June 23, 2011

"Cantor and Kyl just threw Boehner and McConnell under the bus."

"This move is an admission that there will be a need for revenues and Cantor and Kyl don't want to be the ones to make that deal."

So says "a senior Democratic aide" after House Majority Leader Eric Cantor and Senate Minority Whip Jon Kyl dropped out of the debt talks today, leaving no Republicans in the group.

167 comments:

Bruce Hayden said...

On the other hand, it also shows the unseriousness of the Democrats in cutting spending.

MikeR said...

That didn't make any sense, right?

clint said...

I'll wait to hear what Cantor's and Kyl's people have to say about this, but I'd guess it's the return of, "We won."

What's the point of pretending to be part of a bipartisan effort, when the other side isn't listening?

Leland said...

I think you're right, MikeR.

Jason (the commenter) said...

So I guess by Obama not being there, he was throwing everyone else (Democrats included) under the bus, right?

Seeing Red said...

Bonehead & mcc should have never been on the bus in the 1st place. I would b open to tax increases IF they revoke epa regs & let us drill. Then have hearings on the science of mmgw.

Michael K said...

That may be the same anonymous aide who said Issa was briefed on the ATF scandal in 2010. You can tell who it is because his pants are on fire.

This means a big showdown over spending. The Democrats were never going to negotiate honestly when they haven't even submitted a budget.

Seeing Red said...

R we at 800 days w/o a senate budget yet?

nevadabob said...

Wait ... look over there!

My isn't it convenient that when people start criticizing Obama on his warmongering, the FBI is almost within moments able to produce some home grown Islamists plotting to attack military installations.

Why, it's almost as if this whole thing is nothing more than a Democrat war machine - an industrial complex almost - ginning up terror plots whenever it needs to raise the debt ceiling to support endless wars of choice against brown people in places like Libya or Yemen.

PatHMV said...

Of course, I'm sure the unnamed "senior Democratic aide" isn't trying to spin this for the benefit of his party.

Bruce Hayden said...

Bonehead & mcc should have never been on the bus in the 1st place. I would b open to tax increases IF they revoke epa regs & let us drill. Then have hearings on the science of mmgw.

There are two philosophies here. The Democrats want to raise taxes to reduce the deficit. The Republicans want to cut spending - a lot. Without the Republicans on-board this, and controlling the House, nothing is going to happen.

What became very evident in another matter that is now on the floor in the House today, is that the Republican leadership in the House has to listen to its newest members when it comes to deficit reduction. They were elected to cut spending and get control over the federal bureaucracy, and are not willing to compromise. Maybe after they have been reelected a couple of times. But they listen more to the Tea Party than to their leaders.

nevadabob said...

"So says "a senior Democratic aide"

That's odd, because I have sources inside ABCNews and they tell me that Sublen Miller, the author of this blog post, made up that quote.

That in fact, no senior Democratic aide ever said this and she just made up the whole thing to try to establish as a "fact" the need for tax increases.

I have top sources on this. Who?

Top. Sources.

They don't want their names released because they are not authorized to speak for ABC News but I promise they really really exist.

Damn this journalism shit is easy!

Bruce Hayden said...

That may be the same anonymous aide who said Issa was briefed on the ATF scandal in 2010. You can tell who it is because his pants are on fire.

That was apparently WaPo, which credited a single anonymous source, and this is hotly contested by Rep. Issa. No surprise that the rag is backpeddling right now, since they are in a put up, or shut up, situation. Issa has essentially called them liars, and without disclosing their source, have no defense to that charge.

bagoh20 said...

Isn't the "need for revenues" the problem - not the solution?

garage mahal said...

That's odd, because I have sources inside ABCNews and they tell me that Sublen Miller, the author of this blog post, made up that quote.

LOL. Which sockpuppet do you use to receive this inside information?

edutcher said...

Lessee, the Demos demand Stimulus III and more taxes.

Yup, time to tell 'em to go screw themselves.

(they've gotten so good at it. Just ask The Weiner)

virgil xenophon said...

ALL of this stems from the "static" analysis the CBO uses when scoring tax-cuts--as if changes in marginal rates have NO effect on the motivation of the individual to work and of the businessman to hire and grow. This is the reason that growing tax-revenues to the Treasury after tax-cuts are always classed as "unexpected" by the media--as are shrinking revenues after tax hikes. Until the Elephants succeed in changing the PR Paradigm about the ACTUAL, HISTORICAL RECORD of dynamic increases in tax revenues to the Treasury by cuts in the marginal tax-rates they will always loose the PR game and elections--not to mention watch the economy go down the tubes.

We will NEVER get out of our current mess unless we both cut spending AND grow the economy--and you don't do THAT by raising taxs.

Scott M said...

LOL. Which sockpuppet do you use to receive this inside information?

Bought and paid for with his earnings from the Weiner proof sale.

Steven said...

"This move is an admission that there will be a need for revenues and Cantor and Kyl don't want to be the ones to make that deal."

Here, let's reverse the spin on that:

"This move indicates a realization that the Democrats refuse to admit that revenues will not be increased as long as Republicans control the House. Cantor and Kyl don't want to be the ones who allow the Democrats to cling to their delusion that revenues will be part of any budget deal."

nevadabob said...

"A Senior Democratic aide says, “Cantor and Kyl just threw Boehner and McConnell under the bus. This move is an admission that there will be a need for revenues and Cantor and Kyl don't want to be the ones to make that deal.”

Hmmm.

Isn't it strange that when Senator Kyl dropped out of these talks ABCNews allegedly (if you're stupid enough to believe them) immediately went to go find a Democrat to get a talking point.

Why not just go ask Kyl?

Isn't that interesting how transparent they are? No media bias here, no sirree.

The default position of Democrats is that job-killing tax increases are needed.

That's a non-sequiter and any Republican who works to increases taxes is going to find themselves banished from our political party.

ANY. REPUBLICAN.

If you work with Democrats then you are fucking OUT.

Got it?

Dustin said...

This is a weird attempt to spin. The conclusion we 'need more revenue' doesn't follow.

And anyone who is paying attention to this stuff would understand that.

We don't have a revenue problem, and we're in a recession/depression. More taxes are obviously off the table. It's absolutely ridiculous to demand them, and clearly meant to ruin the GOP's electoral future, since that's certainly not what America wants.

What we need are dramatic spending reductions and arguably even more tax cuts. Tax hikes are such an unserious solution to such a bloated government.

rhhardin said...

Need for revenues? They have revenues.

I assume that's code for more taxes, which ought to be rejected absolutely.

You do need to raise the debt ceiling. I'm not sure how it's good as leverage, as a result.

(The debt ceiling unraised would mean the budget is balanced, which is a little beyond the capabilities of spending cutters in an August time period. The media are confusing deficit and total debt, not helping anybody.)

Actually we could get by without raising the debt ceiling but inflation would explode. We can always print money, instead of borrowing it, namely.

Lance said...

As predicted. Obama doesn't want a deal, he wants to shut down the government and try to pin it on Republicans.

cubanbob said...

The republicans should play hardball and start with the position of no tax hikes and only cuts. If the government shuts down, that is a good thing. When the taxpayers realize the only moaning and groaning is from the tax consumers they won't care if they take several months to hammer out a budget. And the republicans should also make it clear that federal employees do not get reimbursed for lost wages but instead take the hit as a pay cut. if they ain't happy, ket get a job elsewhere. And same for 'entitlement' recipients, enough of the moochers already.

traditionalguy said...

The End Game for devaluation of the the US Dollar has started. The nasty GOP's refusal to raise Debt Limits and Taxes will be said to have triggered it. It is so like a hostage stand off. What good is letting the hostage live a few more months by paying the ransom when we know that the hostage is never going to be released alive.

garage mahal said...

Even Republicans aren't stupid enough to not raise the debt limit, they're friends on Wall St will make sure that never happens. It's all kabuki. I bet the deal is mostly already done.

Democrats will suicidally agree to Medicare cuts when Paul Ryan and his voucher plan is radioactive nationwide. Republicans will blame Dems and beat them over the head for cutting Medicare.

Obama will blame Republicans.

Both side's donors will get what they want.

The End.

Pogo said...

Dr. Democrat perfoms bloodletting.

Unexpectedly, the patient does not revive.

Dr. Democrat advises more bloodletting.

Unexpectedly, the patient does not revive.

Dr. Democrat advises bloodletting ...and leaches.

Unexpectedly...

ndspinelli said...

Was it the Palin Bus, Willie Nelson's bus, or just a Greyhound headed for Dubuque?

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Cantor and Kyl could see the handwriting on the wall. Big giant crayons that said, it didn't matter what YOU Republican's want. The Dems on the committee will just NOT stop spending...ever. And when the shit hits the fan, they will find some way to make it YOUR fault.

So they (Cantor and Kyl) basically told the Dems, go fuck yourself. Hang this shit around someone else's neck. Adios suckers.

Hoosier Daddy said...

Republicans throw people under limosines. Buses are for Democrats.

Michael K said...

More people need to look at the historical record on tax revenue and spending. Here is a chart. Look at the center two lines. Blue and orange. Since 1929, the blue revenue line has been right around 20%, with the exception of the Depression, it has been between 15 and 20%.

Please consider the tax rates during those times. It doesn't matter what the tax rate is. The revenue is always about the same unless there is a recession.

Democrats never seem to learn that.

TosaGuy said...

What bus would the Democrat aide be under if he said raise taxes instead of raise revenue?

m stone said...

For once, I agree with Garage.

Jeremy said...

SHOCKING!!!

Republicans screwing their own fellow party members...for political gains???

Why, this is unheard of!

It's SHOCKING, I say!!

ABSOLUTELY SHOCKING!!!

Rialby said...

"Even Republicans aren't stupid enough to not raise the debt limit, they're friends on Wall St will make sure that never happens."

Remind me again... who has "friends" on Wall Street??

Garage, just because you wish it was does not make it so.

Hoosier Daddy said...

Gotta cut Medicare so we have enough money to bomb Libyans and pay off Bambis buddies in Big Union.

Steven said...

Remember:

1) You can't pass a compromise-enough-to-beat-fillibuster Senate budget that includes tax increases and then send it to the House to pressure the House into accepting the tax increases. The Constitution stops you; revenue bills must originate in the House.

2) You can't ram a proposed compromise bill through the House on the basis of Democrats plus defecting Republicans, because the House procedural rules give massive power to the House leadership to keep the bill tied up.

3) You can have the House majority pass a bill and then send it to the Senate, putting pressure on the Senate to pass it or take responsibility for not passing it.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

No debt limit hike!!! Ever.

STOP SPENDING.

There is no reason to default on debt. That won't happen and it is just a scare tactic.

STOP SPENDING.!

Cut useless programs. Lay off 10% of the turds that are wasting our money now. Start with 100% of the TSA nazis.

First STOP SPENDING. Then we can talk about revenue.

Until they STOP SPENDING and wasting our money, we will not take anyone in the government or any Republicans seriously. Cut programs. Cut welfare. Cut Social Security. Cut Medicare. Close overseas bases. Close the Dept of Education and EPA.

If the federal government were to shut down its offices for 6 months, I can't see anything that would be an inconvenience to me.

No more compromises.

STOP THE FUCKING SPENDING.

NYTNewYorker said...

Garage you keep talking about pinning Medicare cuts on the GOP but could you please remind me just who it was that pulled $500 Billion out of Medicare, who...?

Jeremy said...

Michael K - Historically, the economy has done better under Democratic Presidents for decades on end.

"According to the paper, entitled, "The Presidential Puzzle: Political Cycles and the Stock Market" and published in the October issue of the Journal of Finance, stock market returns are on average about 5 percent higher when the White House is run by a Democrat than during Republican rule."

AND:

On every major measurement, the Census Bureau report shows that the country lost ground during Bush's two terms. While Bush was in office, the median household income declined, poverty increased, childhood poverty increased even more, and the number of Americans without health insurance spiked. By contrast, the country's condition improved on each of those measures during Bill Clinton's two terms, often substantially.

After all, a recent Time poll showed Americans not only prefer President Obama over Bush by a twenty-point margin, but blame Dubya for the economic disaster 61% to 27%. Last week's Washington Post-ABC survey revealed a staggering 73% have some or no confidence in Republicans' ability to make the right decisions for the country's future. And by a 42% to 34% margin, the public still trusts Democrats to do a better job handling the economy. But the larger truth about the free enterprise system trumpeted by Pete Sessions is this:

When it comes to GDP, employment, the stock market or just about any other measure of the health of American capitalism, the historical record is clear: the economy almost always does better under Democrats.

Jeremy said...

Dust Bunny Queen - Local teabagger economist.

Duh.

*Where were you during the Bush years?

Jeremy said...

Dust Bunny - "If the federal government were to shut down its offices for 6 months, I can't see anything that would be an inconvenience to me."

Well, that's nice...for YOU.

Does anybody else in the country matter?

Apparently not.

Jeremy said...

Corn Cob - Yeah, that Medicare argument really has legs with the teabaggers.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Well, that's nice...for YOU.

Does anybody else in the country matter?

Apparently not.


Nope.

They don't care about me. I don't care about them.

Jeremy said...

Dust Bunny - Spoken like a true teabagger.

Thanks.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Dust Bunny - Spoken like a true teabagger.

Thanks


You're welcome, cocksucker.

Of all the people that I don't care about, you probably are at the top, or make that the bottom, of my list.

Jeremy said...

Can I assume most of the teabaggers posting here were high on drugs or sound asleep during the Bush years?

The recession began in December of 2007 and is the basis for the current economic situation..

Read up on it...it's really true.

Jeremy said...

Dust Bunny - I'm hurt. Really hurt.

I thought we were starting to develop a very nice relationship.

Was it all just a dream? Was I just caught up in the excitement of having a real teabagger as my BFF?

Damn.

This is going to hard to shake.

Rialby said...

Jeremy!!! Glad to see you again. I have to assume your local public library let you back in to use their computers after your probation expired for that "incident"? How were you supposed to know that www.ilovehorsecocks.com was a dirty website?

nevadabob said...

"Democrats will suicidally agree to Medicare cuts ... "

Then how can you support a spineless fucker like Barack Obama who would cut Medicare on seniors? What is he a killer or something?

I thought he was for seniors? In their corner? Fighting for them?

Now you're telling me that Barack Obama is going to stab seniors in the back, like some ghetto gangsta, and steal their Medicare-purses?

Gee Garage, you don't seem to have a lot of faith in your side.

Jeremy said...

Could this be the beginning of the Princess Sarah "When the going gets tough...I'm outta here" strategy of politics?

She could never be President, but she could certainly lead the likes of Cantor and Kyl.

Jeremy said...

Rialby - Actually I love libraries.

Ever been to one?

*And it's interesting that you would be familiar with the site you reference.

Dunce.

Rialby said...

"Rialby - Actually I love libraries."

Well, you do need someplace to sleep.

MadisonMan said...

I wish someone would throw the phrase thrown under the bus under the bus.

AJ Lynch said...

This is great - the Tea Party has put the fear of God into some of the longtime Beltway Repubs.

Next, I will relish when the Dems realize there is no solution to our spending addiction but to eliminate whole Federal depts like Education, Commerce, HUD, etc.

Jeremy said...

Rialby - Tell us why you're so familiar with the site you reference.

Dummy.

mariner said...

nevadabob,

Isn't it strange that when Senator Kyl dropped out of these talks ABCNews allegedly (if you're stupid enough to believe them) immediately went to go find a Democrat to get a talking point.

Well stated.

Reading what Kyl and Cantor had to say makes a lot more sense: they bailed out of the phony "negotiation" when Democrats refused to negotiate.

nevadabob said...

"Dust Bunny Queen - Local teabagger economist."

No, more like fed up taxpaying citizen tired of leaches.

I've stopped voluntarily paying my federal and state income taxes until Tim Geithner is arrested for felony tax evasion.

And I too will vote against ANY REPUBLICAN who votes to raise the debt limit again as long as we're giving Egypt $3 billion a year and funding the NEA and NPR Democrat Party propaganda machine.

I'm MAD AS HELL.

And I'm not going to PAY any more.

mariner said...

cubanbob @ 4:23,

Exactly!

Maybe the Tea Party wing of the party can furnish a spine transplant for the leadership, since we know they won't stand up for us on their own.

nevadabob said...

John Boehner: "Let me be clear. Tax hikes are off the table."

That sounds pretty firm for a guy ABCNEws claims with no evidence just got run over by a bus.

See, Democrats have forgotten that they're not in charge any more. That they don't set the agenda and they don't control the debate. We're not going to talk about tax hikes. Period. End of line.

Now ... if you want to talk about a debt ceiling increase, tell us what you're cutting to get the deficit to a management level. Otherwise, we have nothing to talk about because we're not ever going to vote for tax hikes as long as Barack Obama is the President.

That's not some secret under-the-table hidden agenda. That's our fucking POLITICAL PLATFORM. Obama gets not one more fucking red cent.

Freeman Hunt said...

I wish someone would throw the phrase thrown under the bus under the bus.

Same.

New phrasing is needed. There could be "cast off" as a milder rhetorical form consistent with the New Civility. Or something like "shot in the face" if one wanted to embrace edginess and polarization.

Freeman Hunt said...

The quote that is the title of this post is silly. What a bizarre interpretation of events.

deborah said...

lol DBQ

I like 'throw under the bus.'

Jeremy said...

nevadabob - Sound asleep during those Bush years, huh?

This ALL happened when that nasty Obama got elected.

Everything was just fine...

Bullshit.

PETER V. BELLA said...

Wrong. Democrats are just trying to justify an unjustifiable tax increase.

If you are going to cut costs why is there any need to raise taxes. It makes no sense unless you are a Democrat. Remember Democrat arithmetic- 5-3=7.

nevadabob said...

"When the going gets tough...I'm outta here"

When the talk turns to tax increases, you can start circle jerking yourselves.

Because we're not voting for tax increases while Barack Obama is the President and we're certainly not going to waste our time on that.

So piss off.

Good luck running the government with no funding authority.

Look Jeremy ... it can be easy, or it can be hard. But your guys are going to come to our position. All the way over.

Period.

Otherwise, we have nothing to talk about and good luck, sir.

Raising taxes KILLS JOBS. Taking capital out of the Americans' pockets and wasting it on foreign aid to Egypt KILLS JOBS here.

No Republican can be even seen discussing such a thing because if they do that they are ending their political career. It's SUICIDE to even think about it; much less talk about it.

That's called: Message discipline.

Did you get the message yet? The window has moved.

Seeing Red said...

The dems r gonna agree to more than $500 billion in Medicare cuts??? Isn't that the amount in obamacare or were they too cowardly to pass that?

Phil 3:14 said...

Hmmm, reminds me of healthcare reform in the early Senate discussions. Max Baucus was in on that one too.

cubanbob said...

garage mahal said...
Even Republicans aren't stupid enough to not raise the debt limit, they're friends on Wall St will make sure that never happens. It's all kabuki. I bet the deal is mostly already done.

Democrats will suicidally agree to Medicare cuts when Paul Ryan and his voucher plan is radioactive nationwide. Republicans will blame Dems and beat them over the head for cutting Medicare.

Obama will blame Republicans.

Both side's donors will get what they want.

The End.

6/23/11 4:31 PM

Hate to burst your bubble but the markets wouldn't care. No increase in the debt ceiling simply means the government runs on a cash basis and only funds what it wants to until it balances expenditures with revenues. All Congress has to do is make sure the bonds get paid and contractual debts are paid. That is all the markets care about. Entitlements and pensions hate to burst your bubble again are not binding on the government, they can and do have the right to change, amend or end them at anytime. So sayeth the Warren SCOTUS in 1960. If anything freezing the spending levels to the revenue levels as long as the bondholders and contractors get paid will boost the dollar. Its the borrowing that spooks the investors. Soon they are going to want Greek style interest rates to keep on lending. We are out of money so the cuts are going to happen. Better now than later. But either way the cuts will happen.

Obama and the democrat communist will always blame Bush and the republicans but after two and half years of boy wonder and his merry band of idiots No.One.Will.Give. A. Fuck. On. Whom. Obama.Blames. He is now perceived as a whinny little bitch.

And by the way, social security, medicare and medicaid are financed by a separate line item revenue source, you may have heard of it. Its called the payroll tax. While expenditures exceed revenues for those programs they are not at the moment so out of whack that a roll back to that of 2005 levels except for the poorest of the beneficiaries would not balance out spending and revenue for those programs. Its the general fund spending that will get by far the largest cuts. The republicans are not that stupid. And the taxpayers to your horror make not Give. A. Shit if LBJ programs are slashed. Preferable to cut those programs that suffer a tax hike.

Jeremy said...

The national debt grew by more than $4 trillion during George W. Bush's presidency.

Oh, and the debt ceiling was raised...SEVEN TIMES.

By a Republican congress.

*Not that that would matter to the teabaggers who spend their lives bitching and whining about everything Obama.

nevadabob said...

"nevadabob - Sound asleep during those Bush years, huh? This ALL happened when that nasty Obama got elected."

Jeremy, George W. Bush did not invade Libya. George Bush isn't wasting $10 million a month on a war of choice killing brown people without UN authorization. George W. Bush didn't put 30,000 extra troops in Afghanistan.

Barack Obama did that.

Do we need NPR? Not want it, mind you. Do we NEED it? No, we don't NEED it. It's a luxury. So let's shut down NPR ... just until the crisis is overcome then we can start it back up again when we have the money.

Do we need federal arts funding? Is it an absolute necessity? No. But if you try to engage Demorats in stopping - JUST TEMPORARILY - funding arts while there is a crisis they won't even discuss it.

Do we NEED to give Egypt $3 billion tax dollars taken from average Joe Americans? No, we'd like to do that. It would be nice to do that. But we do not NEED to do that right now.

Democrats don't even want to talk about ending UNNECESSARY SPENDING even temporarily during this economic crisis.

So, you go run the government best you can with what you got because that's all you're fucking getting.

ANY Republican tries to make a deal with Democrats and Barack Obama to raise taxes is OUT OF OUR FUCKING POLITICAL PARTY.

End of story, pal.

We're made as hell. And we're not paying any more.

Jeremy said...

nevadabob - "When the talk turns to tax increases, you can start circle jerking yourselves."

Reagan raised taxes at least five times.

Federal taxes are actually at their lowest levels in 60 years.

And the wealthiest and their taxes?

The average federal income tax rate was 17 percent, down from 26 percent in 1992.

*And much of that is on capital gains, which is 15%.

You're full of shit.

Jeremy said...

nevada dolt - "Jeremy, George W. Bush did not invade Libya."

Nor did Obama.

But we all know who got us into Iraq and Afghanistan.

Duh.

Carol_Herman said...

The best news I've heard all day. The stupid party rids themselves of Boehner and McConnell.

Yeah. There's a need to cut.

And, sometimes the best places to look at places that are occupied at the table. Like HUD. The department of education. NLRB. The pentagon. That's the easy part.

The hard part is removing the clinging hooks attached to the politicians. Who never do an honest days work in all their lives.

Has weiner's resignation letter arrived, yet?

nevadabob said...

"The national debt grew by more than $4 trillion during George W. Bush's presidency."

Yes, but that was on stuff we all agreed to.

You see, George W. Bush went to the Congress and got permission from THE PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES to spend this money.

We were OK with it. Still are in fact. But now, times are tougher. Now, we need to reign in our spending. Any family working with a budget understands that.

There's a time for using the credit card; and there's a time for putting the credit card down and paying her off.

Now is that time.

So your protestations are really comical.

Barack Obama has made it clear that he intends to make wars and waste our money without allowing us to vote.

Not going to happen.

Not on our watch.

PETER V. BELLA said...

The Dems are mad because they cannot punish anyone. The belive the tax system is to be used to punish people instead of raise money to run government.

They also believe it is to be used in fake wealth redistribution scams.

Lower all taxes to one rate and one bracket. Eliminate the estate tax, the capital gains tax, corporate tax, the AMT, and all the various tax exemptions and deductions.

Businesses should be taxed on their profits only.

15% personal tax and 20% business tax would be fair.

Jeremy said...

nevadabob - You need to start reading more and posting insane teabagger bullshit less.

Eliminating NPR or arts funding or 3 billion to the Saudis is a drop in the bucket.

The two wars cost us over a trillion already.

Get your head out of your ass.

nevadabob said...

"Has Weiner's resignation letter arrived, yet?"

Yes, Carol. Here's a copy of it.

Curious George said...

"Jeremy said...

The national debt grew by more than $4 trillion during George W. Bush's presidency.

Oh, and the debt ceiling was raised...SEVEN TIMES.

By a Republican congress."

*Not that that would matter to the teabaggers who spend their lives bitching and whining about everything Obama. "

Haha...it does matter to the Tea Party, and you've seen the evidence of that last November. Conservatives were unhappy and made it known...but this is the same old bullshit argument. Lefties point out the spendthrift ways under Bush but forget to add that they ever wanted it or WANTED MORE! Deficits under W versus Obama is well the difference between rough sex and prison rape. The Democrats didn't pass a budget in 2010 because of the election, kew they would look bad...in the end it didn't matter.

garage mahal said...

Hate to burst your bubble but the markets wouldn't care.

Anyone that truly believes this ought to be committed. It's pure fucking madness.

Jeremy said...

Petey - The average federal income tax rate for all taxpayers has declined to 9.3 percent from 9.9 percent.

There are breaks for having children, paying a mortgage, going to college and even for paying other taxes. Plus, the top rate on capital gains is only 15 percent.

There are so many breaks that 45 percent of U.S. households will pay no federal income tax for 2010.

cubanbob said...

mariner said...
cubanbob @ 4:23,

Exactly!

Maybe the Tea Party wing of the party can furnish a spine transplant for the leadership, since we know they won't stand up for us on their own.

6/23/11 5:11 PM

Last week I was present at a fund raiser for the leadership. A small crowd but a very wealthy crowd (I was by far the poorest one there). The consensus was no more RINOs. I do believe they are getting the message that if they don't man up they won't have to worry about the general because they won't get past the primary.

nevadabob said...

Eliminating NPR or arts funding or 3 billion to the Saudis is a drop in the bucket.

Then why can't your guys agree to START there?

See, Democrats are fond of saying we shouldn't cut this or we shouldn't cut that because "that's just a drop in the bucket."

So none of it ever gets cut.

That strategy is too transparent. Americans know now about that strategy. That's why it doesn't work any more. Americans have figured you out.

We are not going to pay more in taxes UNTIL you DO AWAY with the wasteful spending FIRST.

See?

No new taxes until all these other drops in the bucket are FUCKING GONE.

So the quicker we get rid of these inconsequential programs of no real import the better.

Right?

We're MAD AS HELL and we're NOT GOING TO PAY ANY MORE.

Jeremy said...

Curious George - I'm referring to the teabagger who post here on a regular basis..most of whom evidently don't read or even know what it is they're against.

As for Obama's deficits or debt...it ALL started with little Georgie and you know it. And most of the debt via Obama has been created to right the ship...which you also know, but don't have the balls to admit.

The recession kicked in in December of 2007...and to get things rolling...Georgie signed a fat 700 billion dollar bank bailout on the way out the door.

Where were YOU and others here when it started and he signed the bill?

Oh, I forgot...it's ALL Obama's fault.

Seeing Red said...

Lolol Jeremys comparing the end of the cold war & we r doomed y2 k spending w/the trillion dollar hit we took on 9/11????

We r lucky we lasted this long.

And he trots out no health INS?



Lololol

and the other excuses?

nevadabob said...

"Anyone that truly believes this ought to be committed. It's pure fucking madness."

Garage, you're not seriously advancing the argument that unless there is a debt limit increase we can't pay off our T-bills.

Are you?

Wall Street knows such a talking point is POLITICAL. That it would never happen.

Goldman Sachs bought Barack Obama to prevent that very thing from ever having any chance of occurring.

They own them a black President.

So don't you worry about default little buddy. The fix is in.

Jeremy said...

Seeing Red - "Lolol Jeremys comparing the end of the cold war & we r doomed y2 k spending w/the trillion dollar hit we took on 9/11???? And he trots out no health INS?"

What the fuck are you blathering about?

The cold war, Y2K, 9/11...and health insurance?

Are you drunk or just stupid?

Sigivald said...

Nevadabob: Too easy.

There's always some scandal that makes people "question the timing", isn't there?

And of course that's not going to distract anyone, so why even try?

Not buying it.

Jeremy said...

nevada - "They own them a black President."

And once again...we can't go one day on this site without racism rearing its ugly head.

nevadabob said...

"And most of the debt via Obama has been created to right the ship."

How do you spend your way out of a $1.7 trillion deficit, Jeremy?

Tell us.

Dying to know how that works.

Jeremy said...

I notice the fact that Bush raised the debt ceiling SEVEN TIMES hasn't had much traction here.

Didn't count back then, huh?

Only now.

nevadabob said...

"... we can't go one day on this site without racism rearing its ugly head."

The billionaire bankers at Goldman Sachs were Obama's top donor. They bought him. They own him. He is doing whatever Goldman tells him to do.

He's their modern day slave.

Slaves come in many colors and it's racist to suggest that only black people have ever been slaves.

You should read your history book closer.

edutcher said...

Jeremy said...

SHOCKING!!!

Republicans screwing their own fellow party members...for political gains???

Why, this is unheard of!

It's SHOCKING, I say!!

ABSOLUTELY SHOCKING!!!


No, it's the Demos screwing the country for political gain.

(didn't Mr Jeremy tell Mrs Jeremy dropping the boy on his head once a day was a bad idea?)

Michael K - Historically, the economy has done better under Democratic Presidents for decades on end.

That's because the preceding Republican Administration had spent all its time fixing the mess the previous Democrat Administration had caused.

At which point the sitting Democrat Administration went back to lousing up the economy again.

garage mahal said...

Wall Street knows such a talking point is POLITICAL. That it would never happen.

Not raising the debt limit would never happen. It's all theater you idiot. Publicly saying "we won't raise the debt limit until we get our cuts!" is for rubes like you. The resulting economic calamity and anarchy that would insue would probably suit you just fine, but the bankers will NEVER let that happen.

nevadabob said...

"I notice the fact that Bush raised the debt ceiling SEVEN TIMES hasn't had much traction here. Didn't count back then, huh?"

Jeremy, you aren't listening. We were richer then. GDP lots higher. We could afford it then. We can't afford it now. Pretty simple really.

How much simpler do I have to make it for you?

Look ... when you're making good money and growing, you can afford more debt. Any household on a budget knows this. That's why its so easy for Americans to understand this issue. They can relate it to their own lives.

But when you're not taking in as much money, you have to cut down on your credit cards. Everyone does ... even Democrats!

Makes total sense to everyone but you, Jeremy.

We are not going to BORROW MONEY to pay for NPR, or the NEA, or to give the Egyptians $3 billion a year. Because that's wasteful and not necessary in these trying economic times. Maybe one day we can start spending on luxuries again, but today we can't afford it.

Doesn't matter if we could afford it IN THE PAST. We can NO LONGER afford it. See, things changed. The economy isn't what it used to be. Pretty simple really.

Time to tighten our belts.

Simple economics, dude.

To keep borrowing in the face of this economic calamity before us would be asinine. Just like it would be asinine for someone to keep running up the credit card after they lost their job.

So, doesn't matter what Bush did. You can keep the "Blame Bush" game going if you want. Polls have shown that to be a loser for Obama so I'm happy to hear you guys have nothing else.

PETER V. BELLA said...

"And once again...we can't go one day on this site without racism rearing its ugly head."

Jeremy, lad, you may have forgotten the day you gleefully, cheerfully, and willingly used the word n@##$r several times on this site.

The day I slapped you silly and Althouse got pissed.

nevadabob said...

"The resulting economic calamity and anarchy that would insue would probably suit you just fine, but the bankers will NEVER let that happen."

Tell us more about these secret bankers coughweknowyoumeanthosedirtyJewscough that control everything and stage Kabuki for us plebes, Garage.

I'm intrigued by your theories. Is there a way for me to subscribe to your newsletter.

Freeman Hunt said...

A visual problem with the overuse of "threw x under the bus" phrase is that it read "the bus" not "a bus," and so when it is so often used one can't help but picture some gore encrusted bus somewhere bouncing over the bodies of the politically inconvenient.

Ralph L said...

I think the GOP should pass all the tax increases the Democrats want for 2011 and 2012 ONLY, with rate reductions after that--and pin the dingleberried tail on the Donkey everyday until the 2012 election.

Give them what they want--good and hard. Let the resulting recession be on them.

Jeremy said...

Petey - You are a bald-faced liar.

Link me to what you say I posted.

You're full of shit and you know it, too.

Jeremy said...

Ralph - "Give them what they want--good and hard Let the resulting recession be on them."

The "resulting recession??"

What the fuck do you think G.W. and Company left behind?

December 2007...that was the start.

Duh.

Jason (the commenter) said...

Freeman Hunt: ...and so when it is so often used one can't help but picture some gore encrusted bus somewhere bouncing over the bodies of the politically inconvenient.

You're doing a terrible job of dissuading us from using that term. I wonder where this bus is, and if they need a driver, or if I can buy a ticket.

AprilApple said...

"So Bush's record on deficit spending was not good at all: During his presidency, the national debt rose by an average of $607 billion a year. How does that compare to Obama? During Obama's presidency to date, the national debt has risen by an average of $1.723 trillion a year — or by a jaw-dropping $1.116 trillion more, per year, than it rose even under Bush."

NPR news.

Old Dad said...

Baby Lefty is panicking, holding his breath, and stamping his Buster Browns. Bad Daddy is going to cut up his credit card. What to do, what to do? "I won't stop spending," he pouts. Bad Daddy cuts up the card. What then?

Baby lefty thinks, "well I could make the minimum payments, and, oh hell, there goes my grande lattes. I won't, I won't, I won't."

Later...Bad Daddy calls Baby Lefty, "Son, we're cutting you off for good. We took a vote, and you're out. You're selfish and irresponsible and dangerous. Grandma will lose her condo, and we'll all make do. She's taking your room. If you pull your head out of your ass, you can have the couch in the basement."

Much Love,
Bad Daddy

Seeing Red said...

12/07





Queen Nancy holds the checkbook & her cohort in crime actually put a budget together.

When did they raise the minimum wage again?

Matt said...

End the Bush tax cuts and you're getting closer. The cuts have done nothing. By comparison Clinton raised taxes and balanced the budget. Few complained.

Phil 3:14 said...

First STOP SPENDING. Then we can talk about revenue.

All Republicans should say this over and over and over and over......

And we they say "You're the party of 'No'! Give us some practical solutions"

Point to Ryan

And we they say "Radical, radical, 'old people should just die' " etc.

Say:
First STOP SPENDING. Then we can talk about revenue over and over and over and over....

Phil 3:14 said...

shorter version of my comment:

Greece

nevadabob said...

BREAKING NEWS

Delta Airlines bans Jews from certain flights.

nevadabob said...

End the Bush tax cuts and you're getting closer.

The Bush Tax Cuts ended in 2009. On December 17, 2010 Barack Obama replaced the "Bush Tax Cuts" with the "Obama Tax Cuts" by signing the Tax Relief, Unemployment Insurance Reauthorization and Job Creation Act of 2010.

There is no such thing as the "Bush Tax Cuts" any more. They're the "Obama Tax Cuts."

Quit trying to blame George W. Bush for everything.

Bush didn't sign the Tax Relief, Unemployment Insurance Reauthorization and Job Creation Act of 2010.

Barack Obama did.

nevadabob said...

BREAKING NEWS!

USA Today, under pressure from a major advertiser, moved their story on Delta Airlines denying Jews the right to fly on certain of their flights.

Matt said...

AprilApple

The national debt - Obama vs Bush. It is not as simple as you make it sound. Read this link. There is plenty of blame to go around. The question is what is the government's role in an economic crisis.

Both Bush and Obama agreed to do bailouts and stimulus. I think it was probably a good idea not to let the auto industry and the banking industry tank. But that's an opinion.

Seeing Red said...

Lol Jeremy

just pointing out what I lived thru

since I'm still out of power this may be a repeat but osama bin laden put us over there u lefties never want to admit that

or Ross perots charts of yes they said they'd pay down the debt but spent $2 for every $1 they raised who held the ckeckbook?


Anyone?

Buehler??


Quite inconvenient for u I know like pointing out Greenspan said irrational exhuberance in the mid90s & thought that no one should earn more than 6% on investments.


U can't seriously suggest the 2000 recession was w? Or all that y2k spending to get everything up to snuff didn't affect anything? Smart money got out in 99.

btw osama bin laden got us into Afghanistan &
r

nevadabob said...

Delta Airlines: Homosexuals can still fly to Mecca to get stoned to death by their code-share partners. As long as they're not dirty, dirty Jews.

Matt said...

nevadabob

You're half right. Yes, they are Obama's tax cuts now. However if Obama would veto the tax cuts for the rich [which were designed by Bush] we would be half-way there. The other 'cuts' you speak of are very small and actually put money in the pocket of the middle class and working class - which is exactly where we need it.

So I am not blaming Bush directly. Obama was dumb to extend the Bush tax cuts. They are a large part of the deficit. The GOP doesn't much care though about the deficit - except when a Democrat is in office.

garage mahal said...

All Republicans should say this over and over and over and over......

They do. When Democrats are in office. When they are in office they break the bank with spending, and when there's none left after they get booted out, say we have to cut spending. On Democratic policies.

Michael K said...

Jeremy, "According to the paper, entitled, "The Presidential Puzzle: Political Cycles and the Stock Market" and published in the October issue of the Journal of Finance, stock market returns are on average about 5 percent higher when the White House is run by a Democrat than during Republican rule."


One, the stock market is not the country. The stock market likes money spent by government. The public has to pay those taxes.

Two, The Clinton economy was a BUBBLE ! It collapsed as Bush took office and Greenspan spent the next eight years trying to reinflate. That's how we got the housing bubble. I am no fan of the Bush presidency, either of them, for that matter.

The Republicans , until Reagan, were the "tax collectors for the welfare state." The Democrats would go on a spree and the Republicans would raise taxes to pay for it. Reagan ended that and gave us a twenty year boom. Clinton was part of that and it ended as the internet bubble popped.

The last genuine Republican administration was Harding-Coolidge who ended the 1919-1921 depression in six months and gave us an eight year era of real prosperity, contrary to the left's propaganda.

Michael K said...

Jeremy said...
Corn Cob - Yeah, that Medicare argument really has legs with the teabaggers.


Jeremy, I thought you were a serious commenter when I responded to you. I won't make that mistake again.

Peano said...

A Senior Democratic aide says, “Cantor and Kyl just threw Boehner and McConnell under the bus. This move is an admission that there will be a need for revenues and Cantor and Kyl don't want to be the ones to make that deal.”

Alternative reading: There is no “need” to raise taxes. If Democrats insist on doing so, we (Cantor and Kyl) aren't going play along. If Boehner and McConnell choose to hurl themselves under that particular bus, let them. The majority of Americans oppose higher taxes, and we stand with them, not with the Obamacrats.

Sounds a lot different if you phrase it that way, now, don't it?

nevadabob said...

"When Democrats are in office. When they are in office they break the bank with spending, and when there's none left after they get booted out, say we have to cut spending. On Democratic policies."

Boo fucking hoo, dude. There is no money. Or haven't you been paying attention?

There's a $1.7 trillion ANNUAL Democrat budget deficit. And we're not letting you run up our over-limit credit card.

So, deal with it. Stop fucking whinging and deal with it.

Matt said...

nevadabob

I think we all have to deal with it. But the point is pretty obvious; Republicans are rather blase about deficits until a Democrat is in office.

I'm just hoping both sides can find a compromise because that is the only way this thing will get done. Cantor needs to understand that he needs to take a step toward the center because a far right plan is not on the table. [Neither is a far left one.]

End the wars, end the tax cuts for the wealty, make some cuts and adjustments to social spending and raise taxes to the levels they were under Clinton - when [again] few complained.

Fred4Pres said...

Bullshit. Bus hit and runs are an Obama tactic. This was a trap, plain and simple. Cantor and Kyl, and Boehner and McConnell refused to go into it. And the Dems are upset they did not fall for their bait.

Analysis.

bagoh20 said...

"Republicans are rather blase about deficits until a Democrat is in office."

Althouse, you magnificent bastard!

Phil 3:14 said...

Garage said:

All Republicans should say this over and over and over and over......

They do. When Democrats are in office. When they are in office they break the bank with spending, and when there's none left after they get booted out, say we have to cut spending. On Democratic policies.


I stand corrected from Garage. Let me fix it:

First STOP SPENDING. Then we can talk about revenue.

All Democrats and Republicans should say this over and over and over and over......


There you go Garage. I'm glad we agree on that one.

nevadabob said...

Republicans are rather blase about deficits until a Democrat is in office. I'm just hoping both sides can find a compromise because that is the only way this thing will get done.

I think that's a bunch of horseshit. There is simply no comparison between a deficit of $600 billion a year during wartime and Barack Obama's $1.7 trillion yearly budgets.

No comparison.

But the past is beside the point. In the past, we could afford to do things that we CAN NO LONGER afford.

And yet Democrats want to spend money on NPR, NEA, sending money overseas to other people, etc., etc., etc. It never ends. This is LUXURY spending that must STOP COMPLETELY before we continue to borrow money.

ANY REPUBLICAN starts to make moves toward conspiring with Democrats to raise taxes or borrow more in the face of this economic calamity is signing their political death warrant.

You do not SPEND your way out of an economic crisis and it's about time the Democrat Party accepts this truism.

garage mahal said...

Phil, I'm sure we can agree on some spending cuts, but not others. Biggest crisis this country faces right now is jobs. For all the hoopla in Wisconsin about "we're broke!" and "cutting spending" bullshit, our budget is 1 billion more than the last one. Handing more tax breaks over to corporations and wealthy investors already sitting on tons of cash but not fucking hiring. We can't have 10% unemployment long term in this country, and as far as I can see there are virtually no Republican ideas at the moment that creates any jobs whatsover. If the private sector can't or won't create enough jobs to go around, the government must. So, I think we're fucked.

Jim said...

1) Democrats can shut up about raising the debt limit - including Jeremy. When it came time to raise the debt limit under Bush (since that's Jeremy's favorite time), Democrats REPEATEDLY refused to vote to increase it. Now that the shoe is on the other foot, somehow it's Republicans who are fault for just following in their footsteps. Obama himself voted against raising the debt limit when he had the chance. So he doesn't have a leg to stand on.

2) Republicans should pass a bill in the House requiring that the Treasury department must pay interest on the debt first followed by defense, social security and medicare. All other spending must be cut proportionally across the board in the event that the debt limit is not raised. The Senate would never pass it and Obama would not sign it, but it would 100% insulate Republicans against the fallout from refusal to raise the debt limit. They could simply point out at every opportunity that THEY did what needed to be done to make sure that the US didn't default, but that the Democrats generally (and Obama specifically) have CHOSEN to default on the debt.

3) Following passage of the bill, let Democrats argue that holding out for increased taxes was more important than defaulting on our debt. At that point, they would own any ensuing default lock, stock and barrel.

nevadabob said...

"If the private sector can't or won't create enough jobs to go around, the government must."

With who's money, exactly? Are you fucking kidding me, dude? You said this? Out loud?

Barack Obama has killed investment in jobs by telling entrepreneurs that he intends to redistribute their wealth to a bunch of layabouts.

What the fuck did he THINK the response was going to be?

You're a fucking economic moron if you think that the government creates jobs. It can DESTROY jobs, but it cannot create them.

The government destroys jobs by TAKING money from entrepreneurs and giving it to other people who did not earn it and do not deserve it.

Barack Obama has created economic turmoil in this country and those chickens are now coming home to roost just in time for the election.

So naturally, folks like you are panicked, Garage. Don't worry little buddy. We understand how concerned you are about your boy.

Don't worry your little head over it dude.

We got this.

Your boy is history.

Jim said...

So, I think we're fucked.

As Obama continues governing like a rabbit on the run from a hound: zig-zagging randomly, hopping, leaping and changing directions in a desperate attempt to get re-relected, then you're absolutely right.

You could create jobs tomorrow by repealing ObamaCare, all the EPA regulations enacted since January 1, 2009 and returning to a more stable and predictable business environment.

But that's not what you REALLY want. You want all those things to stay AND jobs. But you can't have them. You have to choose. I choose getting rid of the above. You choose keeping them.

You made your bed now lie in it.

Michael K said...

Has anyone else noticed how some topics bring out the lefties with invective and lots of ad hominem. Why ? It's about taxes and economics.

At least garage seems genuinely puzzled.

as far as I can see there are virtually no Republican ideas at the moment that creates any jobs whatsover. If the private sector can't or won't create enough jobs to go around, the government must. So, I think we're fucked.

Government must invent jobs (create is a worse term-it almost sounds like creationism). OK Here is a suggestion. I got it from Obama's ATM comment.

Let's do away with earth moving equipment and build infrastructure like the Chinese built airfields in WWII. We could get rid of taxis and go to rickshaws.

These bullet trains are very expensive so why not go to wagon trains. Millions could be put to work digging holes and other millions filling them in. Roosevelt solved the unemployment problem with World War II.

Republicans have another approach that appears to be incomprehensible to Democrats. First, you ask businessmen, not hedge fund operators, what would make their lives easier and help them to make money. You don't say on TV that you want to "spread the money around" or agree with a guy who says you are going to raise his taxes if he can save enough to buy his own business.

In a debate, you don't answer a question on capital gains tax policy by saying you will raise the rates even if it loses money.

You don't attack a company that spends $2 billion building a factory that will employ 2,000 people. You don't promise to bankrupt coal companies and freeze oil drilling permits while you drain the national petroleum reserve intended for war.

I know those are difficult concepts. You are more of the "floggings will continue until morale improves" school of job creation. Still, that why we have two political parties.

Michael K said...

Hey, a great example just popped up !

Lay off bus drivers and buy new hybrid SUVs for bureaucrats ! What could be better ? Democrat job creation in action.

nevadabob said...

"You want all those things to stay AND jobs. But you can't have them. You have to choose."

Yes. This.

Barack Obama cannot on the one hand tell entrepreneurs that he is going to confiscate their wealth and redistribute it to people who didn't earn it and don't deserve it, and on the other hand expect people to just lay back and accept their rape.

Smart people respond. They react. They act to protect their families, to protect their property and to protect the fruits of their hard work. Some fucking Chicago home boy gonna come steal their shit and hand it out down the hood? Not fucking likely.

It's sickening that Americans feel the need to protect their families from their own fucking President, but here we are.

And if you think we're going to let you run up OUR FUCKING CREDIT CARD you got another think coming, dude.

Seeing Red said...

Guess what I found out today?


That u can be rich and collect folders ps.

That there r only 49 people who monitor food stamp fraud fornthe entie country.


That we send us employees to other countries tonlook at their billboards to see how they did their billboards?



We can cut sooo much.

Seeing Red said...

How about more history?

The wall fell a few years before I lived under my first republican house of representatives.

They were that scared of rr we got tax reform.


Spent $2 for evey dollar raised in taxes.


Green jobs/ will not save us now

We had the tech boom in the 90s.


Bubba was the vacation decade

Vacation is over

Seeing Red said...

How about more history?

The wall fell a few years before I lived under my first republican house of representatives.

They were that scared of rr we got tax reform.


Spent $2 for evey dollar raised in taxes.


Green jobs/ will not save us now

We had the tech boom in the 90s.


Bubba was the vacation decade

Vacation is over

Seeing Red said...

Food stamps. Yeesh. Sorry

txrxqa said...

Jeremy said...

"On every major measurement, the Census Bureau report shows that the country lost ground during Bush's two terms. While Bush was in office, the median household income declined, poverty increased, childhood poverty increased even more, and the number of Americans without health insurance spiked. "

9-11

Do you know what that did to the economy at that time (and the years to follow)?

"Economic effects arising from the September 11 attacks"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_effects_arising_from_the_September_11_attacks

"WSJ (9/11) Column: The Post-9/11 Economy"
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1699737/posts

It's like - some of you (kids maybe?) didn't live through that period ...

_Jim

nevadabob said...

Americans are fed up being stolen from by Barack Obama and his band of redistributinoist brothers. And they're not going to take it any more.

Michael K said...

"On every major measurement, the Census Bureau report shows that the country lost ground during Bush's two terms.

Except unemployment. Bush's "jobless recovery" had 5% unemployment. Sounds pretty good now, doesn't it ?

bagoh20 said...

I run a very small business, and in California, no less, but even I hired 20 new people this year alone. I create jobs.

Give me a call, Mr. President, I can help you, because you really don't know what you're doing.

Chip Ahoy said...

That's a very good idea. I'm for it.

⊘ Dropped under the bus

✓ Shoved in front of the M1 Abrams tank
✓ Ejected from the Lockheed HAA at altitude
✓ Shot at with a 10 second burst from the GAU-8 Avenger
✓ Kicked off the airboat in St. Augustine Alligator Farm
✓ Dropped into the industrial wood chipper
✓ Lifted into the junkyard car crusher
✓ Run through Mitsuyuki Ikeda's synthetic meat machine
✓ Laid in front of the asphalt paver
✓ Shoved into the carbonite freezing chamber
✓ Tripped in front of the stampeding elephant herd
✓ Carried off by the pet pterodactyl
✓ Dragged off by the Deep Sea Submersible

reader_iam said...

Who gives a shit about Cantor and Kyl? I don't give a shit about Boehner and McConnell either, thrown/dragged/self-put under the bus or what-the-hell ever. None of those people matter when it gets right down to it.

It's every-family-for-itself time, push now coming down to shove, and that is what people determined to be self-sufficient do. They do what they have to do. They go wherever, re-calibrate however, re-tool in whatever way necessary and pay whatever price necessary to get/keep that ship where it needs to bne.

What they do NOT do, push come to shove, is rely on on any politician, whatever type of politician, much less any political movement, whatever type of political movement. Above all, they do NOT waste vast amounts of time paying attention to commenter-activists/ twitter-activists/ really-any-kind-of-political-activists-with-too-much-time-for-online-activism types.

Telling, the too-much-time thing.

Mike said...

Oh I don't know about throwing Boehner and McConnell under the bus--a nice piece of Democrat spin.

What I'd say is that Cantor and Kyl threw Sheriff Joe Biden under the bus--because they're tired of Obama sending a boy to do a man's work. As for the Biden-Reid-Pelosi troika--don't make me laugh.

Jeremy said...

Matt - "End the Bush tax cuts and you're getting closer. The cuts have done nothing. By comparison Clinton raised taxes and balanced the budget. Few complained."

You're trying to get these teabagger fools to actually look back at what worked?

This is ALL about Obama.

Period.

Jeremy said...

Michael - "Except unemployment. Bush's "jobless recovery" had 5% unemployment. Sounds pretty good now, doesn't it ?"

The unemployment rate was at 7.6 the day Georgie walked and at 8.2 three weeks later.

Read more...post bullshit less.

Jeremy said...

Whine and bitch...the credo of the teabagging fools who live and die to denigrate the President.

No real suggestions other than cutting taxes...taxes that are 60 year lows...just complain about anything the President says or proposes.

Well, get used to it...he'll be President for another 5 years.

I love it...

reader_iam said...

I'll wait to hear what Cantor's and Kyl's people have to say about this, but I'd guess it's the return of, "We won."

That so-called "win" on a fundamental level is bullshit--not because the "win" is bullshit, but because the very conversation is fundamentally irrelevant. Watching gladiators thrust about in an amphitheater might be considered fine entertainment, but at ground it's a distraction.

What, you don't think so? Revisit history, then.

In the end, it's what I already said.

nevadabob said...

"Well, get used to it...he'll be President for another 5 years."

17% underemployment, he should count himself lucky he gets to the end of one term.

Big Mike said...

Sorry I'm late to the party, but my cable modem crashed and burned. (More or less literally.)

I'm surprised that it took this long for Cantor and Kyl to throw in the towel. I doubt the Dumbocrats ever were serious about cutting any spending. Props to Cantor and Kyl for trying to find sane Dumbocrats, but when the best the Dumbocrats can do for leadership is Joseph Biden, well I guess that about speaks for itself.

I suspect that most people would agree to go along with Clintonian tax rates (with varying degrees of reluctance, of course) if we could get back to Clinton-levels of spending. But with the likes of Barack Obama, Joe Biden, Harry Reid, and the far left lunatic fringe Dumbocrats left in the House (like Nancy-I-never-miss-a-botox-shot_Pelosi and Chris van Hole-in-the-head) you'll only get taxes going up, never spending going down.

Know why the Dumbocrats are going to crash down to earth hard in 2012? Because jackasses can't fly with only a left wing.

Big Mike said...

Hey Jeremy, you worthless fool, you. Don't you know you're not supposed to use "denigrate" in the same sentence as "the president."

Shame! SHAME! SHAME!!!

nevadabob said...

"This is ALL about Obama."

That's right. ONLY Obama has said he wants to seize capital from entrepreneurs who produce jobs and then give that money instead to people who haven't earned it and don't deserve it.

ONLY Obama has said that.

So you're right. It's about Obama.

He's not going to be allowed to run up OUR CREDIT CARD buying his friends things they do not need.

It's time to stop trying to spend our way out of deficits and eliminate LUXURY spending that isn't necessary at this time.

We can always bring that spending back LATER, when we can afford it again. But for right NOW, that spending has to cease because there's no more money left.

reader_iam said...

Do you want to know what was the hardest thing I had to learn in online life--which thing it also took me the longest time to learn?

Probably not.

Regards,

reader_iam

Michael K said...

Read more...post bullshit less.

Likewise, old buddy. What party controlled Congress when those numbers were generated ? Remind me.

You poor fool.

Michael K said...

I suspect that most people would agree to go along with Clintonian tax rates (with varying degrees of reluctance, of course) if we could get back to Clinton-levels of spending. But with the likes of Barack Obama, Joe Biden, Harry Reid, and the far left lunatic fringe Dumbocrats left in the House (like Nancy-I-never-miss-a-botox-shot_Pelosi and Chris van Hole-in-the-head) you'll only get taxes going up, never spending going down.

Don't tell Jeremy. He doesn't understand much about economics so this sort of analysis, and a cold drink of water, might kill him.

reader_iam said...

a nice piece of Democrat spin.

Speaking of nice, Mike, how nice that you went for the easy thing; how easy and nice for you to make assumptions.

Your assumptions are wrong.

Jim said...

Jeremy -

Can you remind me again which party had just retaken control of Congress just before the recession began in 2007?

Let's look at the deficit numbers before 2007 and since then...Can you remind me what happened electorally in the fall of 2006 that might have changed the trajectory of federal deficits from falling to dramatically increasing?

Which party had complete control of Congress and the presidency when the biggest deficits in history were rung up in consecutive years?

Which party stood in the way when Bush attempted to reform Fannie and Freddie long before the housing bubble burst?

Oh yeah....That would be Democrats...

Go away before you embarrass yourself further.

PETER V. BELLA said...

Petey - You are a bald-faced liar.

No I am not. You know it is true. Maybe Althouse can find it if she did not delete it. I think she did delete all your n@##$r posts- except the one where I slapped you down.

I believe I said the word n@##$r rolls off your tongue like fine aged semen- or something like that.

Jeremy, we all know being a liberal racist means never having to tell the truth or say you are sorry.

Now go back hit the bong and drink some more.

reader_iam said...

Well. Am I supposed to thank Jeremy for completely overrunning what I had to say or thank everyone else for ignoring what I had to say? Whatever, I guess.

Regardless, we will survive.

And remember.

Old Dad said...

I see Germy is posting way past his bedtime.

Revenant said...

If the private sector can't or won't create enough jobs to go around, the government must.

When you can't find anybody willing to pay you to work, and the government has to step in and give you money and invent something for you to do, that's "welfare", not "job creation".

There's a good case to be made for welfare in bad economic times -- but call it what it is.

reader_iam said...

Rev:

We're living in a time where "chin-up stubborn" on an individual basis has no value. Why, then, would calling welfare "welfare" find any traction, either?

Call me crazy, but I think there's a connection to be found somewhere there.

Steven said...

Historically, the economy has done better under Democratic Presidents for decades on end.

Ah, yes, the famous "The President is omnipotent" theory of government, beloved of men who can't count to 21 without dropping their pants.

Compare instead years where Republicans control a majority of the three policy-making bodies (Presidency, Senate, and House) versus years where Democrats control a majority of the three. Like, say, oh, 1995-2006 versus 2007-today.

I realize it's tempting for a Democrat to ignore the reality that there are three independent powers when it comes to lawmaking. It's hard for a Democratic partisan to refrain from crediting six of the twelve years of Republican-majority prosperity to Clinton. It's similarly tempting for a partisan to blame Bush for the start of the period where an incumbent Democratic majority showed it had no idea how to handle economic trouble.

gerry said...

The lib Dems now must produce a budget that raises taxes.

Heh. Pass the popcorn.

Curious George said...

Jeremy said...

As for Obama's deficits or debt...it ALL started with little Georgie and you know it. And most of the debt via Obama has been created to right the ship...which you also know, but don't have the balls to admit.

I know life is easier when you argue both sides.

But here in reality land, we all know that this is just really puking out the Democratic message of November '10...how'd that work out? And by all accounts it will be the message in '12. Well, throw in the race card too. Because you all can't help doing that.

Prepare for another ass whuppin'

Seeing Red said...

No real suggestions other than cutting taxes.

Utter rot.

E.M. Davis said...

Okay, so back in the day, were we all busy throwing people under the horse and buggy, or the streetcar?

In the future, when we have flying buses, you won't be able to throw anybody under one of those, so we'll have to re-invent the vernacular.

I don't understand why there's not anyone getting thrown under the high-speed train currently.

Phil 3:14 said...

I know this thread is dead but anyway:

Handing more tax breaks over to corporations and wealthy investors already sitting on tons of cash but not fucking hiring. We can't have 10% unemployment long term in this country, and as far as I can see there are virtually no Republican ideas at the moment that creates any jobs whatsover.

Garage maybe one reason they're not hiring is the uncertainly of the economy and the obligation that hiring entails (as you in Wisconsin have learned).

And if I may let me now correct one of your statements:

as far as I can see there are virtually no Republican ideas that I like that creates any jobs whatsover

(or better put, neither Republicans nor Democrats create jobs. Businesses, big and small, create jobs. And their profits and the earnings of their employees pay the taxes that fund the government jobs. So the key question is "What can government do (or not do) that facilitates the success of businesses?")