October 1, 2008

"Indecent gestures, filthy remarks, and repeated praise of a non-Muslim lady wearing a short skirt."

Pakistani clerics issue a fatwa against President Asif Ali Zardari for complimenting Sarah Palin. (He said: "Now I know why the whole of America is crazy about you.")

And the feminists are pissed too. "As a Pakistani and as a woman, it was shameful and unacceptable. He was looking upon her merely as a woman and not as a politician in her own right.... He should show some decorum... he should behave like a mourning widower...."

Well, it was sexist, of course.

63 comments:

Peter V. Bella said...

The feminists are pissed? The same feminists who decried, denigrated, and debased Palin? Those feminists?

Ann Althouse said...

Pakistani feminists.

Kylos said...

No, the Pakistani feminists. I don't recall much opposition to Palin from those quarters.

erniecu73 said...

I'm writing those clerics to see if they'll write a fatwa against michael for astrotrolling.

Peter V. Bella said...

My mistake. Red face.

Michael_H said...

Pakstani feminists? Oxymoron.

Are they the feminists who aren't allowed to drive or attend university? The feminists who may not leave their dwellings unless escorted by a male? Those feminists?

How in God's name is this even a story? Or was it published in The Onion?

1jpb said...

In his defense; I don't think he took a second look at a her (as is bad for Muslims)--he just had a really, really long first look.

erniecu73 said...

Michael_H, Pakistan's history is a mixed bag on women's issues. These are feminists that indeed have to fight for their rights.

Pogo said...

American feminists are too concerned about the right to abortion as contraception to worry over Pakistani feminists concerned about honor killings as subjugation.

Lorelei Leigh said...

Pakstani feminists? Oxymoron.

Are they the feminists who aren't allowed to drive or attend university? The feminists who may not leave their dwellings unless escorted by a male? Those feminists?


So because they are denied their rights by the government, they can't be called feminists? I'm sorry, but that makes no sense at all. I'm more inclined to respect their feminist credentials because for them it's about fighting for their rights, rights women here in the U.S. take for granted.

Jim said...

Any word on their reaction to The One (PBUH) calling a reporterette "sweetie"?

Meade said...

Now we know why the whole blogosphere is crazy about you.

Oligonicella said...

I dunno, my daughter seems pleased whenever someone pays her a compliment on her brain, her kids, her looks... whatever. It's a compliment.

But reading the article, we find he told her she was gorgeous and said he understood "why the whole of America is crazy about you."

Gotta say, I can really tell he was oozing sexism there.

Ruth Anne Adams said...

She's not fatwa. She's just lactating.

Ron said...

Those clerics better be careful; Palin will have moose airlifted there! Amuck they will run!

Meade said...

"She's not fatwa. She's just lactating."

Yeah well, it's still an oxytosin.

Donn said...

I'm writing those clerics to see if they'll write a fatwa against michael for astrotrolling.

Good one!

LoafingOaf said...

I saw an American feminist - Ralph Nader - go off on Bill Maher's "raw sexism" for calling Palin a "bimbo" on Maher's HBO show last weekend.

Verso said...

Ann Althouse, trying to teach her wingnut audience about the reality of sexism.

I guess there is one small advantage to the garden of lunatics you're cultivating here in your little community, Ann: you can appeal to their natural Republican feelings of victimization and get them to embrace notions of feminism which they've rejected all their lives.

Who even 2 months ago could have imagined ultraconservatives complaining about gender bias and celebrating teenage pregnancy.

I guess you're proving every day that even conservatives can mature. Slowly, and in very narrow terms, but hey, if you can teach a severely autistic or retarded person to keep a job at Kmart, you can teach a wingnut to find more nuanced expression for his inner feelings of victimhood.

Simon said...

Echo Lorelei.

In any event, wen did respecting a woman and noting her attractiveness become mutually opposed propositions, and what does it say about the view of marriage held by such people? You presumably think your spouse is attractive - that mean you don't respect them?

Well, maybe in Pakistan...

LoafingOaf said...

I've not called Palin a bimbo, but I see no basis to respect her as a VP candidate. Did Althouse catch Couric's queston to her about other Supreme Court cases she disagrees with? She didn't know a goddamn thing.

What DOES she know a goddamn thing about? I can't tell.

LoafingOaf said...

All you had to say, Palin, was KELO. You'd have won votes! These interviews don't have to be so hard........

JAL said...

Remember Benazir Bhutto?

Radcliff and Oxford educated.

Assasinated last year at age 50 while campaigning ...

Pakistan does have feminists.

Zardari was her husband.

LoafingOaf said...

Everyone's gotten sick of Palin's glasses, btw.

Donn said...

Verso said:
Yada Yada Yada.

Yawn.

Meade said...

"Indecent gestures, filthy remarks, and repeated praise of a non-Muslim lady wearing a short skirt."

When I first saw that title, I thought, whad'ya know -titus is back!

LoafingOaf said...

Do you think Sarah Palin's sleeping well tonight, on the eve of her Vice Presidential debate? Or is she burning the midnight oil, cramming?

Yikes!

Buckle up!!!!

Donn said...

Hey LO,

I don't know if you saw my answer, but last night I posted a link of a paper I wrote on the 9th Court thingy we were discussing.

Michael said...

I think this would have blown over if she hadn't blown him.

Michael said...

"Who even 2 months ago could have imagined ultraconservatives complaining about gender bias and celebrating teenage pregnancy."

Boy is that the truth.

Try to imagine Obama announcing his unwed teenage daughter being pregnant...and saying it was just FINE with him.

People here would literally EXPLODE with indignation over such a horrible, horrible lack of good parenting.

*And I can't even imagine the racial aspects of the attacks.

Michael said...

Michael_H said..."Pakstani feminists? Oxymoron. Are they the feminists who aren't allowed to drive or attend university?"

Actually Pakistani women CAN drive, they have jobs, they've had a woman prime minister, and they have women in their Parliament.

Are you the same idiot who thinks gays "choose" to be gay??

Michael said...

Donn said..."Yawn."

Do you ever actually address any comment with a reasonable or even semi-intellectual response?

Did you attend high school?

Michael said...

"Indecent poll numbers, plummeting trust - and a short-lived popularity:

Skepticism about Sarah Palin has soared since she entered the national political stage, with six in 10 Americans now doubting her qualifications for office and fewer than half convinced of her grasp of complex issues.

Palin now looks more like a drag than a boost to the GOP ticket:

Thirty-two percent of registered voters say her selection makes them less likely to support John McCain for president, up from 19 percent last month.

Her basic ratings are weaker still.

Just 35 percent say Palin has the experience it takes to serve effectively as president, down a dozen points since early September.

60 percent think not, up 15. And just 46 percent think Palin "understands complex issues," while 49 percent think she doesn't -- a poor assessment on this most basic qualification.

Biden's ratings starkly contrast Palin's: Seventy-five percent say he understands complex issues, 70 percent say he has suitable experience to take over as president if necessary and just 13 percent say his selection makes them less apt to support Barack Obama.

Eric said...

"Who even 2 months ago could have imagined ultraconservatives complaining about gender bias and celebrating teenage pregnancy."

I don't know if pointing out hypocrisy is the same thing as complaining about gender bias. Apparently the Democrats think women are too stupid to realize you can throw a group of people some legislative baubles without actually respecting them. Who knows? Maybe they're right.

Also, there is a big difference between "celebrating" and "accepting" the fact people will make mistakes.

Rose said...

I don't see it as sexist. he was married to a strong assertive attractive amazing woman. He is not one of those men who is intimidated by such women, and a compliment is just that.

Eric said...

Well, it was sexist, of course.

This is the country, remember, where local courts have in recent years handed out gang-rape as punishment for offenses of honor. I'm not sure how an inappropriate compliment rates on that scale.

Michael said...

Eric said..."Also, there is a big difference between "celebrating" and "accepting" the fact people will make mistakes.

What crock.

Are you saying that if Obama announced his unwed teenage daughter was pregnant...and said it was just FINE with him, that he and Michelle were just "accepting" it.

YOU would be voicing this same opinion?

We BOTH know exactly what YOU would be saying.

Eric said...

Are you saying that if Obama announced his unwed teenage daughter was pregnant...and said it was just FINE with him, that he and Michelle were just "accepting" it.

We BOTH know exactly what YOU would be saying.


As usual, you know nothing. You understand neither social conservatives (which I'm not) nor me. Do you really think conservatives respond to unwanted pregnancy by flaying their children in public?

Jim said...

Michael has his prejudices about conservatives: reality has very little to do with his world. The same goes for Loafing Oaf and the other Palin-haters.

That's what happens when you're blogging from your mother's basement. It takes actually getting out into the real world to understand that conservatives are not now, nor have they ever been, anything like the misogynistic, race-baiting, hate-filled people that Michael, Alpha and their ideological compatriots have revealed themselves to be ever since Palin's nomination.

Their criticisms of Palin are never of her ideology: they're personal. They want to try to destroy her personally like their Dear Leader instructed them to.

Just look to their posts in this thread alone: they repeat lies that have long since been disproven, they attack her personally, her family...but never a word about the policies.

Axelrod knows he can't win on the issues, so he sends out his flunkies like Michael and his friends to engage in the "politics of personal destruction" instead.

Who knows, maybe enough of America is ignorant enough to fall for this kind of garbage and Obama actually has a shot at winning...but it doesn't mean that they're actually fooling anyone here, or that anything they say deserves serious consideration.

jdeeripper said...

LoafingOaf said...I've not called Palin a bimbo, but I see no basis to respect her as a VP candidate. Did Althouse catch Couric's queston to her about other Supreme Court cases she disagrees with? She didn't know a goddamn thing.

I don't know why Sarah is having so many problems in these interviews.

She was unable to recall HER OWN COMMENTS about Exxon Shipping v. Baker from June of this year.

She clearly knows about this Supreme Court case and disagrees with it.

jdeeripper said...

Michael said...Try to imagine Obama announcing his unwed teenage daughter being pregnant...and saying it was just FINE with him.

People here would literally EXPLODE with indignation over such a horrible, horrible lack of good parenting.

*And I can't even imagine the racial aspects of the attacks.


Obama was born to a teenage mother who married a married with children black Muslim.

And she was impregnated by him when she was 17 and he was 24.The marriage barely lasted a year.

Yet this has not played a role in the Republican strategy against Obama.

I'm waiting for all these terrifying racial attacks on Obama about his racist anti-White, anti-American radical left wing mother and his adulterous, drunken Marxist father.

I don't think it's gonna happen.

Hoosier Daddy said...

Pakistani clerics issue a fatwa against President Asif Ali Zardari for complimenting Sarah Palin. (He said: "Now I know why the whole of America is crazy about you.")

Ah yes the religion of peace yet again showing the world that they're still living in the 11th century.

But the real ones to worry about are those evangelical Christians that Bill Maher thinks are so bad to society.

rhhardin said...

Women issuing fatwas is modern feminism.

goesh said...

Pakistani feminists - I can't believe anyone, anywhere actually put that in print! Last I heard, there really were 16 of them in all of Pakistan, the others that could have been were married off at age 12 and must now stay at home pregnant.

Pogo said...

Liberal feminists in the US have found it impossible to reconcile their two competing leftist ideals:
feminism vs. multicultural relativism

As a result, honor killings are ignored as a feminist issue even within the US and Canada.
Why?
Cognitive dissonance-induced guilt.
And -primarily- fear.

Better to stick with pummeling the GOP on abortion rights. There is far less to fear from the GOP than from Muslim men.

Donn said...

HD:
Ah yes the religion of peace yet again showing the world that they're still living in the 11th century.

But the real ones to worry about are those evangelical Christians that Bill Maher thinks are so bad to society.


Isn't that the truth!

erniecu73 said...

No fatwa against michael and his 4 other personalities yet? Darn...

Apathetic Citizen said...

"When arrested the first time in 1990, after Bhutto was first dismissed as prime minister, Zardari was accused of tying a remote-controlled bomb to the leg of a U.K.-based Pakistani businessman, Murtaza Bukhari, and sending him into a bank to withdraw money from his account for a payoff he had been avoiding. In 1993, when Bhutto regained power, Zardari was plucked out of prison to be made the minister in charge of government investments (i.e., contracts).

No sooner was Bhutto deposed the second time than Zardari was charged with the murder of Mir Murtaza Bhutto, his wife's influential brother, who was expected to play the role of PPP leader. After the execution of their father Zulfikar Ali Bhutto by military dictator President Zia ul-Haq in 1979, Murtaza Bhutto fled to communist-controlled Afghanistan. From there and later in Middle Eastern capitals, Murtaza Bhutto mounted an insurgency against Pakistan's military regime, then won elections from exile in 1993, became a provincial legislator, came home -- only to be shot dead.

Benazir's other brother, Shahnawaz, was also politically active -- and was found dead of poisoning in his French Riviera apartment in 1985."

Pakistan has 42 nuclear-capable ballistic missiles that can be launched within 7 to 10 minutes and can fly as far as 3,000 kilometers. It has other nuclear bombs which it can deliver using F-16s. Pakistan also operates a fleet of French-made submarines that can launch ballistic missiles with nuclear warheads.

Pakistan does not abide by the no-first-use doctrine of use of nuclear weapons.

Simon said...

Michael said...
"Skepticism about Sarah Palin has soared since she entered the national political stage, with six in 10 Americans now doubting her qualifications for office and fewer than half convinced of her grasp of complex issues."

Given constant and relentlessly hostile media coverage, hardly surprising.

Still, given recent poll numbers, one is rather left to wonder what on Earth is going on in America's heads. They cannot be seriously entertaining the prospect of electing Obama, surely.

MadisonMan said...

Well, it was sexist, of course.

Depending on what you mean by it, I might agree with you.

jdeeripper said...

Hoosier Daddy said...But the real ones to worry about are those evangelical Christians that Bill Maher thinks are so bad to society.

Right. And that's what lead to 9-11. America's never ending racist fascination with White Christian Devils in the hills with GUNS!!!

They're coming to get Bill Maher and the other liberal Hollywood Jews, the gays, the abortionists, the ear-ring boys, the blacks, the foreigners....

Let's get back to the good ole days when David Koresh outside Waco and Randy Weaver in backwoods Idaho were what we all had to worry about.

Creationists and Bible thumpers in No-Wheres-Ville, USA are the real threat to this country and the world.

That is until another 9-11 forces us back into reality.

goesh said...

The good thing about polls is they allow a large number of people the opportunity to shop at Wal-Mart intead of voting, once the jingoism they subscribe to puts their Esteemed One in such comfortable lead....clutch and hug them Chinese T-shirts, baby, clutch and hug! You're smokin' that bitch and lump jawed man by a spread of 10!!

Arturius said...

Still, given recent poll numbers, one is rather left to wonder what on Earth is going on in America's heads. They cannot be seriously entertaining the prospect of electing Obama, surely.

Well if he does win, his success was brought on by an unpopular war, an even more unpopular President who has failed about every leadership test thrown at him since 9/11 which all the more emphasized by the near complete abandonment by his own party on a bill he demanded be passed. Toss in the near collapse of the economy and you have what is called a perfect storm.

In fairness with the last 8 years, I think a lot of people have a hard time imagining Obama would be worse. Personally I think an Obama presidency will simply usher in a new era of financial disaster if he actually gets his spending bills passed but perhaps a wake up call is in order.

I'll repeat, neither candidate is up to the task.

Peter V. Bella said...

Simon,
The polls are all bull. They never state specifically who they are polling or from where.

The only poll that matters is in November.

rhhardin said...

Debra Dickerson on Imus slams Palin as hopelessly and shamefully unqualified, supports Obama.

The interview will turn up here as a podcast eventually.

Henry said...

As usual, Ann reaches out to her wingnut audience by ignoring the real crime.

Zardari offered to hug Palin.

I had to go read TPM to find that out.

Now I'm going to post this comment, and rapidly post 4 more with long quotes from Josh Marshall.

vet66 said...

So a hard-line mosque with some radical feminist members complain about Zardari getting a little flirty with Palin? Not much different than smarmy Chirac doing the perp walk up Bush's arm a few years ago.

Get a sense of humor and a life to these zealots who take themselves way to seriously. These radical Islamists in Pakistan would much rather Zardari treat western women, and Pakistani women who try to act like western women, as whores and prostitutes.

Zardari's marriage to Bhutto was arranged so his frame of reference is different just as his culture is different. What really bothers these women is Palin's ability to inspire in others that which they fail to inspire in themselves.

Apathetic Citizen said...

In Pakistan "inflation is at 25 per cent and Pakistan’s present foreign exchange reserves of $5.7 billion are declining at around $1 billion monthly, accompanied by shortages of essential commodities and unprecedented power cuts."

More from the NY Times.....

"Lawyers and businessmen have talked about moving away, particularly to Dubai or Malaysia. Foreign investment had almost dried up before the attack, they said, and now some worried it would disappear altogether. Some of Pakistan’s biggest businessmen had already shipped capital abroad, crimping new business ventures.

Moody’s, the international credit rating agency, cut Pakistan’s credit outlook from “stable” to “negative” on Tuesday, citing dwindling foreign exchange reserves, risks from extremists and high inflation."

There is a substantial likelihood that Pakistan's government and economy will collapse. Completely. A failed state.

erniecu73 said...

Apathetic Citizen, some could argue that Pakistan has been a failed state at least since the 1970s, being propped up at times by all sides of the Cold War.

I recommend this book's chapter in Pakistan, and the book in general...

Apathetic Citizen said...

Looks interesting.

Pakistan reminds me of France in 1789 or Iran in 1978. Feudal state. Peasants. Completely corrupt rulers. Or the US West with marauding tribes.

Of course, the whole place was cobbled together by the British. Maybe it will end up being three or four different countries.

erniecu73 said...

Actually, Pakistan was the creation of the muslim wing of the Indian National Congress which later developed into the Muslim League. They were the ones that demanded partition.

Anonymous Blogger said...

Well, it was sexist, of course.

No. It wasn't.

bleeper said...

Just another example of how liberals and jihadis are on the same side of the spectrum. And they have the same goals - the destruction of the west and the imposition of sharia. Vote for the crypto-muslim and make their wet dreams come true.