'll probably buy the book soon.

Chuck66 said...

Shanna, I spend time in Minnesota and know people there, including Democats.

As an example, the Mpls paper puts Bachmann-bashing stories on their web site about every other day. I think they do this just to drive traffic as the comment section goes nuts with vicious anti-Bachmann hatred.

Mr. D said...

Why do you think this is the case?

Because she really doesn't care what they think and doesn't let Minnesota Democrats define terms.

Kirk Parker said...

garage,

"Where would you start with people that want to see Obama's birth certificate?"

Well, I'm not such a one, so this is just conjecture: but as a first-order approximation, how about starting with showing the birth certificate?

TosaGuy said...

"As an example, the Mpls paper puts Bachmann-bashing stories on their web site about every other day. I think they do this just to drive traffic as the comment section goes nuts with vicious anti-Bachmann hatred."

I've noticed the same thing. They never post anything about the Keith Ellisons and Al Frankens of the state. Bachmann has a unique talent for making Minnesotans not in her district unhinged.

Saint Croix said...

I don't think it's bigotry. To be honest I get a bit of a crazy vibe from Bachmann. And I'm a Republican and I love Sarah Palin. Also a big fan of Rick Perry.

The rest of the Republican field doesn't excite me, it's more like hold my nose. I will vote for her--I will vote for any Republican over Obama--but when I see her or hear her I often have this thought: "too tightly wrapped."

Like when discussing the Weiner photo, instead of finding the humor in it, or thinking it a silly distraction, she was like, "ooo, gross."

I get an uptight vibe from her. Screaming in a bathroom, I totally buy that she did that.

I think Sarah Palin would have punched somebody who tried to pull that crap.

rocketeer67 said...

Where would you start with people that want to see Obama's birth certificate?

Well, the logical place would be to start by presenting the birth certificate. Issue resolved.

Chuck66 said...

"Where would you start with people that want to see Obama's birth certificate?"

I've never met anyone who cared about that. The only people who wanted to talk about that were Democrats.

phx said...

chuck66: I'd like to introduce you to Rocketeer67.

MadisonMan said...

Some women are crazy. Whether Michelle Bachmann is one of those? Not sure, but doubt it.

Some women also perenially whine I'm a victim here!!! To my knowledge Bachmann hasn't done that, and that's many points in her favor.

I will say that Michelle Bachmann does say many things that are not to my taste. That doesn't make her crazy, however.

garage mahal said...

Well, the logical place would be to start by presenting the birth certificate. Issue resolved.

Then the logical stance is to ask Mitt Romney to prove he isn't wearing magic underwear before we could negotiate with him. Or, any damn crazy thing we can think up.

Scott M said...

@Garage

Please answer the question from earlier.

"Do you consider it a mark of Pelosi's intelligence and leadership that she was able to secure so many Obamacare wavers for her district?"

garage mahal said...

"Do you consider it a mark of Pelosi's intelligence and leadership that she was able to secure so many Obamacare wavers for her district?"

You would need to prove Pelosi personally secured waivers for her district.

sorepaw said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Scott M said...

You would need to prove Pelosi personally secured waivers for her district.

Ah. If it walks like a duck doesn't work for this one, I take it? Please keep in mind that's where you're setting the bar for future conversations.

Thorley Winston said...

I read the first three but haven't started number four yet. I was a bit burned out (man those books are long!) and the 4th book had pretty bad reviews on Amazon. What did you think of that one?

I suspect that many of the negative reviews are from readers who are upset that (a) he took 6 years to write it and (b) that he broke up the POV characters between books 4 and 5 and book 4 focused on characters that weren’t as popular or interesting to some readers as the ones that are featured in book 5.

I started the series in May when AGOT premiered on HBO and read straight through and finished book 4 a couple of weeks ago so I don’t share the complaint about the six year gap in between books. I actually did like the intrigue about the Lannisters so I found Book 4 pretty enjoyable. I missed reading about Jon Snow, Tyrion and Davos (who weren’t in Book 4 but feature pretty heavily in Book 5) but Book 4 has some major reveals about how and why the events from the first three books got set in motion and by whom that I think you’re losing out on a pretty good payoff that continues in Book 5 if stop now.

Shanna said...

Screaming in a bathroom, I totally buy that she did that.

I think Sarah Palin would have punched somebody who tried to pull that crap.


Heh. Like I said, I don't know what to make of Bachmann yet. Stories about screaming in the bathroom don't exactly give you that strong executive vibe, unfortunately. Not to say that makes her crazy or anything, but it's not good PR.

rocketeer67 said...

chuck66: I'd like to introduce you to Rocketeer67.

Wrong, phx. I never cared. But: stupid, fake issue - simple, straghtforward resolution. So simple and straightforward, in fact, that sooper-smart Dems Who Only Care About The Good Of The Country never thought of it.

rocketeer67 said...

Then the logical stance is to ask Mitt Romney to prove he isn't wearing magic underwear before we could negotiate with him.

By all means, proceed! I'm sure he will be happy to address your concern, and teh crazies need to be certain the magic underwear eligibility threshold spelled out in the Constitution is fullfilled.

garage mahal said...

If it walks like a duck doesn't work for this one, I take it?

No idea. Feel free to make your case though

Shanna said...

book 4 focused on characters that weren’t as popular or interesting to some readers as the ones that are featured in book 5.

Yes, that’s what many of them said. Of course, since I kind of love Arya I also don’t like the idea of skipping her entirely for 200 pages in a row of Brienne. These books are kind of like soap operas to me in that you are just rushing through some characters to get to the ones you actually are interested in. (I don’t personally care that it took 6 years to write since I just started reading them this spring).

I started the series in May when AGOT premiered on HBO and read straight through and finished book 4 a couple of weeks ago so I don’t share the complaint about the six year gap in between books. I actually did like the intrigue about the Lannisters so I found Book 4 pretty enjoyable. I missed reading about Jon Snow, Tyrion and Davos (who weren’t in Book 4 but feature pretty heavily in Book 5) but Book 4 has some major reveals about how and why the events from the first three books got set in motion and by whom that I think you’re losing out on a pretty good payoff that continues in Book 5 if stop now.

Thanks for the review! I can do without Davos for sure but no Tyrion? What was the author thinking? I will get to it eventually, I just wasn’t in the right frame of mind to read it after I finished 1,2,&3.

Random Arrow said...

"Man cannot speak for her" - Cady Stanton.

KenK said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
sorepaw said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Trooper York said...

I am almost through Dance of Dragons and it is most disappointing. After so many years and years of waiting you would think there would be a hint of resolution of some of the issues but it seems Mr. Martin is more interested in listing the foodstuffs that the characters are consuming.

Now it is true that an army travels on it's stomach and that amateurs talk about tactics and professionals talk about logistics but who wants to read shopping lists and descriptions of people traveling.

That sums up "Dance of Dragons." Everybody is traveling and nobody gets there.

We waited all this time for this?

Scott M said...

but it seems Mr. Martin is more interested in listing the foodstuffs that the characters are consuming

I'm about halfway through (didn't have to wait years as I only started the series back in February) and I've noticed that as well. When he starts talking about what they're eating, I scan forward until something actually happens.

Again...why was there a scene in Dances where Jon Snow sends Sam and Gilly away from the Wall when that already happened in book 4? I have yet to find an answer for this.

Hoosier Daddy said...

"...You would need to prove Pelosi personally secured waivers for her district...."

Better question is why waivers are permitted. I thought this Obamacare was supposed to be da shit.

Scott M said...

Better question is why waivers are permitted. I thought this Obamacare was supposed to be da shit.

And even better question is why were waivers stopped if they could be justified in the first place? I notice I didn't get one and neither did anyone I know.

Phil 3:14 said...

Pelosi has to be one of the dumbest people I ever heard speak

I don't see/hear her as dumb. She's no policy wonk but I believe she has a good working knowledge of how to get a bill passed. There have been few if any thing she's pushed that I agree with. I see the "dumb" meme as a common attribution to someone way "on the other side" who can't see "the obvious".

PS We can't call Rep. Sheila Jackson "dumb" or "crazy"; that would be racist.

Trooper York said...

When you are writing a series as big as "Game of Thrones" you often end up repeating yourself. I just think if you take this long to write something then it should be really great.

I mean Harry Turtledove and SM Stirling and David Drake and Eric Flint all spit out books every year and they advance the story in increments as "Dance of Dragons" does but you can forgive that because you get a new one every year.

I mean we waited this long and this is what we get?

It must feel the same way that black guys feel about Barack Obama.

Just sayn'

Scott M said...

Stirling, one of my favorites, has also taken to doing lists of food recently. Very off-putting.

Now...if we can just get Dan Simmons to do a Ilium/Olypos sequel, very little food, lots of things going on.

Shanna said...

I scan forward until something actually happens.

This was my strategy in LOTR everytime the hobbits started to sing.

Robin said...

Even if it were her job to unite the other side of the aisle, these aren't your father's Republicans we're talking about here. Where would you start with people that want to see Obama's birth certificate?

Those were Hillary Clinton Democrats, mahal, as you enjoy forgetting.

Rick said...

Greg: I don't they think it burns them. It gets rid of their female competitors.

Mike said...

Okay Garage--you got me dead to rights. I can't show you proof that Pelosi personally secured so many Obamacare waivers for her district. Then again, I can't prove that the Tooth Fairy was the one who got all those waivers for San Francisco either. But if I had to bet as between Pelosi and the Tooth Fairy, I'd put my lunch money down on Pelosi's nose.

And then since she's "kicked so many Republicans in the balls", well I might make that a knuckle sandwich on the old dingbat's nose.

Oligonicella said...

garage mahal --

Kind of like the facts you provide as argument?

"Sure. What's wrong with facts?"

Had to physically remove the little tick marks from my comment, eh?

Thank you for demonstrating a typical example of your 'facts'.

traditionalguy said...

What will Pawlenty do next? He has no job skills.

Old Dad said...

Garage thinks Queen Nancy is a ball kicker extraordinaire. My guess is that she's also an excellent ball massager.

Do you think she retired her giant gavel? I'll bet she had it electrified.

Coketown said...

Women in small politics is cute and empowering. House seat, Senate seat, council seat--we're all behind you, grrl. But stay away from the Governor's mansion or White House. Hilbot, Palin, Bachmann--all proof that the message that resonates with the American voter, the male answer to the black's race card (hi garage!), is, "That bitch is nuckin' futs." Put her in a place where she can deliberate and air her grievances but not lead. Women don't want issues resolved; they just want you to acknowledge their opinion. Perfect for the House. But God bless us if one manages to sneak into a position of power.

Mike K said...

Rick Perry has the edge over Obama in North Carolina in a poll that came out today. Could be game over.

Mike K said...

Pawlenty was very much a centrist legislator under Governor Carlson. (For example, he voted to add gays to the protections of the Minnesota Human Rights Act after Carlson lobbied him, and he voted for tax increases.)

I guess that makes Sarah Pain the moderate in the field ? She supported partner benefits for gays in Alaska.

Thorley Winston said...

Women in small politics is cute and empowering. House seat, Senate seat, council seat--we're all behind you, grrl. But stay away from the Governor's mansion or White House. Hilbot, Palin, Bachmann--all proof that the message that resonates with the American voter, the male answer to the black's race card (hi garage!), is, "That bitch is nuckin' futs." Put her in a place where she can deliberate and air her grievances but not lead. Women don't want issues resolved; they just want you to acknowledge their opinion. Perfect for the House. But God bless us if one manages to sneak into a position of power.


I’m honestly not sure if the reader is intending this to be an anti-Bachmann post or a parody of an anti-Bachmann post. From what I can tell, most of the criticism of or concerns about Representative Bachmann that have been expressed from the right have been that she really hasn’t demonstrated much in the way of leadership – no executive experience and no major legislation that she’s successfully navigated through either the Minnesota State Senate or Congress. So on that issue she would likely lose against Barack Obama in 2012 (in 2008 he wouldn’t have three and a half years as POTUS that he will in 2012) and if she were to win, would we wind up with our version of Barack Obama – someone elected based on their ability to deliver a speech but who doesn’t have the actual skills or experience to govern effectively?

cubanbob said...

Amelia said...
I don't know how to twist myself into your mold Ann. When Michelle Bachmann speaks, I roll my eyes too. I'm a woman,a Minnesotan and a conservative - guess I have to add sexist to that list?

7/18/11 1:28 PM

If it comes down to Obama and Bachman who would you vote for?


GM: the birther business was started by democrats. They were the first to file the suits and it was Hilary's campaign that started it to begin with. Just like Gore in 88 with the Willie Horton matter. You are entitled to your opinions but not your facts. Anyone who supports Obama is in no postion to comment on other people as being crazy.

andinista said...

AA says: but I can't help hearing the eternal theme of male reacting to female

There's a tell. Guys, now you know how she thinks of you all.

Revenant said...

Again...why was there a scene in Dances where Jon Snow sends Sam and Gilly away from the Wall when that already happened in book 4? I have yet to find an answer for this.

Er, isn't the scene in book 5 just the other half of the events in book 4? The two books take place in parallel -- i.e., in book 4 you hear second-hand about what you see first-hand in book 5.

Trooper York said...

That is the problem with "A Dance with Dragons." It is really giving us a lot of stuff that we kinda already knew from another perspective. And what's up with all the leprosy stuff?

Trooper York said...

You know Obama kind of reminds me of Stannis Baratheon.

Trooper York said...

And Tim Pawlenty has a Tyrion Lannister smell to his short self.

Trooper York said...

Michelle Bachman is the Maid of Tarth.

Trooper York said...

John McCain is Ser Bannister Semly.

Trooper York said...

Oh and Tim Greithner.

Reek.

Thorley Winston said...

You know Obama kind of reminds me of Stannis Baratheon.
Don’t you mean Joffrey? Both were basically handed leadership roles that they were unsuited for and surrounded themselves with supplicants who convinced them that they could do no wrong and were short tempered with anyone who dare to question their authority. Stannis was a hard man but he’s fundamentally fair and forthright in how he treats others.

andinista said...

Sarah Palin is Daenerys Targaryen

Lucius said...

A two-term Congressperson running for President is fair game for accusations of "doesn't know her place."

I know Bachmann wants to mix things up, but while we're waiting for Palin it's no excuse to heap wild praises on her erstwhile wannabe.

caradoc said...

I'm disappointed in you Ann. I'd expect that kind of paranoid sexist remark from Amanda Marcotte or Skeptichick, not you.

Seven Machos said...

I am sick of Bachmann. I am sick of Palin. It's not because they are women, either. I'm also sick of Gingrich, Ron Paul, and all the other potential Republican presidential candidates who, like Palin and Bachmann, simply have no business running for president because they don't have the requisite experience.

Don't you people see? Don't you get it? Bachmann and Palin and Paul and a handful of others are just like Obama. They don't have the necessary political experience to govern -- to compromise, to forge bipartisan majorities.

You people who are falling for the siren song of any of these people are going to be in for a sad, sorry surprise if your candidates ever win. Nothing's going to get done. It's going to be a repeat of Obama only from the viewpoint and mood of the right.

Trooper York said...

I don't know. Obama is stubborn, obdurate, and clueless.

And he puts all his faith in a "Red"
God.

Very Stannis like.

Trooper York said...

The two Presidents with the best credentials before they were elected were James Buchanan and George HW Bush.

Abe Lincoln was a one term congressman.

Just sayn'

Browndog said...

heh-

The comment box is back at the top-

where it should be

Just when it was apparent Althouse blog was starting to crater--

Apologies to Frenchy for not reading all the comments (for the 5th time), before posting with my own comment without weighing it against everyone's else's comment first-

I know- where's the collective justice?

Anywho-good call restoring the template.

If you move my cheese, I'll just find something else to eat....

Seven Machos said...

I'm a big fan of Abe Lincoln. Really, I am. We should always remember, though, that the man was president when the country's only civil war started.

Not exactly bipartisan leadership on Abe's part.

Ronald Reagan and Bill Clinton had tremendous resumes and did fine.

Trooper York said...

That's the point. You shouldn't fight the last war. Don't build a Maginot line of qualifications like only professional politicians and the credentialed have the bullshit gravitas to be President.

A real American with common sense could do a lot better than any of these pointy headed Ivy League affirmative action social promotion douchenozzles.

Trooper York said...

We don't need another lawyer.

We don't need another career poliitican weiner waver.

We don't need another Ivy League hack.

We need a regular common sense American.

And that ain't Tiny Tim Pawlenty or Mormon Mitt Romney or any of the ususal suspects.

There ain't a dimes worth of differance between 'em.

To coin a phrase so to speak.

Trooper York said...

Hell Tyrion Lannister would be a better President than any of them.

Seven Machos said...

I think what the country needs right now is someone who can forge consensus on a new way forward out of this economic hell and steer us through a huge entitlement reform. Palin, Bachmann, Paul, Gingrich, the Godfather's guy -- none of those people are going to be able to pull that off. It's just going to be Obama Redux. Huge expectations by a giddy base followed by an inevitable realization after a couple years that it was all cult of personality and not real, serious leadership.

Give me dull. Give me serious.

chickenlittle said...

You people who are falling for the siren song of any of these people are going to be in for a sad, sorry surprise if your candidates ever win.

Rove hasn't finished paving the way yet for a Bush restoration. When that happens, things will get more interesting from the dullness perspective.

I'm also intrigued that the same people who mark Bachmann are the same people who sully Palin and Romney. They're liberal bigots. It's an important chapter to work through.

dick said...

7 Machos,

Should any of these get nominated, then would you vote for Obama instead or for the candidate of the right. Could any of them be any worse than Obama? Not that I can see. At least they have opinions they have developed and can discuss which is more than Zero can do.

Trooper York said...

You might be right about that Seven. But I think we should look outside the usual base. Find a manager or a person of integrity who would put his nation before petty partisan politics.

The problem is that person would never run. Because the noise machine would tear him apart. The political parties would tear him apart.

Just no more lawyer or professional politicians.

Seven Machos said...

Dick -- I am on record saying -- as people here like Trooper would already know -- that, of course, I will vote for the Republican. I voted for McCain for crying out loud. I voted for Dole.

But I am not the person who needs convincing. Moreover, though I do think that the candidates I have named will not beat Obama, that's not the point. I assume, arguendo, that they do beat Obama. My point is that they will be massive failures in exactly the same way that Obama has been a massive failure. They are all hat, no cattle. They cannot forge a consensus for a new way forward on a host of absolutely vital issues.

Obama is muddling through. We cannot continue to do that.

Chuck66 said...

A legitemate critisim of Bachmann running for higher office is that she has about as much experience as Obama. That is valid. I would prefer her to stay in the House, or maybe consider the US Senate.

But the left's deranged hatred of this women is interesting.

As a spry youngster, I heard Vice-President Bush speak a couple of times. I recall thinking "this guy is way different that the media portray him as".

Same with Bachmann. I've heard her speak live 3 or so times and have to say....I think on of the reason the left hates her so much is that she is a great speaker. A very outspoken conservative.

Fred4Pres said...

You want a crazy female? Here's your crazy female:

When the U.S. has a debt, we/I, we/I, owe
Then a quick click here, and a quick click there
Here a click, there a click, now a little quick click
Then the U.S. paid its debt, we won’t, we don’t owe.


Make me think of this.

Quasimodo said...

I can't help hearing the eternal theme of male reacting to female: The woman does not know her place. When she speaks, I hear crazy.

I can't help seeing a knee jerk

Chuck66 said...

Fred...interesting article. Possibly the most economically illiterate person ever.

And another thing. If the governmental accounting has to set up reserves for all known future liabilities.......what comes after a trillion?

Fred4Pres said...

Mark Steyn had that on Rush today. I could not believe what I was hearing.

Canuck said...

"Hell Tyrion Lannister would be a better President than any of them."

Tyrion Lannister would be a far better President then most current politicans. He put himself at risk to defend the kingdom, both on the field and in the halls of power. Our politicans desire personal power far more then they care about the health of the country.

Phil 3:14 said...

Seven said:

Dick -- I am on record saying -- as people here like Trooper would already know -- that, of course, I will vote for the Republican. I voted for McCain for crying out loud. I voted for Dole.

Well I didn't vote for Dole. But unless the Republican candidate wants to turn the US government over to the Church of Scientology I will vote for any Republican. I don't see our present WH occupant or any of the powerful Democrats in congress doing anything regarding the deficit in the foreseeable future.

Browndog said...

Damn, after re-reading all the comments, I had to scroll all the way back up to the top to comment-

cheese...

What I've heard, from serious democrats, and Joe Blow's alike, is that what this country needs most is a President with courage.

They say "leadership" too, but that is discarded into the dustbin of useless political rhetoric.

But, "courage" will unite the country.

"Courage" is, as they say, "Undefeated".

G Joubert said...

Give me dull. Give me serious.

Ben Stein?

Cedarford said...

Bachmann is a gutsy fighter who is far from perfect.

But she is not Tim Pawlenty. That is her claim to fame.

Bachmann is also not Romney and not Huntsman, as additional credentials.

Only the seasoned Palin can beat the newcomer Bachmann.
========================
Palin "seasoned"?
6 months on a oil and gas panel she quit.
4 months on a bad campaign she said she "went rogue" on.
Less than 2 years as governor of a small state of under 1 million people...then she quit.
Zero Presidential primary experience.
2 years hawking her media empire.

Bob Ellison said...

I hear the Professor's knee jerking.

ALH said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Peter Hoh said...

Yes, there's a coordinated effort by the liberal media and the GOP elite to undermine Bachmann. I'll leave it to you to figure out how the GOP elite gets the liberal media to do their bidding.

Revenant said...

I'll leave it to you to figure out how the GOP elite gets the liberal media to do their bidding.

I dunno, there seems to be a meme on the Left that Rupert Murdoch is some sort of evil mastermind who totally dominates and controls news coverage and MUST. BE. STOPPED.

So presumably he's the one pulling the strings?

Peter Hoh said...

Seven: I think what the country needs right now is someone who can forge consensus on a new way forward out of this economic hell and steer us through a huge entitlement reform.

Me too.

I'm afraid Pawlenty isn't the guy you are looking for, however. My sense is that as governor, he didn't provide great leadership on fiscal issues. He found ways to get things done without raising state taxes (except on cigarettes) but during his terms, local property taxes went up. There was no leadership on fundamental restructuring of government spending during his two terms in office.

Anga2010 said...

No comment other than, get over yerself.

Mahon said...

Wait. Guys think that way about other guys, too, sometimes. It's not always all about you!

Michael said...

Wait. Guys think that way about other guys, too, sometimes. It's not always all about you!

chickenlittle said...

Michael and Mahon said...
...the same exact thing.

G Joubert said...

If I were guessing, I'd say Seven is leaning towards Romney.

dick said...

Seven,

How do you know they cannot forge alliances. Sarah for one did exactly when she took on the Republican Party in Alaska. She forged the alliances and got rid of the crooks in the party which is exactly what she ran on. I see that most of the points she is making in her writings are what I would love to see done and based on past practices I see no reason why she cannot implement them. Romney has already proven that he can do things as he did in the Utah Olympics that he straightened out. I think you are not giving them a fair shake but just saying that they are all hat, no cattle with no real basis for saying that.

Seven Machos said...

Romney, Pawlenty, Perry (and, sadly, Jeb Bush and Mitch Daniels) are all fine with me.

Chris Christie is a good analogue of Palin. I like him. I am energized by him. However, he needs more experience. Like Palin.

Revenant said...

I think what the country needs right now is someone who can forge consensus on a new way forward out of this economic hell and steer us through a huge entitlement reform.

Is consensus possible?

I don't think most Americans even realize how big of a problem entitlements ARE. Both parties have devoted too much effort to lying about it over the years -- Democrats mostly, but Republicans too.

"A whole lot of you aren't ever going to get the Social Security and Medicare benefits you thought you'd paid for" is a bitter pill to swallow. Even if most of Congress wasn't fully prepared to demagogue on the issue of "betraying out promises to seniors" reform would be nigh-impossible.

What I suspect we really need isn't a candidate who can forge consensus, but a candidate who is willing to force change down the public's throat and pay the price for having done so.

ken in sc said...

Any man who has held the rank of 2LT and spoke up in a staff meeting has been treated like this.