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"People waved their shoes in defiance,"I tried to think of a snide comment, but I can't improve it.
The reports of Mubarak's demise have been greatly exaggerated.Apparently the Won doesn't have the contingent of SEIU in Cairo that he'd like to have.wv - inessWhat it must be like to be the Won
He didn't get the memo.
NBC/MS-NBC looks a tad uh...duh...what happened? I bet they had their Mubarak Steps Down graphics and bumpers all ready to go.
Yep, I had the same vibe.Talk about major rope a dope.********************************I put this in the last thread, but the BBC had a female Egyptian news journalist reporting that the crowd was marching towards the presidential palace.Her words.The BBC has decided to report that they are moving out of the square.We could find out just exactly where the army stands.
Suleiman speaking now.
Peace in the region for a bit longer perhaps.
Well, the crowds aren't happy. And a committed crowd with a sympathetic army can validate the news reports without Mubarak's approval.
Crossing now, Mubarak will stay until September elections.
What's up with the snark? WTF is wrong with you? It's only people's lives at stake, their dreams of liberty. It's not about Obama or the media. Freaking disgusting snark, that's how you rise to the occasion?Do conservatives only like all that happy claptrap when it's imposed by the American military? People power is so lefty and socialist.
Somebody missed their nap.
and franglo makes this about US political partisanship. That's sad. And ironic. Anyhoo, a guy on AlJazeera is saying the speech galvanizes the revolution and that there's going to be massive revolts starting tomorrow. "One of the most violent we've seen" he says, if the army chooses to oppose the people. AlJazeera doesn't think the people of Egypt are going to be patient.
Of course, then this guy now blames Washington and Tel-Aviv for Mubarak not letting go of power.
"Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak announces he is passing authority to vice president Omar Suleiman but will remain in office until September elections."What does it mean to remain in office but pass on your authority?
John Bradley was doing the commentary.AlJazeera really is a good source of this. Variety of perspectives and good images.
Hosni is a tough Egyptian dude. As VP he took over when the Muslim Brotherhood murdered President Assad for negotiating a peace treaty with Israel. He has kept them at bay for 30 years now. Just because Iran and Obama want him removed to better pressure Israel into a bad agreement concerning UN control over Jerusalem doesn't scare old Hosni one bit.
"What does it mean to remain in office but pass on your authority?"Putin is probably a good person to ask.
There's some slim logic in waiting until September. Anything done now will embolden the military and/or the Islamists, who are far more organized at this point and more likely to fill any void.So the administration has some time perhaps to effect a better outcome. Not holding my breath however.
I can't get the vid portion of Al Jazeera to load.The translator at ABC had Mubarak saying that he was passing some of his authority to Suleiman.
MSNBC ... all the news that's just flat wrong.
People waved their shoes in defianceI read waved as waxed and ..in defiance.. and well, my mind is in the gutter anyway.
More evidence that neither our leaders nor the news media understand Egypt.One reason why became obvious as I listened the translations of the speech on CNN, Fox and CNBC on satellite radio in my car.The translations were incoherent. One translator finally said "oh, no" as he completely mangled paragraph after paragraph. A woman translator said "I forget, I lost my place" and then just stopped talking for a while.
TG SADAT caught MB bulletsMeiyou gwansi
The only thing that I want to hear from Mubarak, is that he wants obama to step down for the good of the country.
Should he stay or should he go? Mubarak rocks the casbah.
Mubarak was watching Dreamgirls to pass the time until his speech, and when he heard "And I Am Telling You I'm Not Going" he took it as a sign from Allah to stay in office till September.
There should be a dictator rehabilitation program that they can go into. Baby Doc, the little Ils of N. Korea, Mugabe, and others, they can all bathe together, and shout at virtual reality figures on computer screens or something, and force cartoon characters to do their bidding.Mubarak has lots of good company.There are probably more evil leaders than good ones, if you counted up the world's 193 leaders.But the worst have to be the Ils of N. Korea.
On Drudge: CIA Panetta Confused....Of course this man has no business running the CIA.None, he's just a reliable yes man and that is right up Obamas alley.
I declined to link to the reports earlier today that said he was stepping down.Me, I don't even acknowledge he exists. Take that, Hosni.
Why would anyone ever believe anything they heard on the news.They just make shit up.The only thing worse than a journalist is a lawyer.
There's something unsettling about realizing that I know more about the current Egyptian crisis and the players involved than the entire Obama Administration combined.
What's up with the snark? WTF is wrong with you? It's only people's lives at stake, their dreams of liberty. It's not about Obama or the media. Freaking disgusting snark, that's how you rise to the occasion?Do conservatives only like all that happy claptrap when it's imposed by the American military? People power is so lefty and socialist.You seem to presuppose that the results of regime change would be better than the status quo. While that is sometimes true, often it is not.A lot of people have long enough memories to remember what happened a bit over 30 years ago in Iran. An idealistic President of this country cut our long term ally lose there, in preference to the clerically led opposition that was pretending to be democratic. And, do you remember what happened? Do I need to remind you which country is close to possessing nuclear weapons? Provides almost all of the weapons being used against Israel, including thousands of missiles? Throwing Mulbarak out might make things better in the middle east and in Egypt. But what are the chances? What are the chances that the Muslim Brotherhood, if they gained power there, as seems likely right now, would maintain the weapons blockade of Gaza? Indeed, what are the chances that they don't go fairly full-scale theocracy? And, who would protect the Christians right if any of this happened? (And, keep in mind that the Christians were there some 600 years before the Moslems were). BTW, one of the most humorous quotes yesterday was of an Administration security expert claiming that the Muslim Brotherhood was secular. Oh, and that they had nothing to do with al Quaeda, the Taliban, etc.
Yeah, instead Jerry Sloan is stepping down.
The guy who sells me coffee in the morning knows more than the Obama Administration.
Egypt will explode.
What's up with the snark? WTF is wrong with you? It's only people's lives at stake, their dreams of liberty. Probably has something to do with the fact that outside of Israel, there isn't a ME nation that has anything approaching what is commonly recognized as 'liberty'.
On the other hand, I wonder if Mubarak saw what happened to Ceausescu and figured that stuff only happens to commies.
Former Egyptian Military and Intelligence officers on AlJazeera are enraged. They're saying that pretty much Mubarak had two choices, to let tonight be a celebratory goodbye party by the crowd or for him to be forcefully removed. Lots of commentators are saying Mubarak sounds crazy, psychotic, schizophrenic, etc. and were implying that army leaders would use Mubarak's "poor health" (especially mentally) as a reason to take him down. It's just commentary, but it really does sound like everyone was happy being patient until now, but now they see him as probably never willingly letting go.
Former Egyptian Military and Intelligence officers on AlJazeera are enraged.It's possible the military is split.Mubarak would almost certainly have the Air Force.Check out his history at wiki:Early life and the Egyptian Air ForceMubarak was born on May 4, 1928, in Kafr-El-Meselha, Monufia Governorate, Egypt. Upon completion of high school, he joined the Egyptian Military Academy, where he received a Bachelor's degree in Military Sciences in 1949. On February 2, 1949, Mubarak left the Military Academy and joined the Air Force Academy, gaining his commission as a pilot officer on March 13, 1950 and eventually receiving a Bachelor's Degree in Aviation Sciences. Hosni Mubarak is married to Suzanne Mubarak, and has two sons: Alaa and Gamal.As an Egyptian Air Force officer, Mubarak served in various formations and units, including two years when he served in a Spitfire fighter squadron. Some time in the 1950s, he returned to the Air Force Academy, this time as an instructor, remaining there until early 1959. From February 1959 to June 1961, Mubarak undertook further training in the Soviet Union, attending a Soviet pilot training school in Moscow and another at Kant Air Base, near Bishkek in Kyrgyzstan (then a Soviet republic), an airfield that is today home to the Russian 5th Air Army's 999th Air Base.Mubarak undertook training on the Ilyushin Il-28 and Tupolev Tu-16 jet bomber, and then joined the Frunze Military Academy in 1964. On his return to Egypt, Mubarak served in wing and then base commander appointments, taking up command of the Cairo West Air Base in October 1966 before briefly commanding the Beni Suef Air Base. In November 1967 Mubarak became the Air Force Academy's commander and two years later he became Chief of Staff for the Egyptian Air Force.Mubarak became Commander of the Air Force and Egyptian Deputy Minister of Defence in 1972. In the following year his military career reached its pinnacle when he was promoted to air chief marshal in recognition of service during the October War of 1973. Mubarak has been credited in some publications for Egypt's initial strong performance in the 1973 war against Israel.Watched jets buzzing the square a couple of days ago-pretty chilling.I would think Mubarak would have made sure that he had significant military backing before making his-I am Egypt speech.
I don't mind the MSM getting it wrong (kinda used to it, frankly), but when Obama whiffs as he did with his "change is gonna come" announcement this afternoon, that makes me worry. Pipe down, how about, till events you can't control become just a little clearer.
Original Mike wrote:What does it mean to remain in office but pass on your authority?An Omar Sulieman regency?
There's this little matter of the Egyptian Constitution, which says that if the President resigns, the speaker of their parliament becomes President. The Vice President does not succeed the presidentIgnoring the present constitution does not seem to be a great first step towards reforming constitutional government.
Obama: Egyptian President Mubarak must step down now.Mubarak: You first.
Revolutions require blood, sometimes rivers of blood.The Egyptian revolution needs [more] blood.
Good for him. We need some extraordinarily long-lasting dictators for our time.
It takes a helluva nerve for a third cataract guy like Obama to tell a first cataract guy what to do.
Althouse is amused.So, all is well.But there are still a few unanswered questions:What did Althouse think about Mubarak's suit (aka costume)?And, I have no idea how she's resisted commenting on his hair color.
Almost Ali said...Revolutions require blood, sometimes rivers of blood.The Egyptian revolution needs [more] blood.How about you shed yours first, Ali? Get your blood donor pin before they run out.
Poor Mubarak. Nobody listens to him.He transfered his powers to the VP rather than resigning to avoid having the speaker of the parliament become president. The speaker apparently is the Joe Biden of Egypt. Once the CIA explains this to Obama, Obama will be more sympathetic to Mubarak's predicament.
I think it is actually rather interesting. If you are Mubarak, why let the false story stay out there for hours while a large mob assembles. Why not just say, uh, nope, not going, and stop the crowds?Fox claimed his stepping down had been confirmed by "sources." Did these sources float the story to pressure him to step down? Still, why not shoot it down when he hears of it.My pet theory is that he was planning on stepping down and was working on an exit strategy that would give him safe passage, his money (or some of it) and a guarantee not to be turned over for a trial. When he couldn't get that, he backed off and stuck his thumb in the "outsider's" eye. No "fact" backs me on this, but it makes sense of the day.
Looking at his wicki Mubarak has smarts and he's been at the wheel a long time, maybe he has more moves.
So, the big O couldn't dictate to M.Didn't O flash his Nobel prize and point out the arrows in the claw of his presidential bird? What's this world coming to when the big O can't place a quick "presidential" phone call at halftime and cause a world leaders to tremble in their shoes?
"when Obama whiffs as he did with his "change is gonna come" announcement this afternoon, that makes me worry."Eh, he had a 50-50 chance of being right.If Mubarack had resigned, Obama could have leached on to take the credit ... which he'll do eventually anyway no matter what happens.1) Mubarack stays ... Obama has prevented the Muslim Terrorist Brotherhood from claiming another country.2) Mubarak goes ... Obama spreads "democracy" long enough to get to 2012 before the terrorist airplanes start crashing into our buildings.Either way, Barack Obama wins.And that's all they really care about ... how Obama can use the blood of the 250 people Mubarak has murdered to win re-election in 2012.
It was more than a little counterintuitive to think he was going to go that quickly. I think this is going to be a process of weeks where you see a gradual - Mubarak-Suleiman(nobody wants him to be in the top spot including him)-whomever the Army picks as a caretaker, and then the Army is going to see if it's a good idea to hold elections.The two things I noticed are that Mubarak basically told The Zero to pound sand and the Administration has even less of a clue than the most anti-Zero of us could imagine - witness one James Clapper. That guy is scary.
Hillary Clinton has really been a beacon through all of this,eh?
Hillary Clinton has really been a beacon through all of this,eh?C'mon, you're being too hard. It's not like she is Secretary of State or anything. D'OH!
ricpic is good for knowing about the cataracts. I know about them because I used to teach 6th grade world history.
I knew it. I declined to link to the reports earlier today that said he was stepping down. He will step down when he steps down and not when the news media fall over each other trying to pre-scoop the news.So Ann, are you saying he is not stepping down or was going to step down and now is not stepping down to show he is his own man? Essentially our observation of Mubarak is impacting the outcome of his actions. Is Mubarak actually Schrödinger's cat?
Mubarak wants to hold on until election day. The key is convincing the rebels that there will be no retribution against them if they go home and wait for the elections. In short, can they trust the Army?
Here's the key question: Why is NBC still protecting the sources who fed it inaccurate information about Mubarak's impending resignation.I could certainly understand how the network might want to protect the two sources it claimed it had who they claim told them that Mubarak would resign.But that didn't happen. The sources lied to them.So why is NBC protecting them still? Why would the network want or need to protect sources that feed them disinformation?Or maybe there were never two sources at all. Maybe NBC was just lying. Maybe they were put up to it by the White House.That's the most plausible explanation in the face of their continued protection of their "alleged" sources.I really don't think they ever had any sources and the fact that the story was absolutely wrong is very strong evidence that they never had any actual sources. Secondly, they refuse to even now reveal those sources ... another very strong indication that they never had any real sources.Not sure we can trust NBC to be honest about their reporting.
Fred,I think he was in a definite state regardless of our observation. He's in the state of denile.
BTW, as an adjunct, I also taught for the University of Maryland, Central Texas College, and Greenville Technical College. 6th grade teachers are not necessarily more stupid than college teachers. Just less arrogant.
"He's in the state of denile."Barack Obama has been totally punk'd by NBC. I mean he looks like he doesn't have a clue and doesn't know what he's doing. Where the hell Leon Panetta?Let's remember who runs NBC: Jeff Immelt. Barack Obama just appointed Immelt to his Council on Jobs and Competitiveness. Immelt (NBC Head Honcho) is part of the Obama Administration.I mean, you just can't make this up.Not very competitive, that NBC, though. They were scooped by Hosni Mubarak - who doesn't even pretend to play a journalist on TV.Obama has been so embarrassed by the debacle that he can't even give an on-camera statement.He's been reduced to giving a written statement ... according to NBC.That's pathetic."We've got to work this carefully," a U.S. official told NBC. "Now we've got to get this just right."Ya, vewy, vewy carefully, indeed.
ken in sc,6th grade teachers are not necessarily more stupid than college teachers. Just less arrogant.But would either step down when demanded?
So, the word now is pretty much agreed on the fact that the crowd will be marching on the presidential palace tomorrow, in order to remove Mubarak. The question will be if the army, tomorrow, shoots on the protesters or if they will turn on the president. All the interviews of the people in the streets pretty much suggests there's no turning back. With Tunisia and now Egypt, it seems like maybe the ME is in the midst of what happened in Eastern Europe in the late 80s and early 90s. They have the sound of people who are tired of totalitarianism.
I really think Obama needs to learn that you do not conduct diplomacy on TV. That's pretty basic but beyond him, I fear.
Hillary Clinton has really been a beacon through all of this,eh?No doubt. She should have.....well you know!
I was doubtful.Aren't announcements that you are stepping down as dictator done from outside of the country (after you have left, or at least as you are boarding the plane)?
Obama has now called for his immediate overthrow. Not in precise words but that was the message. The only force in Egypt that can do this is the army.Thus Obama has called for a military coup in our closest ally in the Arab world."Sow the wind . . . . . . "
Well, Obama has done one brilliant thing. Having Hillary on charge of the clusterfrick that is his foreign policy is killing her whole "competence" claim.He may be terrible...but he is dragging her down nicely.
Thus Obama has called for a military coup in our closest ally in the Arab world.Yeah, it worked out great when we supported the coup against Ngo Dinh Diem. Cause he was such a tyrant and all...
Mubarak said in his speech that he was an Egyptian war hero.. When Obama heard the translation he said.. 'Dude, who cares? I beat John McCain bitch'.
According to the latest reports he has left Cairo so your smug assumptions seem premature. His speech was pathetic cheap nationalism, who could stand him after that? Ha.
As usual, the MSM does not get it. Here is a better take on the situation from the WSJ:http://on.wsj.com/htpaxT
Yeah, it worked out great when we supported the coup against Ngo Dinh Diem. Cause he was such a tyrant and all... +1
"With Tunisia and now Egypt, it seems like maybe the ME is in the midst of what happened in Eastern Europe in the late 80s and early 90s. They have the sound of people who are tired of totalitarianism." If that's the case, Paddy, it's not gonna be pretty. There were civil wars, super extremes of wealth and poverty that still exists. And Mid-Easterners will not be calm about their dissapointment if that happens.And what about Tunisia? Here's an example and a taste for what's next for Egypt:http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/02/11/us-italy-migrants-tunisia-idUSTRE71A3T920110211
I guess the last laugh is on you!Ha
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